Cont: Mueller Investigation pt3

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Looks like Mueller is putting together an Aviary of cooperators, who will all sing the right tune at the right time and not before.
 
Ziggurat said:
Or maybe not.
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I saw that but after reading the wording of the plea agreement it seems the government reserves the right to make him give information, documents and testify in any matter they may "deem relevant".

I wonder what the negotiation was and what was changed vs the agreement from earlier in the week? This doesn't seem to give Manafort very much of a deal. He is still looking at over 10 years in prison.

Will he be released between now and sentencing? I didn't see anything regarding that.
 
Sherkeu said:
I saw that but after reading the wording of the plea agreement it seems the government reserves the right to make him give information, documents and testify in any matter they may "deem relevant".

I wonder what the negotiation was and what was changed vs the agreement from earlier in the week? This doesn't seem to give Manafort very much of a deal. He is still looking at over 10 years in prison.

Will he be released between now and sentencing? I didn't see anything regarding that.
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It's not just the length of the sentence, but where he spends it that may have influenced him. Federal prison can be anything from Florence Supermax to the cushiest Club Fed. He wasn't going to get the former, but could have been looking at something worse than the latter.

I wonder if he even WANTS to be released at this point. He's relatively save from assassination where he is.
 
Trebuchet said:
It's not just the length of the sentence, but where he spends it that may have influenced him. Federal prison can be anything from Florence Supermax to the cushiest Club Fed. He wasn't going to get the former, but could have been looking at something worse than the latter.

I wonder if he even WANTS to be released at this point. He's relatively save from assassination where he is.
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Remember all the security for Joe Valachi in "The Valachi Papers"?
 
And, yup Mueller is running this investigation exactly the way he ran invesigations involving La COstra Nostra when he ran the FBI.. Exact same playbook.
 
Sherkeu said:
I saw that but after reading the wording of the plea agreement it seems the government reserves the right to make him give information, documents and testify in any matter they may "deem relevant".

I wonder what the negotiation was and what was changed vs the agreement from earlier in the week? This doesn't seem to give Manafort very much of a deal. He is still looking at over 10 years in prison.

Will he be released between now and sentencing? I didn't see anything regarding that.
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Here's the actual agreement:
https://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/d...e-high_manafort-docs-225pm:homepage/story-ans

Yeah, he has to give up everything. He doesn't get to say "You can't ask me about all those other crimes." In court he admitted to the facts of the other charges, even though he didn't plead guilty to them.

How much time he actually serves depends on his full cooperation. Reports say he's still in jail, and probably won't get out. After all, he's been convicted of 10 federal felonies.
 
Regnad Kcin said:
Trebuchet said:
I'd like her better if she'd just take a damn DNA test and, if it shows no Native American heritage just say so and move on.
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Obama produced his birth certificate. Did birthers (incl. Trump, Arpaio, etc.) move on?
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And the Republican attack squads wouldn't 'move on' even if a DNA test proved beyond any shadow of a doubt that she did have Native American ancestry.

It isn't ever about facts or the truth for them.
 
River said:
What if Assange gets immunity to testify as to the source of the files?
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I'll ask again. Who knows? Maybe the third time is the charm!

What makes you sure Assange even knows the source? And if he even thinks he does know the source, what kind of reliability can we really place on his thoughts actually being correct?
 
Ziggurat said:
Or maybe not.
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Err, no

8. Cooperation

Your client shall cooperate fully, truthfully, completely, and forthrightly with the Government and other law enforcement authorities identified by the Government in any and all matters as to which the Government deems the cooperation relevant. This cooperation will include, but is not limited to, the following:

(a) The defendant agrees to be fully debriefed and to attend all meetings at which his presence is requested, concerning his participation in and knowledge of all criminal activities.

(b) The defendant agrees to furnish to the Government all documents and other material that may be relevant to the investigation and that are in the defendant's possession or control and to participate in undercover activities pursuant to the specific instructions of law enforcement agents or the Government.

(c) The defendant agrees to testify at any proceeding in the District of Colombia or elsewhere as requested by the Government.
(d) The defendant consents to adjournments of his sentences as requested by the Government.

(e) The defendant agrees that all of the defendant's obligations under this agreement continue after the defendant is sentenced here and in the Eastern District of Virginia; and

(f) The defendant must at all times give complete, truthful, and accurate information and testimony, and must not commit, or attempt to commit, any further crimes.

