William P -- I understand what you're saying. Bob H. actually says that if the mouth moved it might have been caused by his own jaw moving. He says he doesn't recall deliberately moving his jaw. He states that he just doesn't know. He did say that there seemed to be some sort of "mouthpiece" or something there. All of that is very consistent with the head that was used for Patty.
Unless the person putting the mask on your head tells you that he wants you to move your jaw because there is a special hinge in it you would have no way of knowing it even had one. Unless you spent time trying to go over it and look behind the inner layer and see if you can make it move or not. All Heironimus knows is that they stuck a head on him.
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Here is a wider shot of what the inside of that type of mask with a moving jaw looked like.
When BUCK MAFFEI wore the head the jaw would move on its own when he tried to breath. You might notice this if you check out the new Blu Ray version of "Galileo Seven" that will be offered around the time the newest STAR TREK movie comes out. The face is seen when Buck slams a rock down onto the shuttle craft.
GREG LONG interviewed OLIPHANT and MASON about the New York event. MERRITT told Long he was ticked off because they didn't even tell him they were going and he thought he was a partner in the film making part of Roger's productions.
For his part DEATLEY says he spent a week and a half with Patterson and Gimlin in Los Angeles. He says he had to "structure up the deal". About New York he recalls buying a bunch of new clothes for both Patterson and Gimlin and he remembers Patterson going on the JOEY BISHOP SHOW to promote his adventures. Long specifically asks him about Gimlin being dressed up as an Indian at a New York party set up by Oliphant to attract investors. He says his usual line: "I can't recall. I can't say it didn't happen."
It might be possible that DeAtley's wife (Roger's sister) could have kept some photo or something from the New York event (if they took any). It seems that only one single possible investor showed up and the whole thing was a bust. After that Gimlin's wife put her foot down and he no longer showed up. It became the Patterson-DeAtley film show and they never bothered to inform Mason or Merritt of this.
In the spring of '69 FRANK HANSEN admitted to the ROCHESTER POST-BULLETIN that his Iceman was a model made in Hollywood. This put a real crimp in the profits of the Patterson-DeAtley film tour. DeAtley turned his 50% ownership over to Patterson and Patterson went forward with RON OLSON to make future films. DeAtley and Patterson had made what amounts to nearly a million dollars in today's money by that time.
Patterson hired some boys to go out with tape recorders and do interviews for him as he and Olson planned new ventures. But Patterson became too ill and Olson went forward on his own. Dahinden and Gimlin began their lawsuits after the 1975 Olson documentary (which Dahinden had participated in).
The court records may provide documentation that you seek about the contracts and other things. They never asked the question as to whether the film was real or not; only the question of who deserved profits from it.
I do have a copy of Patterson's original contract with VILMA RADFORD that provided the funds for the Patty suit. I can dig that up and post it if you want.
MASON says he spent his own money to edit a 29 minute version of documentary from the footage Roger gave him. DEATLEY says he gave Roger $3600 (*$23,000 in today's money) to pay a cameraman/editor to re-edit their footage with the BBC documentary footage and that became the film they toured with. DeAtley played the part of announcer in the movie and the office of his friend at the Junior College played the part of NORTHWEST RESEARCH HQ.
I think you'll find Long's book informative for the facts it contains. He makes his own opinions known as he goes along and he gets some minor things wrong, but the only serious error is when he added the quick last chapter when PHILLIP MORRIS called him. Morris is wrong about the suit being one of his. Long really did not bother looking much at the film itself so the book isn't about the footage. It's about the guy who made the film and the facts surrounding the film.
Perhaps we can add something of value to that last chapter.
Also, Roger drove to Hollywood often. He and Merritt visited various friends in the entertainment field including GENE VINCENT and ROSS HAGEN (who starred on DAKTARI the hit television show at the time and who worked with Patterson on his Bigfoot song they recorded in Hollywood).
DREW -- After talking to Vulich I agreed that the suit could have been cobbled together from spare parts very quickly. But what about the face?
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When I dressed up that stunt dummy for Halloween I wasn't trying to make a Patty. Just a Bigfoot that wasn't bald (as that had become the norm since Harry and the Hendersons). CHRIS WALAS thought it was hilarious that I had glued together a Tor mask and Wookie lips to make it, but it made a decent Bigfoot. (*btw I noticed that Morris' attempt to recreate Patty simply used a simple Tor mask that was painted grey and had straight cut hair stuck to it. Even I didn't do that and I was just goofing around.)
