“Woke”

[SpuriusMaximus]

Do you have a black friend?

Sure, tell us more. Like exactly why do you have to bring up your imaginary black friend so much? And is he even actually aware of being your friend? Did you actually ask him what he wants, or do you just presume that you can do the age of colonialism thing and speak for him? There's a reason why "I'm not racist, I have a black friend" is not a positive stereotype. So sit down and enlighten us why you feel some need to write THAT trope so compulsively

 

[Donal]

It's not from "nowhere", it came from a dialect of English sometimes called African-American Vernacular English (AAVE). It has since taken on additional baggage since crossing into other dialects of English. As a word and as a concept it probably does not deserve the level of hatred directed at it.

damn it, why did you have to spoil the fun of white people trying to define woke? I mean the irony of some of these comments was delicious.

 

[bluesjnr]

I was asking you if you had a black friend. That was before I learned you were German and sadly didn't have the opportunity to. Now I'm asking because it obviously ticks you off and I find that funny.

I think you need to re-read HansMustermanns response. He seems to be expanding on the point you made.

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

I was asking you if you had a black friend. That was before I learned you were German and sadly didn't have the opportunity to. Now I'm asking because it obviously ticks you off and I find that funny.

And I'm asking YOU right back if you've actually asked that supposed black friend what he actually wants, or you're just doing the 19'th century thing of just assuming you're entitled to speak in his name. "Mission to civilize" and all that...

Because we've reached the point where, as I've provided a link before, actual people who are blacks, women or both, are asking the white saviour types to go away and stop speaking in their name.

Or you know that new anti-woke (or more accurately, free of woke stuff) comic that was discussed even on this board? That's not made by some some white southern nazi, it's made by a BLACK guy, and otherwise quite outspoken AGAINST the entertainment industry's being out to "beat people over the head with stuff like social justice." (Author's own words.) That's right, we're at the point where a black guy would rather make his own comic, FREE of the BS you guys are pushing in his name. Meanwhile the supposedly progressive white saviour types were actually trying to cancel him for it.

THAT is the point we've got to with that pseudo-progressive keyboard-warrior nonsense, regardless of whether you want to call it "woke" or any other name. It's no longer even trying to actually be an ally, it's being the annoying guy sitting at the bar next to a big black guy and trying to pick a fight for him.

 

[catsmate]

Is it just me, or do others here when they see the word “woke" to describe people or institutions see it as shorthand for “I don't like people telling me I shouldn't hate on blacks and treat women as sex objects”?

<>

I'm interested in hearing the thoughts of others on this.

Yes. Basically it's an admission of suppressed bigotry.

 

[Suddenly]

I added “politically correct” as a tag because, in contrast to “woke,” I view it as inclusiveness gone wild, to the degree where it's used a cudgel to shut down discussion because some snowflake somewhere might be offended. Certainly having one's ideas being challenged can sting, but people should be encouraged to separate criticism of their ideas from criticism of their person.

It's the same thing. These are mostly benign concepts that are about being aware of how the way we behave supports and reinforces inequality and maybe we should stop being oblivious and make some changes.

Then people who are benefiting from inequality feel all attacked and sad that they aren't the center of attention and start using the terms as pejoratives. Largely justifying this by focusing on the most aggressive use of these concepts, some of which are real but most somewhere between overexaggerated distortions and flat out urban legends.

We see the same with pretty much any term that addresses inequality. CRT, intersectionality, representation, privilege etc.

 

[Armitage72]

Don't forget "Get Woke, Go Broke", often directed at companies like Marvel/Disney, who have the nerve to create movies and TV shows with stars who aren't straight white men, obviously condemning them to inevitable financial ruin.

 

[uke2se]

And I'm asking YOU right back if you've actually asked that supposed black friend what he actually wants, or you're just doing the 19'th century thing of just assuming you're entitled to speak in his name. "Mission to civilize" and all that...

Because we've reached the point where, as I've provided a link before, actual people who are blacks, women or both, are asking the white saviour types to go away and stop speaking in their name.

Or you know that new anti-woke (or more accurately, free of woke stuff) comic that was discussed even on this board? That's not made by some some white southern nazi, it's made by a BLACK guy, and otherwise quite outspoken AGAINST the entertainment industry's being out to "beat people over the head with stuff like social justice." (Author's own words.) That's right, we're at the point where a black guy would rather make his own comic, FREE of the BS you guys are pushing in his name. Meanwhile the supposedly progressive white saviour types were actually trying to cancel him for it.

THAT is the point we've got to with that pseudo-progressive keyboard-warrior nonsense, regardless of whether you want to call it "woke" or any other name. It's no longer even trying to actually be an ally, it's being the annoying guy sitting at the bar next to a big black guy and trying to pick a fight for him.

