Atheists destroy churches, attack the faithful

[The Big Dog]

dl:

Oh dear, the white flag emoji not working?

I link to an external source to rebut your uncorroborated opinions, and rather than address it, you post an insipid emoji.

And so it goes folks....

 

[The Big Dog]

Even members of government-approved churches are not speared harassment from authorities and seek refuge in other provinces of China where the crackdown on religion is less intense.

But we were told that the Unyielding Marxist Atheists were treating approved churches so well...

 

[Aridas]

I guess the argument comes down to what came first, atheism or communism and after that what serves someone's purposes to blame.

Personally having first hand experience with both of 'em, communism is the villain, not atheism.

"Which came first, the chicken or the egg?" was the first thing that came to mind here. That does leave ambiguity, though. One of the important requirements for actual Communism to work, short of AI taking care of just about everything and effectively removing the nigh impossible requirements, is a strong belief in the system and unity. Diversity of belief can easily undermine that in a few ways. The perversion of communism that is state "communism" similarly requires an effectively religious belief in its principles spread throughout the population to work as intended. Either way, it's no surprise that communistic societies are more associated with atheism. Atheism, on the other hand, doesn't even remotely spawn communism. It doesn't spawn much of anything, because it's fundamentally a lack of belief in something, rather than a belief in a set of valued principles.

I know that it is a meme, but "why not both"?

Because the shoe doesn't fit both.

By the way, I just quoted Marx saying “Communism,” Marx wrote in 1844, “begins from the outset with atheism.” We have seen numerous pogroms against religious folks for virtually the entire lat 100 years, up to and including today, Unyielding Marxist Atheists, as Xi put it

That rather looks like him claiming that Communism requires atheism to work, rooted in its need to prevent interference in the belief in the values that it requires to be held firmly.

 

[MRC_Hans]

Oh dear, the white flag emoji not working?

I link to an external source to rebut your uncorroborated opinions, and rather than address it, you post an insipid emoji.

And so it goes folks....

Yes. That is what your arguments deserve. Sorry, can't spend more time on it. After all we have been round the track several times, and .... well broken record and all that.

I suggest you put me on ignore, or something....

Hans

 

[BStrong]

I know that it is a meme, but "why not both"?

By the way, I just quoted Marx saying “Communism,” Marx wrote in 1844, “begins from the outset with atheism.” We have seen numerous pogroms against religious folks for virtually the entire lat 100 years, up to and including today, Unyielding Marxist Atheists, as Xi put it

Quote books to your heart's content.

My experience in seeing the results of communism in SEA and central America first hand leads me to believe that communism is no more than another way for authoritarians to exert control over general populations.

Communism isn't the sum of all it's parts. It's a fluid philosophy that has no real core belief past authoritarian control. If atheism works one place for the party leaders they'll use it - if atheism is a no goer somewhere else it won't come up.

 

[MRC_Hans]

Right now, the government in Tanzania is cracking down on homosexuals, making mass arrests. Wait for The Big Dog to make a thread on this atrocity.

...

But, don't hold your breath.

Hans

 

[BStrong]

Right now, the government in Tanzania is cracking down on homosexuals, making mass arrests. Wait for The Big Dog to make a thread on this atrocity.

...

But, don't hold your breath.

Hans

The long standing rule is you can always hit on your own side, but something tells me that won't be happening anytime soon from TBD wrt religious nuttery.

[frankensteinvoice]Nuttery blamed on atheists, good! nuttery blamed on xtian religion, Bad! [/frakensteinvoice]

 

[The Big Dog]

Yes. That is what your arguments deserve. Sorry, can't spend more time on it. After all we have been round the track several times, and .... well broken record and all that.

I suggest you put me on ignore, or something....

Hans

Sorry, simply repeating your opinion, refusing to even address third party sources, and posting laughing dog emojis ain't an argument.

 

[The Big Dog]

Right now, the government in Tanzania is cracking down on homosexuals, making mass arrests. Wait for The Big Dog to make a thread on this atrocity.

...

But, don't hold your breath.

Hans

The long standing rule is you can always hit on your own side, but something tells me that won't be happening anytime soon from TBD wrt religious nuttery.

[frankensteinvoice]Nuttery blamed on atheists, good! nuttery blamed on xtian religion, Bad! [/frakensteinvoice]

Whataboutism (whatabout tanzania folks!) and tu quoque fallacies.

Does it rebut my posts about China. You know it doesn't.

Is is a fallacious ad hominem?

You know it!

Is that the best they got?

It appears so.

sad?

Sad!

 

[MRC_Hans]

Whataboutism (whatabout tanzania folks!) and tu quoque fallacies.

Does it rebut my posts about China. You know it doesn't.

Didn't say it does. Just waiting for you rightful indignation on this subject-

Is is a fallacious ad hominem?

Not at all. Didn't say it was your fault, did I? Didn't even mention religion.

Hans

 

[The Big Dog]

Didn't say it does. Just waiting for you rightful indignation on this subject-



Not at all. Didn't say it was your fault, did I? Didn't even mention religion.

Hans

Oh dear, I had assumed that you knew what a fallacious ad hominem was.. I see that you don't. Yikes. It does explain a lot...

Your entire post about Tanzania was grossly fallacious, even though you didn't say that the situation in Tanzania was my "fault."

