Resolved: Trump Era Republicans Are Uniquely Bad in American Political History

[Cabbage]

It hasn't even been established that the GOP is the getaway driver. Do that first.

You can't possibly be serious, can you? I read that analogy as meaning the GOP is an enabler of Trump. That is undeniable.

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Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: zooterkin

 

[Cabbage]

See, I know how this goes: The OP and others make assertions without backing them up. I make an assertion and get in response: "Citations! Liar! Blah blah!"

No. I make observations to that which is absolutely clear to anyone and everyone paying attention. You, on the other hand, reference some relatively obscure event in recent NC history and end up utterly incapable of providing an unbiased citation of said event.

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Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: zooterkin

 

[xjx388]

Actually, I supported my position by noting the fact that there has never been a major party that espouses so many conspiracy theories. No one so far, including you, has successfully challenged that assertion.

Thats not supporting your position. That’s doubling down on your assertion. I can do the same thing: I note the fact that every party has espoused conspiracy theories at one time or another in support of my assertion that the modern GOP is not unique in history. Easy-peasy to make assertions and “note” things to “support” a position. Not very effective, but here we are.

And personally, I've had quite enough of the lies being told by Trump supporters and apologists like you. Enough. If you don't like hearing it I'd suggest you apologize and don't lie to me anymore.

You know what I’ve had enough of? These stupid rants and insults; that’s all you’ve got. This thread is ample proof of that, so I guess it did some good.

 

[luchog]

There is no single thing that characterizes the modern GOP as unique amongst historical political parties who have held significant public office in this country. All of the problems they have, many parties in history have had.

The combination of things that characterize the modern GOP, and the degree to which it is characterized by them, would definitely be unique.

I was at a Chinese restaurant a few weeks back, and for some reason I've yet to understand they had Fox and Friends on the television over the bar. I sat there enduring that cavalcade of idiodicy for about 45 minutes, as all the various talking heads and politicians did their schtick. I don't think I have ever witness such a profound display of emotionally-stunted stupidity and self-important viciousness outside of a Jr. High School lunchroom. Not one of them manifested the emotional or intellectual maturity expected of anyone over fourteen years old.

I disturbingly found myself longing for the days of pompous patricians like Bill Buckley, who could actually talk intelligently, and wrote his own books. I'm not sure anyone on Fox and Friends could actually read a book more intellectually challenging than Dick and Jane Burn A Cross. For someone who grew up on the witty repartee between Buckley and Gore Vidal, watching the current incarnation of conservative punditry was like a trip back to an age when fart jokes were the ne plus ultra of culture.

 

[xjx388]

No. I make observations to that which is absolutely clear to anyone and everyone paying attention.

Thats why it’s so strange that you can’t back it up. I mean if it’s so clear, it should be trivial to make a cohesive, well-supported and sourced argument. Your arguments are very much like the typical religious nut’s: “If you can’t see it, you’re just blind, man!”

You, on the other hand, reference some relatively obscure event in recent NC history and end up utterly incapable of providing an unbiased citation of said event.

You want to argue that point? Do it in the relevant thread. Here, you should concentrate on a cohesive, well-supported argument about how the current GOP is unique in American political history. You haven’t done that yet.



<snip personal attack>

 

[xjx388]

You can't possibly be serious, can you? I read that analogy as meaning the GOP is an enabler of Trump. That is undeniable.

Then support it! I get that you have a strong opinion about this; all I’m asking is that you support it. Can you? Will you?

<snip personal attack>

 

[Cabbage]

There is no single thing that characterizes the modern GOP as unique amongst historical political parties who have held significant public office in this country. All of the problems they have, many parties in history have had.

The combination of things that characterize the modern GOP, and the degree to which it is characterized by them, would definitely be unique.

I was at a Chinese restaurant a few weeks back, and for some reason I've yet to understand they had Fox and Friends on the television over the bar. I sat there enduring that cavalcade of idiodicy for about 45 minutes, as all the various talking heads and politicians did their schtick. I don't think I have ever witness such a profound display of emotionally-stunted stupidity and self-important viciousness outside of a Jr. High School lunchroom. Not one of them manifested the emotional or intellectual maturity expected of anyone over fourteen years old.

