Michael Brown Shooting

[Skeptic Ginger]

Most reports are it was a car, one did say truck.

In Johnson's first interview with the press the day it happened he said, "truck, car" correcting himself. It looked like it might have been an SUV but this is another red herring.

That's from Dorian Johnson's account, the anonymous one never claimed to witness that part and I don't recall the woman mentioning that. However Johnson said it was that the officer let go after first grabbing his neck and then his shirt and then said he'd shoot.

One witness, Tiffany Mitchell, said she didn't see the beginning of the altercation. That might be this anonymous witness. When she saw Brown he was trying to get away from the cop that had hold of Brown through the vehicle window. The first shot was fired then.

Incidentally, here's something I just found: Dorian Johnson told police and FBI about the cigarillos. Recall that he wasn't interviewed by police initially, it was a couple days after his media interview that he officially talked with police

I had heard this earlier, Johnson never denied the theft.

 

[newyorkguy]

Is the storekeeper wondering when the hell are the cops going to arrest Johnson for accessory to robbery?

In all seriousness the storekeeper looked Indian-American to me. If he is he probably now regrets calling the police in the first place.

 

[Upchurch]

FWIW, Chief Jackson: The convenience store robbery and Michael Brown shooting not connected

 

[marplots]

Sounds like a definition is needed. And remember this is a skeptics forum.

Is a "typical cop" anything like a "typical black person" or a "typical Mexican"?

I ran into a typical black Mexican cop once. He spoke Spanish and I paid 500 Pesos to get out of a ticket. I'm not sure if that amount was typical or not.

 

[Unabogie]

You do understand that it is illegal to walk down the middle of the street, right? So the officer was within his rights to tell them to get on the sidewalk. I'm sure we can all agree on that.

On a residential street? When is that ever enforced? Oh, wait, maybe that's what the Ferguson police have been doing all week. Doing their best to stop unlawful middle street walking.

That's what some people are saying.

Yes, there are three witnesses to this. Are they all lying? Is it a grand conspiracy?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Correct. The officer in question did not know about the alleged robbery.

As for Dorian Johnson's story, the police said about him:

So I'm not sure why any of this would call his honesty into question.

If anything it makes Johnson look more honest. His friend stole cigarillos and Johnson refused to go along with it.

 

[dudalb]

And if this goes to trial* then the cop will argue that he was just emptying the magazine, like they taught him at the academy.

*hahahahahahahahaaa

Pretty clear your mind is made up,and nothing will change it.

 

[Lerxst]

The law is often not black and white, which is why we have the judicial branch. Many of you seem to be steadfast in your assertion that the law, when applied to the facts in this case, will come up with a black and white answer. All one has to do is observe to see that is not the case. What it will often come down to is what is reasonable for us to believe, since we can't ask Michael Brown what was going through his head on that day.

Is it reasonable to believe that Michael Brown could have reacted in a not so friendly way when stopped by the police? At first, not knowing about the robbery, I would say no that is not reasonable. Is it reasonable to think he would react in a not so friendly way towards the officer if he thinks he is about to be arrested for robbery? Yes, that is reasonable.

Is it reasonable to believe that the officer shot an unarmed man (he was 18, and 6' 4" after all), execution style, in broad daylight in the middle of the street? No, that is not reasonable to me. Is it reasonable to believe the officer panicked when Brown panicked, things got out of control, poor decisions were made due to the stress of the situation, and Michael Brown ends up dead? That to me is very reasonable.

 

[dudalb]

On a residential street? When is that ever enforced? Oh, wait, maybe that's what the Ferguson police have been doing all week. Doing their best to stop unlawful middle street walking.





Yes, there are three witnesses to this. Are they all lying? Is it a grand conspiracy?

Your inability to see things except through a ideological filter is truly instructive.
You made up your mind about this case a few minutes after it broke,and you will not change it.

Same mentality that makes me dislike the Tea party so much,fraknly.

 

[LTC8K6]

FWIW, Chief Jackson: The convenience store robbery and Michael Brown shooting not connected

Yes, but Brown surely must have been agitated at being stopped by a cop right after robbing a store...

I can't see how you'd grab Brown by the neck from the seat height of your average car. He's tall.

It must have been a high vehicle.

 

[casebro]

Yes, but Brown surely must have been agitated at being stopped by a cop right after robbing a store...

I can't see how you'd grab Brown by the neck from the seat height of your average car. He's tall.

It must have been a high vehicle.

Or Brown was going in at the cop.

