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Bigfoot Follies: part trois

Just caught ten minutes of something called 'Alaska Monsters'
It seemed to involve a gang of men looking like spec ops in combat gear armed with rifles and shotguns wandering around in a dark forest. Their leader looks like Grizzly Adams grandad with a huge white beard.
They were claiming to be surrounded by a whole clan of Bigfoots led by an 'Alpha Clan Leader' they called 'Red Devil'. Lots of whooping and growling 'Ape noises' in the darkness and sound of tree trunks being pounded.
It was filmed in green light, I assume to mimic a night scope of some kind.
They were shouting in a panicked way about 'incoming' and the Devils were 'in the trees throwing rocks at them and that they were surrounded. Lots of crouching, aiming guns and one of them starts shooting randomly in to the trees with his pump shotgun and then some of the others had a shoot as well.
Next morning there was no sign of any 'creature'. They set up a 'bed of nails' trap that looked lethal to any thing or anyone stepping in it and that's where I stopped watching, it was time for the pub.

It all looks great fun.

And in comparison to this a new species of gibbon has been found. From the link:-
"It's difficult to get into the reserve. You have to hike up to above 2,500m to find the gibbons. That's where the good quality forest usually starts - everywhere below there has been logged."
"Then you have to wake up really early in the morning and you listen out for the haunting song of the gibbons, which carries in the forest canopy."
"And when you hear it, you rush through the mud and the mist, and run for hundreds of metres to try and catch up with these gibbons."

Bit different eh?
 
Check your PM. I put it there for you to read.
Thank you. Comments on it to come later.

As I have signed no NDA nor made any express or implied statements in regard to revealing the NDA itself, I may post the text in this thread to make commenting easier. I'll let you have an opportunity first, though, to object if you like and perhaps convince me otherwise.
 
Thank you. Comments on it to come later.

As I have signed no NDA nor made any express or implied statements in regard to revealing the NDA itself, I may post the text in this thread to make commenting easier. I'll let you have an opportunity first, though, to object if you like and perhaps convince me otherwise.

Thank you but I don't think that's necessary. Feel free to post away.
 
NDA Text:
If you tell anyone about the location of the State owned land, which we have decided is our own personal Bigfoot hunting ground, we will sue you.

SUMMATION OF POTENTIAL DAMAGES
We are planning to find a Bigfoot at this location, and if you give away the location, hundreds of Footers will show up, ruining it for us. This is potentially MILLIONS of dollars of revenue that we would be losing if you give this info away.
 
NDA Text:
If you tell anyone about the location of the State owned land, which we have decided is our own personal Bigfoot hunting ground, we will sue you.

SUMMATION OF POTENTIAL DAMAGES
We are planning to find a Bigfoot at this location, and if you give away the location, hundreds of Footers will show up, ruining it for us. This is potentially MILLIONS of dollars of revenue that we would be losing if you give this info away.
Not too far off, but the specifics matter here.
 
Not really, because a judge is going to ask them to prove damages.

It's the same as a non-compete agreement. The plaintiff would have to show that the former employee is actually causing them to lose business, or compete with them.

Except the judge would be expecting some evidence that there is a Bigfoot out there, and The GOOD & PLENTY story isn't going to cut it.
 
Not really, because a judge is going to ask them to prove damages.

It's the same as a non-compete agreement. The plaintiff would have to show that the former employee is actually causing them to lose business, or compete with them.

Except the judge would be expecting some evidence that there is a Bigfoot out there, and The GOOD & PLENTY story isn't going to cut it.
Which gets to what I think is my biggest issue with the NDA. A bit busy this morning, but I'll try to post some comments with the actual NDA later.
 

More Yellowstone footies!

Perfect example of Feynman's warning about fooling oneself.
 
Not really, because a judge is going to ask them to prove damages.

It's the same as a non-compete agreement. The plaintiff would have to show that the former employee is actually causing them to lose business, or compete with them.

Except the judge would be expecting some evidence that there is a Bigfoot out there, and The GOOD & PLENTY story isn't going to cut it.

There is more to this than just the location. We require everyone attending to provide us with emergency contact information for at least two people not attending. Additionally, we gather other personal information such as email, cell phones, etc. and the NDA protects from that information being distributed too.