I disturbingly found myself longing for the days of pompous patricians like Bill Buckley, who could actually talk intelligently, and wrote his own books. I'm not sure anyone on Fox and Friends could actually read a book more intellectually challenging than Dick and Jane Burn A Cross. For someone who grew up on the witty repartee between Buckley and Gore Vidal, watching the current incarnation of conservative punditry was like a trip back to an age when fart jokes were the ne plus ultra of culture.

Thanks for your post. I know what you mean; I've been exposed to enough of Tucker Carlson, for example, on Fox News to have learned that he likes to argue against liberals simply by changing his voice and speaking of them in a mocking tone.

Considering the intersection of media saturation we have with Cable TV, satellite radio and, of course, social media, it's hard for me to see how the modern GOP could even fail to be unique in its brand of corruption: Even if X-style corruption has occurred dozens of times in American history, it's never happened before with the complete inter-connected media saturated world we're living in, and that extra variable should be cause for alarm for any Trump apologists eager to dismiss our concerns.

 

[Cabbage]

Thats why it’s so strange that you can’t back it up. I mean if it’s so clear, it should be trivial to make a cohesive, well-supported and sourced argument. Your arguments are very much like the typical religious nut’s: “If you can’t see it, you’re just blind, man!”
You want to argue that point? Do it in the relevant thread. Here, you should concentrate on a cohesive, well-supported argument about how the current GOP is unique in American political history. You haven’t done that yet.


<snip personal attack>

What makes you think I can't back them up? Of course I can back them up. I simply realize it's an absolute waste of time to back up the assertion that the modern GOP engages in Birtherism, Clinton Murder Conspiracies, Millions of Illegals Voting, and Climate Change Denialism with someone who evidently has no interest in an honest debate and is simply interested in trolling me because I earlier challenged him to provide a citation he was never able to supply.

The evidence of those four conspiracy theories being widespread among the GOP is widely available.

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Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: zooterkin

 

[Cabbage]

Then support it! I get that you have a strong opinion about this; all I’m asking is that you support it. Can you? Will you?

It needs no support, being quite self evident to anyone paying attention.

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Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: zooterkin

 

[Cabbage]

Then support it! I get that you have a strong opinion about this; all I’m asking is that you support it. Can you? Will you?

I will make one exception this time, even though your requests to support it are quite clearly insincere.

Here ya go, educate yourself on this:

http://letmegooglethat.com/?q=gop+enabling+trump

Knock yourself out!

 

[xjx388]

Oof...that’s a really pathetic way to “support” your argument! A google search? Really? johnnykarate was giving me grief for “biased blogs,” I wonder what he would make of that?

Anyway...let’s get this thread straight:

You have made a claim that the modern GOP espouses conspiracy theories on a level not seen in American political history. You didn’t say “some members of the GOP.” You didn’t say, “in modern times.” Your claim is literally, the whole GOP right now is worse than any other party in history. Your “support” for this is, basically, words: birtherism! Clinton murders! Illegal voting!

To be clear, that is you, completely without evidence, ascribing those words to the entire GOP and asserting that no party ever has done stuff like that. Further, you try and divert attention away from your unwillingness (inability?) to source your claims by saying that you don’t need citations because it’s “quite self-evident.” Finally, you cast aspersions on respondents like myself by calling them “dishonest” or “liars.”

No way, pardner; that ain’t the way it works round these here parts. You make a claim; you support it with evidence -not assertions, diversions or aspersions.

 

[Roger Ramjets]

http://letmegooglethat.com/?q=gop+enabling+trump

The Real Reason Republicans Enable Trump

Why do Republicans who howl in rage and frustration in private and on background to journalists support and enable Donald Trump? After all, in the words of 2015 Senator Lindsey Graham (R-SC), Trump is a “jackass”, a “kook”, a “bigot”, and is “unfit for office.” The 2015 version of Graham also called Trump a “race-baiting, xenophobic, religious bigot” who “doesn’t represent” the Republican Party. Graham today is basically Trump’s caddy...