 

[BStrong]

Whataboutism (whatabout tanzania folks!) and tu quoque fallacies.

Does it rebut my posts about China. You know it doesn't.

Is is a fallacious ad hominem?

You know it!

Is that the best they got?

It appears so.

sad?

Sad!

Repetitive motion injuries from table pounding are right around the corner for you if you keep it up.

Like other subjects, I've found the less someone knows firsthand about a subject the more that they're convinced they're right.

Spend a few years with folks that were victims of communism and those who fought for and against it and get back to us.

 

[The Big Dog]

Repetitive motion injuries from table pounding are right around the corner for you if you keep it up.

Like other subjects, I've found the less someone knows firsthand about a subject the more that they're convinced they're right.

Spend a few years with folks that were victims of communism and those who fought for and against it and get back to us.

That is odd, that post had absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with my post that you quoted explaining why the posts were whataboutism/tu quoque. It is almost as if there was no response.

Spend a few years with folks that were victims of Unyielding Marxist Atheists and those who fought against it you mean?

 

[BStrong]

Snipped with respect

That rather looks like him claiming that Communism requires atheism to work, rooted in its need to prevent interference in the belief in the values that it requires to be held firmly.

All communism needed in China was enough weapons and ammo to go around in Mao's camp to kill their opponents - and it's that simple.

His famous quote "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun" came from 1927. I've yet to find any quotes from Mao on the necessity of using atheism instead of a weapon to get where he wanted to go.

 

[The Big Dog]

All communism needed in China was enough weapons and ammo to go around in Mao's camp to kill their opponents - and it's that simple.

His famous quote "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun" came from 1927. I've yet to find any quotes from Mao on the necessity of using atheism instead of a weapon to get where he wanted to go.

Where did he want to go with that weapon? His famous quote:

"Religion is poison."

-Mao

 

[BStrong]

That is odd, that post had absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with my post that you quoted explaining why the posts were whataboutism/tu quoque. It is almost as if there was no response.

Spend a few years with folks that were victims of Unyielding Marxist Atheists and those who fought against it you mean?

Please keep your tongue out of my mouth - isn't there something in the good book about that?

You've read books.

I volunteered in the refugee camp outside of Aranyaprathet, Thailand that was filled with Vietnamese and Cambodians running from communism. That was a great first hand introduction to the actual horrors of communism.

Later on I was a participant in the activity down south in the 1980's. Different situation, different people. Same evil as far as it went. An even better education about a bunch of things.

It's good you can read books and learn things. The problem start when you have to deal with humans instead of printed materials.

Life is a whole lot more complicated than the printed page, but since it's obvious that some other printed pages control you it's easy for you to believe that other printed words control other people.

You may wish to believe that some communist somewhere is thinking of how great it is to be an atheist when they squeeze the trigger on someone, but the reality is a whole lot more complicated.

Sorry, simple sky-pilot explanations of motive don't fly, and humans aren't one dimensional.

 

[Crossbow]

Where did he want to go with that weapon? His famous quote:

"Religion is poison."

-Mao

Those who pretend to care about human rights while using the language of their religion often show just how poisonous their religion is.

 

[Thor 2]

Let's ask the question:

If China got rid of all religions, so that atheism triumphs over theism, science over superstition, and materialism over idealism: would China be a much better place? Is that an end worth striving for? (Assume they do it through wide-spread education rather than banning outright.)

You make it more complicated and confuse the issue. What is this materialism over idealism tosh?

If/when rational thought triumphs over theism the whole World will be a better place.

 

[The Big Dog]

Please keep your tongue out of my mouth - isn't there something in the good book about that?

You've read books.

I volunteered in the refugee camp outside of Aranyaprathet, Thailand that was filled with Vietnamese and Cambodians running from communism. That was a great first hand introduction to the actual horrors of communism.

Later on I was a participant in the activity down south in the 1980's. Different situation, different people. Same evil as far as it went. An even better education about a bunch of things.

It's good you can read books and learn things. The problem start when you have to deal with humans instead of printed materials.

Life is a whole lot more complicated than the printed page, but since it's obvious that some other printed pages control you it's easy for you to believe that other printed words control other people.

You may wish to believe that some communist somewhere is thinking of how great it is to be an atheist when they squeeze the trigger on someone, but the reality is a whole lot more complicated.

Sorry, simple sky-pilot explanations of motive don't fly, but humans aren't one dimensional.

I am not relying on "sky-pilot" explanations for the ongoing atrocities.

I am relying on things like Xi Jinping Reminding Party Members to Be 'Unyielding Marxist Atheists' in connection with the kick off of the very crackdown we are talking about in this thread, one that is the most repressive since Mao.

By the way, on the one-dimensional business, perhaps I should remind you that it was I who told you:

I know that it is a meme, but "why not both"?

So... yeah.

 

[MRC_Hans]

Oh dear, I had assumed that you knew what a fallacious ad hominem was.. I see that you don't. Yikes. It does explain a lot...

Ya, it's an ad hominem that wasn't one. Like i said.

Your entire post about Tanzania was grossly fallacious, even though you didn't say that the situation in Tanzania was my "fault."

Well, it sure seems to have hit a sore spot. But feel free to point out the faults.

Hans