Cont: The Trump Presidency VIII

[Minoosh]

It's usually expected that the students read the books they are studying. Certain sections and passages are focused on in the actual course material but you are supposed to read the books as well.
If you don't want to read the literature why are you doing the A level?

I read it in 6th grade, when I was 10. The whole class read the whole thing. It was part of our anti-Communist indoctrination. And it's a pretty easy read.

Imagine my surprise when I found out Orwell was a socialist.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

According to the story the transcriber didn't hear anything for the first part of the question, because there was no audio on the feed.

I think you mean question, rather than answer. And it's allegedly because they were watching a different feed.

I ask again which is the more parsimonious answer - that both the White House and the Washington Post got their live feed from Bloomberg and that that live feed had an audio glitch, or that the White House and the Washington Post coordinated in order to edit out that part of that one question in an identical fashion, with the Post then looking to cover its tracks by changing its transcript and issuing a retraction?

Maddow is still saying it was purposeful. I'm going to sit on the fence for a bit on this one.

Trump Tweets

"Twitter “SHADOW BANNING” prominent Republicans. Not good. We will look into this discriminatory and illegal practice at once! Many complaints."

The man has no clue about the law.

 

[Mumbles]

The man has no clue about the law.

I'll go right ahead and guess that he has no clue what Shadow Banning is, either. If he did, he'd know that Twitter doesn't shadowban people in the first place.

Also, the man's generally an ignoramus, so it's a good go-to guess in almost every case that doesn't involve bigotry or infidelity.

 

[jimbob]

I'll go right ahead and guess that he has no clue what Shadow Banning is, either. If he did, he'd know that Twitter doesn't shadowban people in the first place.

Also, the man's generally an ignoramus, so it's a good go-to guess in almost every case that doesn't involve bigotry or infidelity.

That's unfair, it could also be fraud.

 

[acbytesla]

Meanwhile, popcorn time

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ens-unhinged-white-house-memoir-idUSKBN1KG2K2

The memoir is called "Unhinged"

This could apply to both of them.

 

[Stacyhs]

True, technically not all evangelical Christians are Trump supporters. But the vast majority are. (Especially among white evangelicals.) Evangelicals who oppose Trump are a relatively small minority.

From: https://www.vox.com/identities/2018...ical-support-for-trump-is-at-an-all-time-high
The poll, conducted by the Public Religion Research Institute in March, found that a full 75 percent of white evangelicals surveyed had a positive opinion of Donald Trump, compared to just 22 percent holding an unfavorable view.


Yes, hypocrisy is certainly common across religions and in other organizations. The difference is:
- Evangelicals elevate the hypocrisy to a whole new level
- Evangelicals (as a voting block) are more influential than other organizations

Years ago, my father's Air Force first officer (and our neighbor) became a Baptist minister when he retired. He had always deplored the lack of religion in our household. After a few years as a Baptist minister, he quit in disgust. He said he couldn't stand the blatant, daily hypocrisy any more. He remained religious but no longer wanted to be involved in organized religion.

 

[jimbob]

"some of my best friends are Christians".

Actually that is true.


The next bit might sound odd to most of the Brits here, but is the case where I work - in the UK,


Several of my colleagues who I respect a lot are devout Christians, but they accept evolution and are more "New Testament" than "Old Testament". One in particular is utterly mystified by the views of the fundamentalists - both scientific and political.
He's in the mould of a Socialist Christian as was strong in the Labour party .

More surprisingly for the UK, there are several Young Earth Creationists with views that seem utterly American fundamentalist on most subjects. I believe that there was (or is?) a bible study group at work where they discussed the Bible and Koran with some of the devout Muslims at work (there are probably roughly equal numbers), although most of my colleagues would probably describe themselves as atheist or agnostic. Twenty years ago, they might have ticked "Christian" but probably wouldn't even bother going to church at Christmas.

 

[Aridas]

Are we ever going to get back to Wilbur Ross brazenly perjuring himself in sworn congressional testimony or is that one of those things we shrug off these days?​

It's kind of amazing how Ross's brazen corruption has flown under the radar due to all the other corruption going on.

...Holding someone accountable for brazen perjury in sworn congressional testimony? Take a number. The GOP's been brazenly and pointedly ignoring that particular crime, by the look of it.

Maddow is still saying it was purposeful. I'm going to sit on the fence for a bit on this one.

