Merged Obama birth certificate CT / SSN CT / Birther discussion Part II

[JayUtah]

Witless trolling is witless

Indeed. If someone wants to avoid the impression of wanton attention-seeking and to pretend to address the topic, he should probably not choose a thread that went on for several dozen pages with most of us participating and thoroughly examining the actual evidence.

 

[Bubba]

Put that fire out didya?

 

[halleyscomet]

I heard some forums have rules about name calling.

Other forums allow name calling when accompanied by discusssion, even fake discussion.

This is a delicate question. I'm not accusing you of anything, but as far as I knew there weren't any Birthers LEFT who aren't racists desperately clinging to a dog-whistle for the racial epitaphs they'd rather be screaming. Are you a racist, or a member of any group or movement, such as a White Pride, KKK or Neo-NAZI variant, that could be construed as racist?

Again, I'm not trying to insult, discredit or attack you personally. I'm asking for the sake of clarification. I'm trying to understand your point of view.

 

[Hans]

b) Witlessly victimized by divide and conquer mind control programming.
My money is on b

"mind control programming" by whom....not, dare I say it....the secret gub'mint you're afraid of is it?

I always have to wonder at the level of organization stupidity as shown by the likes of 'Kyoon's Illuminati'.

The conspiracy masters think this way:

"we want to gain control of the United States by putting our own man into the position of President. To do so we'll pick someone not born in the US despite having 200+ million people we could pick who were born in the USA and then go thru all the hoops and loops necessary to make him seem to be born in the USA then get him elected then have him elected again and then leave office - not having done a thing to promote our evil conspiracy"

Yeah that's the plan.......

 

[halleyscomet]

"mind control programming" by whom....not, dare I say it....the secret gub'mint you're afraid of is it?



I always have to wonder at the level of organization stupidity as shown by the likes of 'Kyoon's Illuminati'.



The conspiracy masters think this way:



"we want to gain control of the United States by putting our own man into the position of President. To do so we'll pick someone not born in the US despite having 200+ million people we could pick who were born in the USA and then go thru all the hoops and loops necessary to make him seem to be born in the USA then get him elected then have him elected again and then leave office - not having done a thing to promote our evil conspiracy"



Yeah that's the plan.......

If the Powers That Be(tm) are as competent as the conspiracy theories make them sound then there's nothing to worry about. They're too stupid to achieve anything.

 

[Elagabalus]

2016 Campaign rhetoric brings up Obama's birthplace.

When then Senator Obama and Tammy Duckworth were speaking in Honolulu, he said (paraphrased) how great America is because Tammy and he can be elected to Washington even though they were both born elsewhere.

The Honolulu Star Advertiser published that back then. The article re-surfaced years later when a 'birther' found it by searching for items mispelled as Barrack.. One day later that article disappeared from the newspaper archives, coming up as '404 not found.'

Same goes for another mispelled as Barrack item in Kenyan paper mentioning their native son elected to US Senate. It disappeared the day after it surfaced.

Also noteworthy;

Two pieces of video footage during his US Senate race with Michele mentioning her 'Kenyan born' husband Barack.

That1991 publisher bio-blurb that said Obama was "born in Kenya and raised in Indonesia and Hawaii." Publisher bio-blurbs are usually written by the author or subject him/herself, not by the publisher.


I smell a cover up.

Then of course the tragic drowning of the Hawaii State Director of whichever dept who would have had access to any files needed to prove or disprove issuance of a bogus birth certificate

Don't you get it? Hillary's the Ringer. Obumma is just the beard.

 

[Bubba]

If the Powers That Be(tm) are as competent as the conspiracy theories make them sound then there's nothing to worry about.

"mind control programming" by whom....not, dare I say it....the secret gub'mint you're afraid of is it?

Probably the same crowd that managed to mostly remove civics, geography, ec, geo-politics etc from public education, and reduce our ballot choices mostly to a two sided coin, and create a commission where the "parties" control the debates, and choose media darlings to moderate etc etc. It goes on. Norman Dodd (among others) spelled it out earlier, and of course they are called cranks.

 

[Bubba]

posted by Bubba;

I heard some forums have rules about name calling.

Other forums allow name calling when accompanied by discussion, even fake discussion.

This is a delicate question. I'm not accusing you of anything, but as far as I knew there weren't any Birthers LEFT who aren't racists desperately clinging to a dog-whistle for the racial epitaphs they'd rather be screaming. Are you a racist, or a member of any group or movement, such as a White Pride, KKK or Neo-NAZI variant, that could be construed as racist?

Nope. We'll be having none of that.

My comment above re name calling was tounge in cheek, referring to something else which has nothing to do with any of what you are asking about.