But in order to make it more Patty-like it would need thicker lips with a philtrum (the little fold on human upper lips not found on apes) and the forehead should be thicker, etc. The main thing was that the nose was too small. Patty's nose was much wider and had a golf-ball looking round tip. I'd never seen a single mask that had all of those qualities. So I went looking....
I tried various DON POST mask combos and found some that would work but it would take some artistic skills to pull off. Patterson had artistic skills and could have done it - yet since the suit showed the techniques that were used in '66-'67 by Wah and his crew I decided to look at their masks too. If the body came from among his people then the mask would have too.
[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/776647e93e77cd1e8.jpg[/qimg] I learned that one mask did have that golf ballish nose and a philtrum. It was molded by Wah Chang himself for an episode of Star Trek. It also had the thicker lips that curved the same way Patty's did.
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I looked for behind-the-scenes photos of it and compared it to Patty. The story involved a planet with primitive giant cavemen who left huge footprints and wore animal skins. They used a wig that was like a pointed cap that fit over the slanted head of the caveman.
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By this time I had already made a wider nose and glued that on top of my Tor mask and I'd filled out the jaw using a rubber piece. I glued some bits of foam to the forehead and painted over that with latex. Still... the upper lip was too short and the lips too thin to match Patty.
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I contacted a Star Trek collector and he got some behind-the-scenes pics for me from one of the original Star Trek producers. Though none had the mask in the exact position of our clearest Patty image, what I saw confirmed what I had discovered. The sharp cheek matched. The wider golfball nose was there. The lips were the same. The philtrum was there. The measurements were the same. The jawline was there. The forehead and ear also matched.
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I obtained even clearer and closer images (as well as images of Wah's original clay sculpture for the face) and I could see something else interesting. A problem with the eyes. Heironimus had said there was a problem when he turned his head. A gap showed. Roger used one of Bob H's fake eyes to hide this. You can see from this close shot that Wah had stuck an extra layer close to the face and painted it black hoping to hide the gap that had developed. Later on a simple touch up would blend the area around the eyes better but there was no time on the day of the Trek shoot to do that.
In that black and white image of my own mask next to Patty I have also used a fake eye in the Right eyehole. The Wah mask is being worn by the gigantic BUCK MAFFEI from CORRIGANVILLE. He worked with Wah, Chambers and Janos on projects as well.
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If you look at the wide nostrils of Patty you'll see they match. When I made my stunt dummy into a Bigfoot I simply took the mask out of the hoodie that came with the Wookie hair suit and put it over the head of my Tor mask. Only later (quite by accident) did I notice that when I laid the typical hood that comes with all ape suits onto my Tor mask I got a little line around the skull.
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I could shift the hood around on the head and found that I could duplicate the same line around the head that Patty shows by rolling it under and sticking it down. Then I noticed that the wig cap used by Wah on Star Trek for his mask fit on its head in the same way.
If anyone cleaned up the Wah head and painted it gray, then added glued-on hair and a hair hood - it would be Patty. Period. No way around it. Amazingly, this same group of creature fx artists that are credited with having made Patty for Roger used the techniques found in both Patty and their various monster suits. For them to have access to this head AND also just happen to build monster suits using the same pad and hair methods as seen on Patty is just too much coincidence.
[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_776647e94765c9723.gif[/qimg] Yes. The "Hollywood Rumor Mill" is correct. It was Chambers and the guys working with him that cobbled this thing together from spare creature suit parts. Just as they were doing on LOST IN SPACE/VOYAGE TO THE BOTTOM OF THE SEA and STAR TREK at the time. And just as Vulich and the guys did sometimes to save time on BUFFY.
Chambers and Janos told the story they were supposed to say in public. Chambers said the same thing about having worked for the CIA on secret missions, "Gosh, I only wish I were that good, but no, I had nothing to do with any of that stuff."
Near the end of his life the CIA gave an award to John Chambers for his work on secret missions for them that stemmed from the Bay of Pigs to later Middle East missions. Actually, he was that good.
I learned that one mask did have that golf ballish nose and a philtrum. It was molded by Wah Chang himself for an episode of Star Trek. It also had the thicker lips that curved the same way Patty's did.
Yes. The "Hollywood Rumor Mill" is correct. It was Chambers and the guys working with him that cobbled this thing together from spare creature suit parts. Just as they were doing on LOST IN SPACE/VOYAGE TO THE BOTTOM OF THE SEA and STAR TREK at the time. And just as Vulich and the guys did sometimes to save time on BUFFY.
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