There are a couple possibilities for how that happened in the first place, honestly. Employing a particular audio feed is one of them. Just copy pasting the WaPo's version, whether intentionally because of the omission or just arbitrarily for ease, is another.

That it wasn't fixed in a timely manner despite them being alerted to the mistake, on the other hand, and Trump's previous and subsequent claims that the Russians totally want and wanted the Democrats to win, not Trump, point clearly towards it having been left there intentionally, regardless of the reason why it was there in the first place.

The latter of those involves the much greater issues in play, the former is pretty much a nothingburger. The focus on the latter is a bit like the focus on covfefe. It's a small issue that's received remarkably undue attention compared to the much more significant other issues at hand.

 

[turingtest]

I'd say its closer to 0%, and he'll retain pretty much all of the support that he currently gets from the Christian right-wing.

Evangelicals are known for their hypocrisy, double standards, and outright immoral actions and attitudes. If its found that Trump paid for an abortion, they will say something like "It was in the past but now he's a changed man", or "We're giving him another mulligan". Or "Whatabout Clinton".

This, I think. Anyone here remember Scott DesJarlais?

During a trial for his divorce from his first wife in 2000, DesJarlais testified that he had sexual affairs with at least two patients, three coworkers and a drug representative while he was working as a hospital chief of staff.
Despite his public opposition to legal abortion, DesJarlais encouraged his ex-wife to terminate two pregnancies and encouraged a former patient with whom he was having an affair to get an abortion.

And DesJarlais won reelection in 2016 by 30 points over his Democratic opponent. Apparently, he asked for (and got) god's forgiveness, the implication being that his sins are a matter strictly between him and god. It seems to me to be the very definition of hypocrisy for evangelical (and, presumably, moral) voters to excuse such egregious moral failures, on the ground that his sins are his own business to settle with god, in someone those voters then favor on the ground that those same failures in other people are everybody's business, and that, once elected, he will be sure to make it all the state's business.


Now apply that same hypocrisy to a larger venue than Tennessee, and you get Trump with near-universal support from evangelicals.

 

[Stacyhs]

"some of my best friends are Christians".

Actually that is true.


The next bit might sound odd to most of the Brits here, but is the case where I work - in the UK,


Several of my colleagues who I respect a lot are devout Christians, but they accept evolution and are more "New Testament" than "Old Testament". One in particular is utterly mystified by the views of the fundamentalists - both scientific and political.
He's in the mould of a Socialist Christian as was strong in the Labour party .

More surprisingly for the UK, there are several Young Earth Creationists with views that seem utterly American fundamentalist on most subjects. I believe that there was (or is?) a bible study group at work where they discussed the Bible and Koran with some of the devout Muslims at work (there are probably roughly equal numbers), although most of my colleagues would probably describe themselves as atheist or agnostic. Twenty years ago, they might have ticked "Christian" but probably wouldn't even bother going to church at Christmas.

There is such a stigma in some parts of the US about not being a Christian that this would not surprise me in the slightest. I used to say I was agnostic before realizing that is nothing but an atheist who doesn't want, or isn't ready, to admit it. Not being a Christian in most parts of the US is a death knell for a politician.

 

[Stacyhs]

This, I think. Anyone here remember Scott DesJarlais?



And DesJarlais won reelection in 2016 by 30 points over his Democratic opponent. Apparently, he asked for (and got) god's forgiveness, the implication being that his sins are a matter strictly between him and god. It seems to me to be the very definition of hypocrisy for evangelical (and, presumably, moral) voters to excuse such egregious moral failures, on the ground that his sins are his own business to settle with god, in someone those voters then favor on the ground that those same failures in other people are everybody's business, and that, once elected, he will be sure to make it all the state's business.


Now apply that same hypocrisy to a larger venue than Tennessee, and you get Trump with near-universal support from evangelicals.

That about sums it up. It's amazing how people can twist things to fit into their preferred mold.
I've always been puzzled by the "incest/rape" exception in some abortion laws. Is a child conceived under those circumstances somehow less a child?

 

[Trebuchet]

Here's one that I sometimes wonder about: suppose there comes a revelation that he paid for a mistress to have an abortion.

What's the hit?

We already know that paying to silence a mistress costs him nothing. If we find out he paid for one to have an abortion, how far does it go? What's the over/under on the hit he takes among evangelicals? 20%?