Again, I'm not trying to insult, discredit or attack you personally. I'm asking for the sake of clarification. I'm trying to understand your point of view.

Re my point of view....

Taking note of circumstantial evidence suggesting Obama's grandparent's and mother possibly were undercover agents of some federal type covert agency is more like it. Trumping racism, if you will.

This implies possibly a sort of manchurian candidate in the oval office, maybe even a bit of a rogue manchurian in his case.

We know such agency families exist. His mother's activities in Indonesia and elsewhere fit profile of foreign student/activist/agent gathering political info and passing names along. The family's travels and activities fit possible undercover profiles. Especially in their era. Mid east, africa, indonesia, pakistan, hawaii, United States Agency for International Development, etc.

All bets are off until that is shown to be false.

Good luck with falsifying it, what with agency type families staying undercover and all.

Most anyone probably could place a birth notice in a Honolulu newspaper back then, let alone covert ops types.

Makes sense they would if he were born elsewhere. Why not start him off as American for its advantages?

 

[Loss Leader]

Taking note of circumstantial evidence suggesting Obama's grandparent's and mother possibly were undercover agents of some federal type covert agency is more like it. Trumping racism, if you will.

This implies possibly a sort of manchurian candidate in the oval office, maybe even a bit of a rogue manchurian in his case.

We know such agency families exist. His mother's activities in Indonesia and elsewhere fit profile of foreign student/activist/agent gathering political info and passing names along. The family's travels and activities fit possible undercover profiles. Especially in their era. Mid east, africa, indonesia, pakistan, hawaii, United States Agency for International Development, etc.

All bets are off until that is shown to be false.

Wrong. It's up to you to provide evidence of your positive claim.

Of course, you can't because: a) it's not true; and b) it's insane.

 

[halleyscomet]

Nope. We'll be having none of that.

My comment above re name calling was tounge in cheek, referring to something else which has nothing to do with any of what you are asking about.





Re my point of view....

Taking note of circumstantial evidence suggesting Obama's grandparent's and mother possibly were undercover agents of some federal type covert agency is more like it. Trumping racism, if you will.

This implies possibly a sort of manchurian candidate in the oval office, maybe even a bit of a rogue manchurian in his case.

We know such agency families exist. His mother's activities in Indonesia and elsewhere fit profile of foreign student/activist/agent gathering political info and passing names along. The family's travels and activities fit possible undercover profiles. Especially in their era. Mid east, africa, indonesia, pakistan, hawaii, United States Agency for International Development, etc.

All bets are off until that is shown to be false.

Good luck with falsifying it, what with agency type families staying undercover and all.

Most anyone probably could place a birth notice in a Honolulu newspaper back then, let alone covert ops types.

Makes sense they would if he were born elsewhere. Why not start him off as American for its advantages?

The long form birth certificate has already been produced. Even Donald Trump has given up the idea that Obama wasn't born in Hawaii.

Besides, what kind of idiot goes to all that trouble over a random kid? The motivation for all the machinations needed for Obama to be foreign born suggest the single dumbest, most wasteful agency in history. You can theorize about comically implausible ways for the theory to be true, but you still fail horribly on motive.

The Birther theory was stupid eight years ago and it's stupid now. You appear too be the only person left who isn't using the dessicated husk of the theory as a dog-whistle for "We can't have a ****** in the WHITE house!" I hope you enjoy the deplorable company and I suggest you not mention your adherence to it where you work unless the chain of command consists largely of KKK members.

 

[Ladewig]

"mind control programming" by whom....not, dare I say it....the secret gub'mint you're afraid of is it?

I always have to wonder at the level of organization stupidity as shown by the likes of 'Kyoon's Illuminati'.

The conspiracy masters think this way:

"we want to gain control of the United States by putting our own man into the position of President. To do so we'll pick someone not born in the US despite having 200+ million people we could pick who were born in the USA and then go thru all the hoops and loops necessary to make him seem to be born in the USA then get him elected then have him elected again and then leave office - not having done a thing to promote our evil conspiracy"

Yeah that's the plan.......

And instead of calling him Lincoln America Washington, we will call him Barack Hussein Obama. And make sure there are photos and records of him attending a Muslim school.

Birtherism is one of the stupidest conspiracies ever. I am talking flat-Earth level stupidity. There is not a single aspect of this conspiracy that is not laughably stupid.

 

[abaddon]

Re my point of view....

Taking note of circumstantial evidence suggesting Obama's grandparent's and mother possibly were undercover agents of some federal type covert agency is more like it. Trumping racism, if you will.

This implies possibly a sort of manchurian candidate in the oval office, maybe even a bit of a rogue manchurian in his case.