GOP lawmakers may cringe at his tweets, groan at his disregard for the measured dog whistles of yore in favor of full-blown bigotry and racist red meat, and even feel disgusted by him as an utterly depraved human being devoid of a single redeeming trait. But ultimately, when they look at him, they see the tens of millions of Trumps keeping them in office, ecstatic that one of them is president and they can finally show the [ insert plural versions of assorted ethnic and misogynistic slurs here ] who’s in charge. And so they swallow their rage, adjust their ties, put on their best excrement-devouring grins, and go out there to #MAGA.

This is what makes Trump Era Republicans 'Uniquely Bad in American Political History'. Not the lies, but the total abandonment of any principles for the sake of winning at any cost. And while that didn't start with Trump, he completed it. That's what makes Today's GOP uniquely bad. It has sold its soul to populism and will never get it back.

But we shouldn't gloat about it. We should commiserate with all those poor conservatives who have to abandon their principles due to GOP incompetence. It wasn't their fault that the GOP couldn't produce a more popular candidate to counter Trump. What choice did they have? They had to stop that bitch Hillary from destroying the country, and Trump was their only option. Surely the GOP would have replaced him with someone more acceptable by now? But no.

So now they have to defend the indefensible at every turn, or risk being labeled 'Never Trumpers' or worse. And it's getting worse for them. Every insane and stupid thing Trump does just makes their job that much harder. We should spare a thought for our conservative brothers and sisters. Trump may be making it bad for us too, but at least we don't have to worry about being ostracized for daring to speak the truth.

 

[Cabbage]

Oof...that’s a really pathetic way to “support” your argument! A google search? Really? johnnykarate was giving me grief for “biased blogs,” I wonder what he would make of that?

You continue to ignore the fact that my claim is common knowledge. Hell, even my sarcasm slips past you, Swifty.

Anyway...let’s get this thread straight:

You have made a claim that the modern GOP espouses conspiracy theories on a level not seen in American political history. You didn’t say “some members of the GOP.” You didn’t say, “in modern times.” Your claim is literally, the whole GOP right now is worse than any other party in history. Your “support” for this is, basically, words: birtherism! Clinton murders! Illegal voting!

Hey, at least get my position correct. I specifically said uniquely bad. I specifically opposed the idea that I am claiming "worse than any other party in history".

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Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: zooterkin

To be clear, that is you, completely without evidence, ascribing those words to the entire GOP and asserting that no party ever has done stuff like that. Further, you try and divert attention away from your unwillingness (inability?) to source your claims by saying that you don’t need citations because it’s “quite self-evident.” Finally, you cast aspersions on respondents like myself by calling them “dishonest” or “liars.”

I would dispute your claim of "entire GOP". I never said that, but obviously that never stopped you from putting words in my mouth. I am talking about trends. Yes, I am claiming that the trend among the current GOP is belief in every one of these four conspiracy theories. Hell, you know I am right--You're just too proud to admit it.

Newsflash, bro: Would it surprise you if I told you one of the biggest proponents of the Birtherism conspiracy theory was elected to the office of the Presidency a few years ago? This is what I mean by "common knowledge". If you need to be told any of this you're simply not paying attention. You've already demonstrated a complete lack of ability to engage honestly with me; please explain to me why, in that case, I should waste my time citing stuff that you are already aware of, hmm?

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Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: zooterkin

No way, pardner; that ain’t the way it works round these here parts. You make a claim; you support it with evidence -not assertions, diversions or aspersions.

I would agree with you provided I had made a claim of some obscure or dubious nature. As I did not, I continue to scoff at your disingenuous protestations.

 

[Cabbage]

Oof...that’s a really pathetic way to “support” your argument! A google search? Really? johnnykarate was giving me grief for “biased blogs,” I wonder what he would make of that?

