Beyond confirming his death, hard to see adding information to the conundrum.
Angelika Graswald
- Thread starter anglolawyer
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anglolawyer
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Thanks shuttit.
Still a lot of info behind a paywall it seems, which is a pity. Did you see the part where she said the waves were as high as a person. From my extremely limited experience, I can imagine that being very frightening and challenging. The pro-kayakers said it was not a day to be out on the water. This is looking more and more like a regular accident that some supposedly abnormal behaviour and police skulduggery have turned into something more.
Tending to agree, but more real information on the "fickle" Hudson river conditions would help. Wind against tide or current suddenly can be catastrophic. She is 5 feet and he 6 feet plus.
anglolawyer
Banned
I have kayaked against the tide and wind once and found it very hard work, augmented by the fact that I did not really have the skill to keep the boat going straight. But that was nothing like what she described.
The other funny thing about her plan is that it seems to have involved her own potential demise, since she went in the very cold water too and only had a buoyancy aid which, presumably only prevents you from sinking rather than freezing.
Why haven't we heard the 911 call yet? This is the US where everything happens on live TV. In fact, there should be footage of the whole thing starting the week before
Desert Fox
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I have kayaked against the tide and wind once and found it very hard work, augmented by the fact that I did not really have the skill to keep the boat going straight. But that was nothing like what she described.
The other funny thing about her plan is that it seems to have involved her own potential demise, since she went in the very cold water too and only had a buoyancy aid which, presumably only prevents you from sinking rather than freezing.
Why haven't we heard the 911 call yet? This is the US where everything happens on live TV. In fact, there should be footage of the whole thing starting the week before
My one kayaking adventure was in a calm lake in Orlando Florida, nothing like that either.
I have sailed in weather something like that. Large sailboat in a powerful thunderstorm. I was pretty dumb in that I did not put my life vest on when should have.
Discussed it with my sailing partner and we decided that the first thing to do when a storm approaches is to put on vests. Once the storm hit, we were too busy keeping everything safe.
anglolawyer
Banned
Probably worse is tide going one way and wind the other.
That was the point I meant with crazy chop. I do doubt waves as tall as people though,
anglolawyer
Banned
That was the point I meant with crazy chop. I do doubt waves as tall as people though,
Hey, check out the footage here. This gives an idea of the conditions on the day.
More detail and opinion.
...............................................................................................................................................................
Viafore also lacked protective clothing such as a wetsuit or a drysuit.
"I certainly would not be out on the Hudson River in 47-degree water without a dry suit on, that's asking for trouble," hypothermia expert Gordon Giesbrecht, PhD, professor of thermophysiology at the University of Manitoba in Winnipeg, Canada, tells PEOPLE.
According to Giesbrecht, people immediately experience a cold-shock response when they hit 47-degree water – a gasp followed by hyperventilation of rapid, shallow breathing lasting from 30 seconds to 90 seconds. Then comes cold incapacitation, when muscles and nerves get colder and strength and coordination diminishes.
"Your fingers and hands become weaker within minutes," Giesbrecht says. "It would make it hard for him to hold onto the boat."
http://www.people.com/article/kayak-murder-angelika-graswald-case-experts
anglolawyer
Banned
Gee, you let this go to sleep? I guess everybody missed this:
Whatever, I am calling BS on the Graswald case. She did not murder Vince Viafore. I suspect it will turn out she is just a little weird and said something the cops took awry. Think about it - she was not in control of the unpredictable weather, removing the plug would not sink the boat, she was not in control either of his decision not to wear a dry or a wet suit, or his decision to paddle while drunk. She also went into the water and might easily have died too.
The only details of 'the confession' we have so far are that she said she felt glad when she knew he would not make it. That's not enough.
It's the same case but without the murder part.
Whatever, I am calling BS on the Graswald case. She did not murder Vince Viafore. I suspect it will turn out she is just a little weird and said something the cops took awry. Think about it - she was not in control of the unpredictable weather, removing the plug would not sink the boat, she was not in control either of his decision not to wear a dry or a wet suit, or his decision to paddle while drunk. She also went into the water and might easily have died too.
The only details of 'the confession' we have so far are that she said she felt glad when she knew he would not make it. That's not enough.
Desert Fox
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There is nothing new with regards to anything. . . .I think most of us agree that it is a garbage case (would prefer a strong case) but too many people are convicted on garbage evidence.
Welcome back Anglo , let us solve this.
It is not easy to keep threads rolling, but I agree this one is worthy. Black widow or lovelorn and jailed?
The pattern favours innocence, but insufficient data yet??
anglolawyer
Banned
Oh, I agree it's too soon to be asserting anything too positively so I'm taking a small gamble on this one. Of course, if there is a clear and unequivocal confession given in appropriate conditions (taped, professionally advised etc) then so be it.
Thanks for the welcome.
The welcome is easy, but hell, are we three months older?? damn. We won't get that back.
Desert Fox
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I am crossposting this from the Amanda Knox thread - Autopsy report which might as well be a fantasy novel.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/11/n...says-kayaker-was-victim-of-homicide.html?_r=0
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/11/n...says-kayaker-was-victim-of-homicide.html?_r=0
It seems it would be a very unreliable way to plan it as a homicide, as the hole the plug closes is not nearly big enough to take on enough water. The plug looks like a red herring, and it seems possible only that she failed to help him. His blood alcohol was significant, at .066, but maybe not enough to make the difference.
anglolawyer
Banned
For 'failing to help him' to amount to a crime she would need to be under a positive duty to help in the first place and, generally speaking, no such duty exists. If you see someone drowning in the canal as you walk by you can just watch if you like. There is no obligation to do anything at all.
catsmate
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Yep that "report" is rubbish.