"Misgendering" is now a federal offense

[Thermal]

"I'll take an exact example of fear mongering mixed with hyperbole for $200, Alex!"

Is anyone even ******* implying anything similar? Has anyone? What was the point of this inane comment? Who takes this seriously?

Also, unisex bathrooms exist as a regularity in almost every civilized country outside the US. Perhaps not the fear mongering scare tactic you thought it was? Do you look under the stall in the bathroom? How many men posing as women have attacked women in the bathroom? Locker rooms? Do we have numbers on that?

Can someone provide an actual list of situations where a man has posed, or claimed to identify, as a woman and actually assaulted a woman?

Please read more carefully. It's not fear mongering at all. I'm trying to get a handle on why some here don't see the reason for sex segregated spaces.

I'm inclined to think there are more pervs running around than actual transpeople, who represent a very small fraction of a percent of the population. So the potentual abuses to the open doors policy are at the very least on my radar. The open door advocates seem to be saying it doesn't matter what biological sex you are, so I'm inviting discussion on that point. Do you understand now?

 

[Manger Douse]

The "study" is from 20+ years ago:

Per my link:
"Comparisons of official MOJ statistics from March / April 2019 (most recent official count of transgender prisoners)"

I requested evidence for sexual assaults by transwomen on women.

Irrelevant to my point about the difficulty or not of sexual predators "coming out" as trans. Don't recall you asking for it either

 

[plague311]

Do you understand now?

You didn't exactly phrase it well, but yes. Have people advocated for open door locker rooms? I see no issues with unisex bathrooms, I have no idea why that would bother anyone, but I assure you someone in this thread will "harumph" about it.

Do I think locker rooms should be separated? Sure, but that's not really a solution. If transgender folk (let us use a man transitioning\identifying as a woman) looks like a woman (this idea that there are bearded men throwing on wigs and **** is ridiculous) then they would assuredly suffer harassment in the males locker room. Then they aren't able to go in the women's locker room, are we just saying "**** 'em"? Do they still have to go into the men's locker room? Even if they have breasts, no body or facial hair and are not easily distinguished from a woman other than having a penis. I will admit it's a complex issue, but I've seen no evidence that transwomen are assaulting women in locker rooms.

Irrelevant to my point about the difficulty or not of sexual predators "coming out" as trans. Don't recall you asking for it either

I've asked for it in the bulk of my posts. I'd say more often than not, actually but I don't care to go back and check.

Violence in prison is kind of an issue everywhere.

 

[Darat]

What has all this got to do with the topic of this thread? This thread is about how misgendering can be bullying behaviour and it being codified in a university's rules.

 

[plague311]

What has all this got to do with the topic of this thread? This thread is about how misgendering can be bullying behaviour and it being codified in a university's rules.

I just assumed this was the inevitable outcome of every thread that has to do with pronouns, etc. They all devolve into this same conversation. I've mentioned it in the last two pages.

 

[Manger Douse]

I've asked for it in the bulk of my posts. I'd say more often than not, actually but I don't care to go back and check.

Still not relevant.

Violence in prison is kind of an issue everywhere.

The statistics I provided were from April 2019, not the 20+ years ago as you claimed as a way to dismiss them and refer to convictions, not "violence in prison" - do you have anything to say about the statistics I actually posted?

 

[plague311]

The statistics I provided were from April 2019, not the 20+ years ago as you claimed as a way to dismiss them and refer to convictions, not "violence in prison" - do you have anything to say about the statistics I actually posted?

Are they relevant to this thread? Then, no, I don't. Take it to the other thread. I don't need a card for going off topic, and as mentioned, this is grossly off topic. Your report isn't even from the US, let alone a college, or related to the college campus debate.

 

[Manger Douse]

I disagree with your use of the word liberal. I know that Americans use the word differently, but it is constantly irritating to hear people who are the polar opposite of liberal in every possible way being described as liberal.

True - we called these people rainbow Nazis in my hunt-sabbing days but if I said that here I'd be getting "What??? You think transwoman are going to march on Poland!!!!??"

 

[Donal]

You obviously haven't seen the videos I've seen that men have posted of themselves in what were previously female safe spaces, bragging about the erection it's giving them.

Assuming this is true, and you haven't provided any evidence it is, are we

1) taking videos on social media at face value?

2) pretending we are all stupid enough to think the plastic sign on the door stops people who want to stalk and sexually assault women from doing so?

 

[Manger Douse]

Are they relevant to this thread? Then, no, I don't. Take it to the other thread. I don't need a card for going off topic, and as mentioned, this is grossly off topic. Your report isn't even from the US, let alone a college, or related to the college campus debate.