Honest question: Did you click on any of the links? If not, why not? Never mind, I'll tell you why: You care nothing about the truth of what I say. You simply think you're somehow proving a point by perpetually asking me to cite something that is, in fact, common knowledge.

You continue to waste my time.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

Republicans are especially bad since they have zero Ideology - they have given up on all principles. They themselves don't know what they want beyond more power.
Their game plan is to neutralize the voters to put them in a position where it won't matter what the electorate wants.
Then they'll figure out what to do.

 

[varwoche]

I have exceedingly negative opinions about Trump's Republican party. If there was a way to measure, it wouldn't surprise me if they are uniquely bad.

There isn't a feasible way to measure. The proposition is far too vague. For this reason (among others) this thread is 0% productive and virtually guaranteed to remain so (despite that post 17 is spot on).

 

[theprestige]

Dang

 

[xjx388]

You continue to ignore the fact that my claim is common knowledge. Hell, even my sarcasm slips past you, Swifty.

Yeah...sarcasm...that’s the ticket!

Anywho...Christians argue that the existence of God is “common knowledge.” Is that good enough for everyone to accept such a claim? No...no it isn’t. Is “common knowledge” the basis of a sound argument? No...no it isn’t.

You can do the ipse dixit shuffle all you like but I ain’t dancing with you.

Hey, at least get my position correct. I specifically said uniquely bad. I specifically opposed the idea that I am claiming "worse than any other party in history". You have a lot of trouble telling the truth, don't you?

What in tarnation is the difference between “uniquely bad” in history and “worse” than any other party in history? There is none. That’s just you trying to obfuscate to wiggle your way out of your ridiculous OP.

I would dispute your claim of "entire GOP". I never said that, but obviously that never stopped you from putting words in my mouth. I am talking about trends. Yes, I am claiming that the trend among the current GOP is belief in every one of these four conspiracy theories. Hell, you know I am right--You're just too proud to admit it.

More obfuscation. You said:

I've never seen an American political party that so brazenly lies about such easily checked facts

That quite clearly says it’s the whole party. If you don’t like those words in your mouth, you shouldn’t have put them in there in the first place.

Newsflash, bro: Would it surprise you if I told you one of the biggest proponents of the Birtherism conspiracy theory was elected to the office of the Presidency a few years ago? This is what I mean by "common knowledge".

That’s one dude, not the whole party. You need to show that the whole party bought into birtherism. And you need find a way to prove this was a uniquely Republican thing. Speaking of common knowledge, it’s well-known that some Democrats bought into this crap too.

If you need to be told any of this you're simply not paying attention.

Oh, I’m paying attention, just not your particular brand of selective attention.

You've already demonstrated a complete lack of ability to engage honestly with me; please explain to me why, in that case, I should waste my time citing stuff that you are already aware of, hmm?

More aspersions I see.

Finally, I actually documented you specifically lying to me. Why is this hard for you to understand? I do not call you a liar because we disagree. I call you a liar because you lied. It really is that simple.

See what I mean, that’s all you’ve got: assertions, diversions and aspersions...all three in that one little paragraph.

I would agree with you provided I had made a claim of some obscure or dubious nature. As I did not, I continue to scoff at your disingenuous protestations.

Your claim is dubious and unfounded. Your whole rant is unclear and ever changing.

 

[xjx388]

Honest question: Did you click on any of the links? If not, why not? Never mind, I'll tell you why: You care nothing about the truth of what I say. You simply think you're somehow proving a point by perpetually asking me to cite something that is, in fact, common knowledge.



You continue to waste my time.

Woah, woah...I thought that link was sarcasm?!

 

[PhantomWolf]

You don't have to go that far back. How about the Southern Democrats of the 1950s and 1960s?

You mean the same Southern Democrats who split with the party over the Civil Right's movement and went on to support Barry Goldwater's Republican run for President and then became a major part of the GOP to the point where the current situation is that the Southern States are now redder than a sunburnt, communist, lobster driving a Ferrari!