We know such agency families exist. His mother's activities in Indonesia and elsewhere fit profile of foreign student/activist/agent gathering political info and passing names along. The family's travels and activities fit possible undercover profiles. Especially in their era. Mid east, africa, indonesia, pakistan, hawaii, United States Agency for International Development, etc.

All bets are off until that is shown to be false.

Good luck with falsifying it, what with agency type families staying undercover and all.

Most anyone probably could place a birth notice in a Honolulu newspaper back then, let alone covert ops types.

Makes sense they would if he were born elsewhere. Why not start him off as American for its advantages?

So in 1961 you claim that covert ops placed a fake birth notice for Obama in the certain knowledge that he would be elected president some 47 years later? Really? You think that's even vaguely plausible?

 

[LSSBB]

So in 1961 you claim that covert ops placed a fake birth notice for Obama in the certain knowledge that he would be elected president some 47 years later? Really? You think that's even vaguely plausible?

Well, if they could destroy all evidence that his mom left the country, they could be capable of anything!

In all realty, let's not even count this discussion as serious anymore. If Trump jumped off the wagon, anyone still clinging to it wants to ride it over the cliff. Just for the lulz.

 

[Hans]

And instead of calling him Lincoln America Washington, we will call him Barack Hussein Obama. And make sure there are photos and records of him attending a Muslim school.

Birtherism is one of the stupidest conspiracies ever. I am talking flat-Earth level stupidity. There is not a single aspect of this conspiracy that is not laughably stupid.

Yeah if you want a 'Manchurian" candidate why not give him that type of name with a spotless Pilgrim or Jamestown middle class working lineage, military service, robust protestant, etc, etc, etc but then the CIA or secret Gub'mint knew the USA would be more liberal in 2008 in the early 1960's...chuckle.

 

[Parsman]

Time travellers. They have to be. Nothing else makes any sense, since they would have to know this child would grow up to become POTUS. Unless of course...aliens

 

[Arisia]

Bubba, you're thinking elements of any bureaucracy (government or corporate) are capable of playing such a long game and successfully carrying it out, really?!?

 

[Bubba]

Wrong. It's up to you to provide evidence of your positive claim.

No positive claim was made. I said possibly/circumstantial. I dont see how it can be ruled out.

Please explain how you know it is not true that Obama's family were not undercover while they worked africa asia etc in their era.

Of course, you can't because: a) it's not true;

Thats a positive claim. Please provide evidence.

and b) it's insane.

Please explain and provide evidence for your positive claims.

 

[Bubba]

Bubba, you're thinking elements of any bureaucracy (government or corporate) are capable of playing such a long game and successfully carrying it out, really?!?

No.

Why need set up such a strawman rather than acknowledge plausibility of a less fantastic scenario.

Speculation:

If his globe trotting 1950s-1960s family were undercover agents, and if he were born elsewhere, they might want to put a birth notice in a local paper for advantages of US citizenship, and they'd know how to pull it off.


I can imagine where it is a common practice in some 'communities' ie agencies where people regularly live and work abroad, especially where manipulating international events is part of the job.

At that point, faking birthplaces would practically be mere talk around the water cooler. Fake documentation is just one department in their business. Practically routine. Possible.
.

 

[JayUtah]

Possible.
.

Not something you could say if you had actually read this thread.

 

[Bubba]

So in 1961 you claim that covert ops placed a fake birth notice for Obama in the certain knowledge that he would be elected president some 47 years later? Really? You think that's even vaguely plausible?

Sigh. There you go again. Flying off the handle......"So in 1961 you claim...". Sorry, no cigar.


Do not attempt to put words in my mouth. Dismantling your strawmen is tedious.


Did it occur to you there could be a less fantastic possibility?


I said '... Makes sense they would if he were born elsewhere. Why not start him off as American for its advantages? '.


On the other hand there is some cause to speculate that people like Dunham (related to some past presidents) might possibly entertain hopes for their progeny, as we are told Dunham's distant cousins include six U.S. presidents.

Time travellers. They have to be. Nothing else makes any sense, since they would have to know this child would grow up to become POTUS. Unless of course...aliens

See above.

What do you guys think of how you tend to attempt to foist strawmen by trying to put words in someone's mouth, rather than face what is plausible?


I'm saying it is hardly a stretch to speculate that if his family were agents, they could reasonably want their son/grandson to be american born if he was not, and they would know how to get it done routinely in that line of work.


BTW, I cannot prove where he was born, no matter what anyone says. No one can prove beyond doubt where he was born.

As comforting as the Full Faith and Credit clause apparently may be for some, I cannot convince myself that it is immune to corruption. Who can ?
.