The claim was made on this thread that it's difficult for sexual predators to "come out" as trans to gain access to safe spaces. Also, the data is from 2019 and not 20 years ago

 

[Thermal]

What has all this got to do with the topic of this thread? This thread is about how misgendering can be bullying behaviour and it being codified in a university's rules.

Because misgendering, and gender itself, remain undefined with any clarity. If you say your gender is determined by an observers perception of your sex, they are not misgendering you by referring to you as such. If gender is self declared and equivalent to sex (when quite convenient), the locker room door just flew open.

This OP can't even be properly discussed till mis/gendering is defined to everyone's satisfaction, and each side lobbying its case takes us back to the sex segregated spaces for illustration of how robust the argument is.

 

[plague311]

The claim was made on this thread that it's difficult for sexual predators to "come out" as trans to gain access to safe spaces. Also, the data is from 2019 and not 20 years ago

I already ******* acknowledged it was from 2019, Jesus ******* Christ. What do you want me to say? OK MANGER DOUSE THE ******* DATA WAS FROM 2019. It's still not relevant to the ******* thread. So take it to the other one.

Holy ******* ****.

 

[plague311]

Because misgendering, and gender itself, remain undefined with any clarity. If you say your gender is determined by an observers perception of your sex, they are not misgendering you by referring to you as such. If gender is self declared and equivalent to sex (when quite convenient), the locker room door just flew open.

This OP can't even be properly discussed till mis/gendering is defined to everyone's satisfaction, and each side lobbying its case takes us back to the sex segregated spaces for illustration of how robust the argument is.

Then merge it with the other ******* threads like I said in the first few pages and be done with it.

 

[Thermal]

Then merge it with the other ******* threads like I said in the first few pages and be done with it.

Or...and hear me out, here... before the Toxic Avengers come swarming from That Thread, maybe we could actually make some headway on a very interesting subject that gets drowned in the "other ******** threads"?

 

[d4m10n]

Has anyone checked whether "Title IX Regulations expanded to include misgendering, deadnaming, and mispronouning as prohibited acts" yet?

Seems like that would've made news...

 

[theprestige]

Has anyone checked whether "Title IX Regulations expanded to include misgendering, deadnaming, and mispronouning as prohibited acts" yet?

Seems like that would've made news...

Already addressed in the thread.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Has anyone checked whether "Title IX Regulations expanded to include misgendering, deadnaming, and mispronouning as prohibited acts" yet?

WOuldn't that just fall under being a hostile learning environment, like you can have hostile work environment against minority groups.

 

[d4m10n]

WOuldn't that just fall under being a hostile learning environment, like you can have hostile work environment against minority groups.

It would if the regulation is phrased in such as way to include "misgendering, deadnaming, and mispronouning" either explicitly or at least implicitly.

 

[Ziggurat]

Has anyone checked whether "Title IX Regulations expanded to include misgendering, deadnaming, and mispronouning as prohibited acts" yet?

Seems like that would've made news...

Yes, pages ago.

And the new Title IX regulations don't even prohibit using the wrong pronouns. They basically try to skirt around the issue. Seriously, read them yourself.
https://public-inspection.federalregister.gov/2024-07915.pdf

 

[d4m10n]

Thanks! I tried a thread search but somehow this didn't pop.

ETA: They really do skirt around the issue.

Many commenters, as highlighted above, believe that misgendering is one form of sex-based harassment. As discussed throughout this preamble, whether verbal conduct constitutes sex-based harassment is necessarily fact-specific. While the final regulations do not purport to identify all of the circumstances that could constitute sex-based harassment under Title IX, a stray remark, such as a misuse of language, would not constitute harassment under this standard.

See above discussion of Hostile Environment Sex-Based Harassment—Severe or Pervasive (§106.2). Similarly, the Department takes First Amendment concerns seriously, and nothing in the regulations requires or authorizes a recipient to violate anyone’s First Amendment rights. See 34 CFR 106.6(d); see, e.g., W. Va. State Bd. of Educ. v. Barnette, 319 U.S. 624, 642 (1943); Hartop, 992 F.3d at 511 (holding that in the absence of evidence that a professor’s conduct “inhibited Doe’s education or ability to succeed in the classroom,” the conduct was not sufficiently severe and pervasive to implicate Title IX); see also above discussion of Hostile Environment SexBased Harassment—First Amendment Considerations (§ 106.2).​

I'm getting the sense that misgendering will be prohibited if it is "sufficiently severe and pervasive to implicate Title IX" by inhibiting education.