If Garrett attends, I'm pretty sure he doesn't want his personal cell phone number splashed on the internet for all to see. It goes both ways.

Also Garrett, I forgot to add that there is a liability waiver that is required. I will be more than happy to provide that if you would like to read through it.
 
SRA Non-Disclosure Agreement as provided by Northern Lights via pm to me. Formatting is slightly different for clarity, but otherwise identical:

SRA Non-Disclosure Agreement

This is an agreement between the Sasquatch Research Association LLC (SRA) and You (“You”, “I”, and “Me” referring to the signer of this agreement), where-by the SRA will disclose Confidential Information to You. Confidential Information means any geographic locations, research plans, inventions, and names and personal information of SRA members and contacts made through the SRA. Confidential Information does not include information that is approved by the SRA, in writing, for release.

• I agree not to disclose any Confidential Information (as defined above) to parties outside the SRA, including but not limit the public portions of the SRA website.
Initials:______

• I will promptly return any materials or equipment that have been furnished by the SRA during expeditions or in the course of conducting SRA business before the end of the last official day of the expedition or when required of me by the SRA. If necessary, I will pay for any required costs to return, repair, and/or replace any materials and equipment I borrow, unless other arrangements are made in writing before I take the equipment from the SRA. Initials:______

• This agreement shall last for a period of five years after the end of the expedition or the termination of the relationship between the parties (as applicable).
Initials:______

• Failure to enforce any provision of this Agreement shall not constitute a waiver of any term hereof.
Initials:______

• This agreement shall be governed by and enforced in accordance with the laws of the State of Minnesota and shall be binding upon the Recipient in the United States and worldwide.
Initials:______

I agree that any violation or threatened violation will cause irreparable injury, both financial and strategic, to the SRA and in addition to any and all remedies that may be available, in law, in equity or otherwise, the SRA shall be entitled to injunctive relief against the threatened breach of this Agreement by Me.

Expedition Name (if applicable):__________________________
Expedition Date (if applicable):__________________
Signature:________________________________________ _______ Date:________________________
Full Name (Print):__________________________________________ ________
Address:
Street:___________________________________________ City:___________________________________ State/Provence:________________________________
Postal Code:_____________________________ Country:______________________________________
Phone Number:__________________________________
E-Mail Address:__________________________________________
 
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NL would you be willing to disclose the name of the public land the Bigfoots are located.
Having been down this road before with Chris, I'd love to know if it's a national/state park that I have not visited and may have other interest of mine, if I made the trip.

Sorry, I must have missed this earlier.

I'm not willing to disclose any of the exact locations but I will say that if we use public land, we go to state forests and not state parks. State forests allow for dispersed camping whereas state parks tend to require camping in designated locations. No permit is needed and the "leave no trace" courtesy expected.

We have explored State Wildlife Refuge sites, but camping does require permission from the land manager ahead of time and with so many other sites open, we haven't found it necessary to pursue that.

If I remember correctly, you had an NDA with Chris. Right?
 
Here is the NDA again but in sections with my comments.

SRA Non-Disclosure Agreement

This is an agreement between the Sasquatch Research Association LLC (SRA) and You (“You”, “I”, and “Me” referring to the signer of this agreement), where-by the SRA will disclose Confidential Information to You. Confidential Information means any geographic locations, research plans, inventions, and names and personal information of SRA members and contacts made through the SRA. Confidential Information does not include information that is approved by the SRA, in writing, for release.
The geographic locations bit concerns me, not because I want to reveal their research location but because it isn’t limited to that. It becomes more clear if we remove the other items:

“Confidential Information means any geographic locations of SRA members…”

Read literally, it means I would be prohibited from revealing where I met an SRA member outside the limits of the expedition.

• I agree not to disclose any Confidential Information (as defined above) to parties outside the SRA, including but not limit the public portions of the SRA website.
Initials:______
Typo. Not egregious, and I understand the intent, but if one is asking me to sign away broad rights and agree proactively that a violation constitutes “irreparable injury,” then I think a bit more rigorous proof-reading is in order.


