Democrats Move to Ensure No More AOCs

I’m not dismissing hers in particular. I’m pointing out that a college degree tells you nothing useful about a politician. You can pretend otherwise, but I doubt you have ever changed your vote on the basis of a candidate’s degree. Most voters don’t, and they are right not to do so.

Degree or not... you're using this "discussion point" to conservasplain away the righty pundits' obsession with her career in food & beverage. This topic only came up because people use it to counter the "just a bartender" disingenuous* complaint from Fox and Fiends.

I mean, what's the requirement in the job description? "Ability to get elected". She passed. (And if she acts as a magnet for the whining of the right, that's just a bonus.)

*Disingenuous? Yeah. She could have a PhD in Astro-Physics and they'd still say she was uniquely unqualified.
 
One obvious reason to dismiss AOC's education is that it's not a differentiator. A college degree is certainly valuable in itself, but all of her peers have similar qualifications, and their competence is all over the map.

Even President Trump has a degree in Econ, from Wharton College. In a world where that's true, "she has a college degree!" doesn't mean much, and should probably be dismissed.

I’m not dismissing hers in particular. I’m pointing out that a college degree tells you nothing useful about a politician. You can pretend otherwise, but I doubt you have ever changed your vote on the basis of a candidate’s degree. Most voters don’t, and they are right not to do so.

To poke at both of you... it might, in fact, behoove you both to review where and why the college degrees were invoked.

Let's walk through it, again, just because.

First, we had -

She isn't called "Occasional-Cortex" for nothing. There's nothing in her CV to indicate she's qualified for anything beyond the bar-work she once did, and quite a lot in her public declamations to indicate she isn't.

But her hawtness as a bosomy young woman, and the apparent egoism and lack of self-doubt that this has conferred her has got her quite a long way. So far.

Then came the response that inspired this tangent.

Well, there are those degrees in International Relations and Economics. But you forgot about those, I'm sure. I'm certain you're still steaming that the video of her dancing in a school video didn't crush her the way you hoped.

Since arriving, she has proposed and worked on multiple bills, even seeking to work on one with Ted Cruz, not a man known for agreeing with socialists. Of course, since those bills weren't giving billionaires tax breaks or gutting the ACA you think they must be dumb.

She's managed to get Fox News to go absolutely psychotic on her. This took little more than being elected and being slightly progressive. They cannot go a day without mentioning her, sometimes not even an hour.

During her attendance on various committees she has asked critical questions, especially of Michael Cohen. During the same appearances the various GOP sycophants stumbled and tripped over themselves trying to show their loyalty to Trump.

She's a hell of a lot more competent than the racist, psychotic, incompetent, failed businessman in the White House.

So, the claim that was directly addressed by that was, get this -

There's nothing in her CV to indicate she's qualified for anything beyond the bar-work she once did,

Without touching the rest, generally, college degrees are a pretty good indicator that someone's qualified for something. It's simply nonsensical to argue against that, but it sure looks like Ziggurat's trying.

Ziggurat decided to fight back against the notion that college degrees mean anything at all and chose to try to move the goalposts all over the place, in response, and now as a result, we descended into annoying territory where the two of you are just fighting against arguments that weren't made in the first place. I suppose we could do more to discuss some of the general topics that Ziggurat tried to change the discussion to and you've hopped on the wagon for, theprestige, but why should anyone be particularly interested in doing so when the transition to that topic is nothing more than a tactic to avoid addressing what had actually been said in context?

ETA - Or, in other words.... NO ONE CLAIMED THAT "HAVING A COLLEGE DEGREE" WAS PROOF POSITIVE THAT AOC IS QUALIFIED AS A POLITICIAN, SO STOP ARGUING AS IF IT WAS CLAIMED.
 
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She isn't called "Occasional-Cortex" for nothing. There's nothing in her CV to indicate she's qualified for anything beyond the bar-work she once did, and quite a lot in her public declamations to indicate she isn't.

But her hawtness as a bosomy young woman, and the apparent egoism and lack of self-doubt that this has conferred her has got her quite a long way. So far.
Yeah, heavens forbid anyone without qualification or political experience, or who makes it clear publicly that they are unfit for office, and with lots of egoism and lack of self-doubt should hold public office, or worse, even the POTUS position :) :thumbsup: .

You posted this just to make people point out just how much it applies to the orange chimp in a suit in the white house, didn't you.
 
Without touching the rest, generally, college degrees are a pretty good indicator that someone's qualified for something.

Not really. There are far better indicators available. But here's the kicker: the way to disprove my claim is to show that people actually change their vote based on a candidate's degree. I'm saying people don't do that. You haven't even claimed that you personally have ever done that. That's a tell right there.
 
That doesn't follow at all. You're presuming college is the only place one can learn

Speaking of non sequiturs, saying that having a degree makes it more likely to have certain skills absolutely does not mean that said skills cannot otherwise be earned. In fact it explicitly states that they can by making it less likely that they are without a degree.
 
Speaking of non sequiturs, saying that having a degree makes it more likely to have certain skills absolutely does not mean that said skills cannot otherwise be earned. In fact it explicitly states that they can by making it less likely that they are without a degree.