Those are a lot of words just to say that you don't have a black friend.

I like the "It's a BLACK GUY" trope included there though.

 

[Lothian]

Woke seems a quicker way of saying "political correctness gone mad".
It always is presented and a negative or silly position as opposed to a rational one. It is a bullying term used to belittle people. I find my default is to be against anyone using the term.

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Thos are a lot of words just to say that you don't have a black friend.

So... you dodged any actual question, go back to just insisting that yeah but you have a black friend as if that gives you more street cred? Heh.

See, I'm not the one going "but I have a black friend", nor giving a flip about whether you believe I have one or not. Not in this thread, nor in the other. YOU on the other hand feel some compulsive need to plaster that claim about yourself across more than one page and thread.

I'm literally saying I haven't yet seen a case of anyone insisting that no, they're totally progressive because they have a black friend, who wasn't using it to cover for their being a closet racist. There's a reason why that's a stereotype. Maybe you're the first one where that doesn't apply. I suppose there has to be a first for everything. Or maybe not

So yeah, continue hammering on how you're totally on the blacks' side because you have a black friend. Heh. Yeah, that'll convince me it's not the usual case

 

[uke2se]

So... you dodged any question, go back to insisting that you have a black friend as if that gives you more street cred? Heh.

See, I'm not the one going "but I have a black friend", nor giving a flip about whether you believe I have one or not. Not in this thread, nor in the other. YOU on the other hand feel some compulsive need to plaster that claim about yourself across more than one page and thread.

I'm literally saying I haven't yet seen a case of anyone insisting that no, they're totally progressive because they have a black friend, who wasn't using it to cover for their being a closet racist. There's a reason why that's a stereotype. Maybe you're the first one where that doesn't apply. I suppose there has to be a first for everything. Or maybe not

So yeah, continue hammering on how you're totally on the blacks' side because you have a black friend. Heh. Yeah, that'll convince me it's not the usual case

Lots of emojis and angriness. Would you like a black friend?

 

[JoeMorgue]

*Raises hand* Hey is anyone even going to pretend this isn't just going to be the "Cancel Culture" and "CTR" threads again?

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Lots of emojis and angriness. Would you like a black friend?

So, your contribution is still just trolling and baiting? Gee, what a surprise that that's still all the intellectual contribution you can provide

And no, friends are not something that you get just to tick some checkbox. You have to have some connection with someone, not just have a name on some social media list, and not just because they'd fill some diversity quota. So no thanks, I'll find my own friends.

Which is why I'm suspecting that your supposed black "friend" doesn't even know he's your "friend". (And imagine me doing some very conspicuous Dr Evil style air quotes there.) It's probably just some guy who didn't yet tell you to shut up at the smoking area. Sure seems that way with the other people who think that saying they have one proves some kind of street cred.

 

[Darat]

*Raises hand* Hey is anyone even going to pretend this isn't just going to be the "Cancel Culture" and "CTR" threads again?

I could try.

There are three "real" meanings 1) that originates in the black English speaking culture of the USA, 2) one that has been culturally appropriated from the black English speaking culture of the USA and 3) one which means "them".

 

[Brainster]

Woke is essentially equivalent to sanctimonious. Note that several of the woke defenders around here have referred to their superior moral code.

 

[Thermal]

damn it, why did you have to spoil the fun of white people trying to define woke? I mean the irony of some of these comments was delicious.

The Monkey's definition is an assumption. Its not like it's historical breakdown and usage is a matter of demonstrable fact.

We could just as easily assert that "woke" was popularized by someone who was functionally illiterate, or worse: someone who thought "this is how them black people talk".

 

[Suddenly]

*Raises hand* Hey is anyone even going to pretend this isn't just going to be the "Cancel Culture" and "CTR" threads again?

Of course it is. It's all the exact same dynamic about the same subject matter.

 

[wareyin]

Was Cracker Barrel (old southern americana barn/country store style restaurant chain well known for discriminatory hiring practices) "woke" for simply adding plant based sausage to the menu?

(note, Cracker Barrel didn't "push" plant based sausage on anyone, even the NYPost article title is exaggerating the restaurant's actions to make them seem more in your face than they really were)

 

[Thermal]

Of course it is. It's all the exact same dynamic about the same subject matter.

It could be, if you're an out of touch white guy who lumps all "black people stuff" in the same pile. Is that really the discussion level here?

 

[Darat]

The Monkey's definition is an assumption. Its not like it's historical breakdown and usage is a matter of demonstrable fact.
We could just as easily assert that "woke" was popularized by someone who was functionally illiterate, or worse: someone who thought "this is how them black people talk".

It is, as much as any other dialect use is. It was a refrain reminding other black people to be aware of the dangers they faced as black people in the USA, especially in regards to the police - it was originally used as "stay woke".