• I will promptly return any materials or equipment that have been furnished by the SRA during expeditions or in the course of conducting SRA business before the end of the last official day of the expedition or when required of me by the SRA. If necessary, I will pay for any required costs to return, repair, and/or replace any materials and equipment I borrow, unless other arrangements are made in writing before I take the equipment from the SRA.
Initials:______
There is no clarification of who determines if something is necessary. There is no apparent allowance for prior condition or fair wear and tear.

• This agreement shall last for a period of five years after the end of the expedition or the termination of the relationship between the parties (as applicable).
Initials:______
This needs a clear definition of both “end of the expedition” and “termination of the relationship.”

• This agreement shall be governed by and enforced in accordance with the laws of the State of Minnesota and shall be binding upon the Recipient in the United States and worldwide.
Initials:______
This is the first and only time that the term “the Recipient” is used in the NDA. It is not used at the start of the document in defining terms that refer to the signer of the document.

I agree that any violation or threatened violation will cause irreparable injury, both financial and strategic, to the SRA and in addition to any and all remedies that may be available, in law, in equity or otherwise, the SRA shall be entitled to injunctive relief against the threatened breach of this Agreement by Me.
A “threatened violation” will cause “irreparable injury?” No. I doubt an actual violation would cause “irreparable injury.” Moreover, as has been pointed out, the extent of injury or damage is traditionally left to the courts to determine. Finally, what is meant by “strategic” injury?


My summarized take:

It is amateurishly put together as if pulled off a DIY legal site and then modified without having a lawyer look at it. As a result of the amateurishness – or possibly intentionally – the proscriptions on the signer of the agreement are both ill-defined and far too broad, not to mention that they stretch into the arena normally left to the determination of a court upon complaint of a breach.



There is more to this than just the location. We require everyone attending to provide us with emergency contact information for at least two people not attending. Additionally, we gather other personal information such as email, cell phones, etc. and the NDA protects from that information being distributed too.
No. The NDA does not provide such protection for the signer.


Northern Lights said:
If Garrett attends, I'm pretty sure he doesn't want his personal cell phone number splashed on the internet for all to see. It goes both ways.
Even without an NDA I would not make personal information or contact information public, but the NDA does not provide that protection for me.

And “Garrette” has an “e” on the end.


Northern Lights said:
Also Garrett, I forgot to add that there is a liability waiver that is required. I will be more than happy to provide that if you would like to read through it.
Yes, please.

To your knowledge, would the research group be willing to sign both an NDA and a liability waiver in return?
 
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Sorry, I must have missed this earlier.

I'm not willing to disclose any of the exact locations but I will say that if we use public land, we go to state forests and not state parks. State forests allow for dispersed camping whereas state parks tend to require camping in designated locations. No permit is needed and the "leave no trace" courtesy expected.

We have explored State Wildlife Refuge sites, but camping does require permission from the land manager ahead of time and with so many other sites open, we haven't found it necessary to pursue that.

If I remember correctly, you had an NDA with Chris. Right?
He did, and that was at a national park, not a forest (state or otherwise). Mammoth Cave National Park has designated camping areas, though some of them are primitive back country sites.

And in case you ask, Cervelo did not reveal the location. Deducing it was not at all hard given the posts about it, including posts by ChrisBFRPKY, particularly those who have been there repeatedly, as I have.
 
Sorry, I must have missed this earlier.

I'm not willing to disclose any of the exact locations but I will say that if we use public land, we go to state forests and not state parks. State forests allow for dispersed camping whereas state parks tend to require camping in designated locations. No permit is needed and the "leave no trace" courtesy expected.

We have explored State Wildlife Refuge sites, but camping does require permission from the land manager ahead of time and with so many other sites open, we haven't found it necessary to pursue that.

If I remember correctly, you had an NDA with Chris. Right?

Not asking for exact locations....other than the name of the public property, something along the lines of "Bigfoot Valley Wildlife Refuge/NP/State Park or whatever" is where the good n plenty contest will be held. That way just as with Chris I could make plans to visit other areas, such as Mammoth Cave NP, which I did while I visited with Chris.
Yes I did sign an NDA with Chris.
But hey it's your gig and you can play it however you like.
 

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