You missed the point. If college is the only place you can learn something, then your odds of learning it at college (nonzero) are higher than not at college (zero). The conclusion follows. But if you can learn it somewhere else, then the odds are nonzero with or without college. So which has the greater odds? Yes, it's possible that the odds are greater at college, but it's also possible that the odds are less at college. That's why the conclusion doesn't follow. It could be wrong. More evidence is needed to make that claim.
 
You missed the point. If college is the only place you can learn something, then your odds of learning it at college (nonzero) are higher than not at college (zero). The conclusion follows.

Except that no one said or implied that college is the only place you can learn something. What was said was that a college degree makes it more likely that you've learned something. It doesn't follow the other way around.

But if you can learn it somewhere else, then the odds are nonzero with or without college.

Irrelevant to the comment you were responding to.

So which has the greater odds?

Depends. Experience sure is worth more than theory, but a degree is a demonstration that you've at least got the basics right.

Yes, it's possible that the odds are greater at college, but it's also possible that the odds are less at college. That's why the conclusion doesn't follow.

It wasn't a syllogism, so there's nothing to follow. Aridas is either right or wrong.
 
Except that no one said or implied that college is the only place you can learn something. What was said was that a college degree makes it more likely that you've learned something.

I know that. But that hasn't been established, it's only been claimed. That was the point.
 
Not really. There are far better indicators available.

Which wouldn't counter the point actually made, even potentially, so your "Not really" is an empty denial.

But here's the kicker: the way to disprove my claim is to show that people actually change their vote based on a candidate's degree. I'm saying people don't do that.

Meanwhile, I'm saying that you're fighting against an argument that no one made and that I'm not going to humor your attempt to change the subject to that via a thoroughly dishonest method.
 
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You missed the point. If college is the only place you can learn something, then your odds of learning it at college (nonzero) are higher than not at college (zero). The conclusion follows. But if you can learn it somewhere else, then the odds are nonzero with or without college. So which has the greater odds? Yes, it's possible that the odds are greater at college, but it's also possible that the odds are less at college. That's why the conclusion doesn't follow. It could be wrong. More evidence is needed to make that claim.

Wow! Try this: Next time you, for example, need your taxes done or need something built or whatever, pick a random dude off the street to do it for you. It's possible they're more likely to know how to do it than a CPA/Architect/Engineer.

LMFAO!!

Please let us know how it goes! It's all in the interest of Science and Epistemology!
 
Interesting that in this thread, she's just a bartender, but when The Great Gawd Trump says she should go back where she came from, it's just crickets from his supporters in the Trump thread.
Hey guys, should she and other brown females go back where they came from?
 
Which wouldn't counter the point actually made, even potentially, so your "Not really" is an empty denial.



Meanwhile, I'm saying that you're fighting against an argument that no one made and that I'm not going to humor your attempt to change the subject to that via a thoroughly dishonest method.

What do you think “qualification” even means? If you never consider changing your vote of the basis of some particular quality, then how is it a qualification for your vote? How is it a qualification for office if you don’t actually care about it?
 
Interesting that in this thread, she's just a bartender, but when The Great Gawd Trump says she should go back where she came from, it's just crickets from his supporters in the Trump thread.
Hey guys, should she and other brown females go back where they came from?

Trump never said AOC should go back where she came from.
 
Wow! Try this: Next time you, for example, need your taxes done or need something built or whatever, pick a random dude off the street to do it for you. It's possible they're more likely to know how to do it than a CPA/Architect/Engineer.

LMFAO!!

Please let us know how it goes! It's all in the interest of Science and Epistemology!

What about the next time I need a Doctor of English Lit to write a thesis on British legal history?
 
Wow! Try this: Next time you, for example, need your taxes done or need something built or whatever, pick a random dude off the street to do it for you. It's possible they're more likely to know how to do it than a CPA/Architect/Engineer.

LMFAO!!

Please let us know how it goes! It's all in the interest of Science and Epistemology!

Next time, try reading for comprehension. Your objection was addressed at the very start.
 
Yeah, I can see how AOC's college degree is a qualification. Probably college degrees aren't as good a qualification as colleges (and many degree holders) would have you think, but it's still a qualification.

On the other hand, here's AOC needing it explained to her that crossing the border illegally is illegal:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEFoi_leYDw

Nice try at a diversion, but (unsurprisingly) The Blaze is seriously misrepresenting what's going on in that video. In that exchange AOC brings up asylum seekers and says that applying for asylum isn't illegal. Homan's response was that being the US without going through a port of entry is illegal and that in order for asylees to apply legally, they would need to do it at a port of entry. Homan is wrong; the law states very clearly that a person seeking asylum only needs to be present in the US to request asylum, and that where a person crosses has no bearing on their ability to seek asylum.

http://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim-title8-section1158&num=0&edition=prelim

Not entering the country at a port of entry (under section 8, which Homan cited), is civil offense (although, as AOC said, people who do it to seek asylum don't get charged with crimes, because their presence in the US isn't illegal), but AOC wasn't talking about that during the exchange where you seem to think she was made to look like a fool. I'm not surprised that this is yet another example of some right-wing source/personality claiming that AOC is stupid to know what she's talking about, while leaving out that she'd actually correct.
 
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