Your client acknowledges and understands that, during the course of the cooperation outlined in this Agreement, your client will be interviewed by law enforcement agents and/or Government attorneys. Your client waives any right to have counsel present during these interviews and agrees to meet with law enforcement agents and Government attorneys outside of the presence of counsel. If, at some future point, you or your client desire to have counsel present during interviews by law enforcement agents and/or Government attorneys, and you
communicate this decision in writing to this Office, this Office will honor this request, and this change will have no effect on any other terms and conditions of this Agreement.

Your client shall testify fully, completely and truthfully before any and all Grand Juries in the District of Columbia and elsewhere, and at any and all trials of cases or other court proceedings in the District of Columbia and elsewhere, at which your client's testimony may be deemed relevant by the Government.
Your client understands and acknowledges that nothing in this Agreement allows your client to commit any criminal violation of local, state or federal law during the period of your client's cooperation with law enforcement authorities or at any time prior to the sentencing in this case. The commission of a criminal offense during the period of your client's cooperation or at any time prior to sentencing will constitute a breach of this Agreement and will relieve the
Government of all of its obligations under this Agreement, including, but not limited to, its obligation to inform this Court of any assistance your client has provided. However, your client acknowledges and agrees that such a breach of this Agreement will not entitle your client to withdraw your client's plea of guilty or relieve your client of the obligations under this agreement.

Your client agrees that the sentencing in this case and in the Eastern District of Virginia may be delayed until your client's efforts to cooperate have been completed, as determined by the Government, so that the Courts will have the benefit of all relevant information before a sentence is imposed. ​

Right now, the walls around Dolt 45 are closing in even tighter. If he wasn't such a narcissistic man-child, he would be crapping himself right now.

Expect plenty of character assassination of Manafort now from Dolt's friends and sycophants at Faux News
 
The Great Zaganza said:
But what can Manaford give Mueller, except a bunch of former-Soviet oligarchs?
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He can give them EVERYTHING that was actually said in the Trump Tower meeting where they supposedly discussed "adoptions" (yeah, right), because he was present. This is what he gives them that Cohen cannot.

If they were discussing a conspiracy with Russians to affect the 2016 election, then Dolt JR (at least) is in deep deep doo doo. But more to the point, if Dolt 45 himself was actually listening in, then Manaflip will know it... and he will have to tell, and that is big trouble for Dolt 45, because it clarifies not only what he knew, but when he knew it.
 
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River said:
Since you asked so nicely; I've actually answered this before more than once in the thread. I've said I haven't made up my mind yet. There are too many variables remaining to give an accurate outcome prediction IMHO.

Some of those variables include important documents that have been stonewalled for months. Also, whether or not Assange gets immunity for testimony. Another variable could be Rosenstein getting fired/replaced which may change the fate of the investigation. Another could be, it finishes up and we get to see the facts and documents.

If you want me to guess on some things sure. If key documents are not handed over, they will be declassified by the president. Also, if they are not handed over some officials may have a small future at their job/post. Will Trump fire Mueller? Nope. But there may be some resignations or firings that happen either at his direction or others involved (like rosenstein, depending on his actions with these documents, and what they reveal)

What if Assange gets immunity to testify as to the source of the files? What if others have information that can authenticate or verify that source?

There are a lot of variables still at play, that we do not have the facts on just yet. We do know from Admiral Rogers report in april of 2016 that there were irregularities with unmasking, and in database upstream searches. We know some of that continued. (samantha powers?) Does the fact that Obama officials had a stand down order effect this? Does the fact that no evidence to date ties this to Trump effect this? (we will see with time if some is produced) Does it matter that private entities hired by opposition parties presented the bulk of evidence (allegedly according to nunes memo) used to obtain the fisa warrants? Does Feinstein having (unknowingly?) hired a chinese spy effect any of this? Which side is lying? Both parties cannot be being honest here...

A lot at play.

How many fbi officals and doj officials has this effected to date? (firings or resignations) Will that effect other ongoing investigations?

More questions than answers. I think making a prediction now is presumptuous at best. Many people also seem to be willing to dismiss things that could be quite plausible. (due to media?) A lot of misdirection, from both sides.
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Let's assume for the sake of argument that Mueller completes his investigation and issues a report. What do you think will happen?
 
varwoche said:
Indeed. And yet, his tweets today are only about the hurricane.
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I think it means he isn't upset about it. I don't think he is capable of being angry and not tweeting!
Their lawyers coordinate under a joint-defense agreement so Trump would have known about this. Sounds like this was agreed to by all parties before the plea.
 
varwoche said:
Indeed. And yet, his tweets today are only about the hurricane.
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I have visions of him being physically restrained from tweeting what he thinks of that "brave man Manafort" now.
It's only temporariy. The venom will over Manafort will erupt, guaranteed.
 
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