 

[Distracted1]

Not that I care about your respect, but I was referring to the subset of cops who shoot unarmed suspects fleeing or not. Do they or do they not predictably claim the suspect was going for a gun? And is it or is it not sometimes found that is a self preservation lie?

Not that it is necessarily relevant to this incident. But I don't expect them to wait until they have reached the pearly gates to find out that the item in the hand of the man who just tried to beat the **** out of them was not a can of diet coke.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Odd. I thought the report was that he was on the medical call and left it when he heard the radio call about the robbery.

Transcript is not clear but it seems like the officer had to have heard the call on the radio.

"So I just want to give you a little time line of what happened on August 9th. From 11:48 to noon, the officer involved in the shooting was on a sick call in Glen Arc. There was an ambulance present. At 11:51 there was a 911 call from a convenience store nearby, not this one. At 11:52 dispatch gave a description of robbery suspect over the radio. A different officer arrived at the store, where the strong-arm robbery occurred. A further description, more detail, was given over the radio and stated the officer was walking toward (sic), or the suspect was walking toward QuikTrip. Our officer left the sick call, he encountered the, I'm sorry. At 12:01 p.m., our officer encountered Michael Brown on Canfield"

What was that comment upstream claiming I was sticking to my narrative in spite of the evidence?

Shouldn't you give the whole story here instead of just your cherry picked quote?

The chief answered a direct question from a reporter: did the officer know about the robbery? No he did not. The stop was because the suspect didn't get on the sidewalk when told to.

And that is corroborated by the way the officer approached Brown.

 

[332nd]

I agree too. But I have a feeling the nut left may not like what they wished for.

Irrelevant. I'm looking at this as an issue of safety for everyone involved.

 

[Upchurch]

Yes, but Brown surely must have been agitated at being stopped by a cop right after robbing a store...

I can't see how you'd grab Brown by the neck from the seat height of your average car. He's tall.

It must have been a high vehicle.

Or Brown was bending down to look into the car at Wilson. I don't know. I just thought the new conference was relevant to the discussion. Except for the "FWIW", my post was just the title of the page I linked to.

 

[Unabogie]

Your inability to see things except through a ideological filter is truly instructive.
You made up your mind about this case a few minutes after it broke,and you will not change it.

Same mentality that makes me dislike the Tea party so much,fraknly.

Oh, please feel free to demonstrate this. I have pointed out that:

a) The crime that has recently been alleged is a minor crime, involving cigarillos.
b) The police neglected to mention this and in fact have stated it's unrelated to anything that happened that day.
c) There are three witnesses to what happened, and only one of the was with the victim that day.
d) I have never in my life had police tell people to get out of the street on a residential street (in fact, that's where I did all my baseball playing as a kid)

How did you arrive that I'm acting like a Tea Partier from that?

 

[dudalb]

Oh, please feel free to demonstrate this. I have pointed out that:

a) The crime that has recently been alleged is a minor crime, involving cigarillos.
b) The police neglected to mention this and in fact have stated it's unrelated to anything that happened that day.
c) There are three witnesses to what happened, and only one of the was with the victim that day.
d) I have never in my life had police tell people to get out of the street on a residential street (in fact, that's where I did all my baseball playing as a kid)

How did you arrive that I'm acting like a Tea Partier from that?

Well,that before any details came out you were taking the "Poor Innocent Black Kid Shot By the Evil Racist Cops" line has something to do with it.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

FWIW, Chief Jackson: The convenience store robbery and Michael Brown shooting not connected

Thank you, I was trying to find the video or the transcript.

At ~2:30 seconds in, "it was not related". Again at ~6:30, "he didn't [know]" referring to Wilson knowing about the robbery. The stop was for "walking down the street blocking traffic".

The only thing suggesting the cop might have heard the report, the chief said he didn't hear what the officer said to the county when asked if he'd heard about the robbery. But the initial stop was not related to the robbery.

 

[LTC8K6]

What was that comment upstream claiming I was sticking to my narrative in spite of the evidence?

Shouldn't you give the whole story here instead of just your cherry picked quote?

The chief answered a direct question from a reporter: did the officer know about the robbery? No he did not. The stop was because the suspect didn't get on the sidewalk when told to.

I said he had to hear the call on the radio, I didn't say anything else.

My posts concern the calls on the radio, of which there were at least two.

Just because the initial stop was not related to the robbery, doesn't mean that the officer didn't make the connection to the radio calls during the encounter.

 

[jimbob]

As an aside, why is jaywalking considered an offence in so many parts of the US?