What about the overall? 10%

First, it'll be fake news. Then all THAT SLUT MURDERED THE BABY OF TRUMP, SAVIOR OF AMERICA! AMERICA!

Won't rise as high as 10%. Any evangelicals put off by Trump's immorality have long since quietly left.

 

[acbytesla]

"some of my best friends are Christians".

Actually that is true.


The next bit might sound odd to most of the Brits here, but is the case where I work - in the UK,


Several of my colleagues who I respect a lot are devout Christians, but they accept evolution and are more "New Testament" than "Old Testament". One in particular is utterly mystified by the views of the fundamentalists - both scientific and political.
He's in the mould of a Socialist Christian as was strong in the Labour party .

More surprisingly for the UK, there are several Young Earth Creationists with views that seem utterly American fundamentalist on most subjects. I believe that there was (or is?) a bible study group at work where they discussed the Bible and Koran with some of the devout Muslims at work (there are probably roughly equal numbers), although most of my colleagues would probably describe themselves as atheist or agnostic. Twenty years ago, they might have ticked "Christian" but probably wouldn't even bother going to church at Christmas.

While there are definitely more religious people in the US then there is in Europe and the UK, the numbers here are dwindling rapidly as well . It seems to happen in generations where each following generation has weaker and weaker beliefs.

 

[Mumbles]

No, it's "only" about 80%.

*coughchoughwhiteevangelicalscough*

Seriously, that seems to be the major group on board with him - likely along with anti-abortion Catholics who see that as worth it.

 

[Travis]

The evangelicals have been desperate for anti-abortion judges for years. They will support Trump even if he personally aborts a baby on the White House front lawn so long as he appoints anti abortion judges.

 

[Mumbles]

The evangelicals have been desperate for anti-abortion judges for years. They will support Trump even if he personally aborts a baby on the White House front lawn so long as he appoints anti abortion judges.

In my experience, white evangelicalism has been deeply mixed for decades with white supremacism, "prosperity gospel" nonsense, and the like.

(And I'll grant that non-white evangelicalism has also been infected with prosperity nonsense, but tends to run away screaming from the white supremacism that guys like Falwell and Robertson promoted, for obvious reasons)

 

[Stacyhs]

(Portland OR) Lori Stegmann, a lifelong Republican and County Commissioner announced 2 days ago that she has changed parties and become a Democrat:

Stegmann, 58, said she can sum up the reason for the change with one word: Trump. She added that she "cannot condone the misogyny, the racism, and the unethical and immoral behavior of the current administration."

Stegmann represents District 4 on the Multnomah County Board of Commissioners. That district includes Gresham, Troutdale, Corbett and other small east county communities.

She said she is a political moderate, owing in part to her experience growing up in her district, as a businesswoman working in insurance and as a Republican who admired party greats like Sen. Mark Hatfield and Gov. Tom McCall.

"I have not changed but the Republican Party most certainly has," she said.

"This decision is about who I am, what I believe in and my core values. And if you don't stand for something, then you stand for nothing," Stegmann said.

"I prefer to stand," she said. "And now I stand with the Democrats."

https://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2018/07/republican_racism_spurs_gop_of.html

 

[portlandatheist]

(Portland OR) Lori Stegmann, a lifelong Republican and County Commissioner announced 2 days go that she has changed parties and become a Democrat:







https://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2018/07/republican_racism_spurs_gop_of.html

Awesome.

 

[Stacko]

The evangelicals have been desperate for anti-abortion judges for years. They will support Trump even if he personally aborts a baby on the White House front lawn so long as he appoints anti abortion judges.

It's time to buy low on King David mentions.

 

[Minoosh]

(And I'll grant that non-white evangelicalism has also been infected with prosperity nonsense, but tends to run away screaming from the white supremacism that guys like Falwell and Robertson promoted, for obvious reasons)

In 2005 I traveled with a class of grad students to help guide their news gathering efforts for a newspaper series on Panama. One student was reporting on a social service provided by "evangelicals." Someone winced at that and the student said, "It's OK, they're not mean like they are in the U.S." He was a U.S. Army major and probably the most conservative person on the trip. So even 13 years ago evangelicals had a reputation for being mean.

That's kind of sick.

I have a theory that speaking Spanish requires a relaxed jaw and that puts people in a better mood.