Why is homosexuality wrong?

[Dan Beaird]

Meet the New Boss...

...The agenda of the homosexual activists is clear. They will not rest until all organized opposition to their behavior and lifestyle is silenced...

I, for one, welcome our new homosexual masters.

Would you please cite for me any piece of active or proposed legislation that promotes homosexuality to a favored position above that of heterosexuality.

 

[DoubtingStephen]

The legalization and forced acceptance of homosexuality is the principal threat to religious freedom.

False. It is the principal threat to religious totalitarianism.

Nobody is forcing you to be gay, nobody is forcing you to say that you like gay people. What is happening is that your ancient superstitions are no longer being accepted as a way of legitimizing your bigotry.

You are still free to believe the most pathetically idiotic drivel you can find in any ancient manuscript from a primitive genocidal warring tribe. You just are no longer free to impose this blatantly obvious idiocy on everyone else. You are not losing your religious freedom, everyone else is gaining theirs.

My freedom of religion is defined by freedom from your religion.

The tragic reality is that the homosexual activists are winning and we are losing.

One man's tragedy is another man's joy. At least you admit your total and utter defeat. Isn't there a word for someone that loses?

Many folks say that the loud wailing we hear from Christian Fundamentalist is actually the death throes of a useless and outmoded collection of obviously preposterous ancient fairy tales. I may have embellished that slightly, but it is a charming and delicious thought.

Kids today live in a reality-based world. Centuries ago when a farm animal was ill those afflicted with religious beliefs could sell their phony wares by suggesting prayer might save the creature. With two possible results both potential answers were ready, either Jeebus heard your prayer, or it was not God's will. This was handy because sometimes an ill creature gets better on its own, and the fairy tale system could take the credit.

Today kids are more likely to be concerned about a broken iPod. Try telling a modern teenager to pray that his iPod will be healed by Jeebus. You'll be laughed right out of the room, as you certainly should be. Or try doing it yourself. Our modern technological world has made one thing perfectly clear, nothing fails like prayer.

Education and science are the natural enemies of religion. Once the church lost their battle to keep science suppressed it was all downhill from there. Science deals in reality while religion deals exclusively with fiction. Prayer can not put a man on the moon, repair an iPod, rid a poorly designed computer operating system of viruses, or do anything else at all, useful or religious.

Have you ever re-inflated a flat tire with prayer? Fixed a broken dishwasher with prayer? Exactly how useless is your Imaginary Bearded Sky Daddy?

So I have a suggestion for you. Obviously the campaigns of anti-gay slander are not working to hold back the inevitable tide of social progress. Obviously the frequently exposed lies of ex-gay frauds are not working. Obviously, as you admit, you are losing and reality and tolerance are winning.

It's time to pull out your ace of spades, your super weapon. It's time to put us gol darn homos in our place. I suggest you use the most powerful weapon in your entire fairy tale arsenal. Why don't you pray that society will return to the good old days of brutal repression of the homosexual minority?

If you think your Imaginary Bearded Sky Daddy is so big and powerful and butch and nasty, why don't you get him to help?

 

[NobbyNobbs]

Kinda gives a whole new dimension to the phrase "hung on the cross," doesn't it?

"You shifty ******, they said you was hung!"
"And they was right!"

LEGAL immigrants should be required to speak English because it is America's national language.

Incorrect. America (or more accurately, the United States) does not have an official language.

And if you want to play that game, perhaps we should all start learning Navajo.

These parasites have no respect for the law or the United States and they steal American's jobs.

Find me one US citizen who couldn't get a job washing dishes or picking apples because they were all taken by immigrants. Just one.

Seeing as they are not citizens (and dont deserve to be either), they do not have any rights, including the right to be here.

Bolding mine.

Allow me to quote from a document that's fairly famous around these parts.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness..."

No prerequisite of citizenship mentioned there.

Christians who doubt that the homosexual agenda is a genuine threat to religious liberty need only consider employees in major corporations who are judged to be uncooperative and thus terminated or turned down for promotion, because they will not serve on a committee planning a "gay" awareness day or refuse to display a rainbow flag on their cubicle.

Cite?

You could make the arbitrary decision to be gay; as has been made clear by XenonII, being gay is strictly a matter of choice.

It's also a deadly behaviour, shortening the life expectancy of the participants by decades but they never teach that, do they? Smoking is a learned behavior. Alcoholism is a learned behavior. Drug addictions are a learned behavior. All are deadly, like AIDS and other diseases spread by homosexuality.

First of all, AIDS affects people other than homosexuals. Just yesterday, in fact, I heard a report that the single greatest cause of the spread of AIDS in Latin America is the taboo against condoms imposed by the Catholic church. How do you like them apples?

Secondly, as DoubtingStephen has pointed out, you seem to believe that homosexuality is a choice. Fine, let's test that theory. I'd like to see if you can choose to be homosexual for, say, half an hour or so. Not just say you are, not even have man-to-man sex. Just honestly and unabashedly, in your deepest of hearts, choose to be attracted to the same sex. Just for half an hour.

Not willing to try the test? Afraid you'll burn in hell? Try this then. Find one...just one...homosexual who claims to have actively chosen to be so.

This, I gotta see.

 

[NobbyNobbs]

duplicate post

 

[zombiebex]

PS - It's only wrong because it's feared. I don't understand *why* people fear it, but they do. Once you rid them of that fear, they no longer consider it a sin. Now, left-handed bagpipe players, on the other hand, we are to be feared. We're after you!

Homosexuality in men is feared because of anal sex and the possibility of ass-rape. The very idea that a man can be raped by another man completely and utterly terrifies (and secretly excites) a lot of these people.

After all, being a rape victim is something only a woman should be. If a big, strong, penis wielding man can also be raped, can be lowered to this standard of a female, well then that's just bedlam! It goes against the clearly defined black and white definitions and roles of male and female. Females are supposed to possess sexuality, men are supposed to take it. They aren't supposed to have it to begin with. Homosexuality throws this all into whack. Scary!

 

[DoubtingStephen]

Homosexuality in men is feared because of anal sex and the possibility of ass-rape. The very idea that a man can be raped by another man completely and utterly terrifies (and secretly excites) a lot of these people.

I think you got it right. Whenever we see Fundie trolls ranting and raving about homosexuality it is always anal sex that they mention. Often they make the claim that male on male anal sex is literally the definition of homosexuality. In reality they are not defining homosexuality, just telling us about their most secret fear.

If Darth Cheney wanted to torture one of these people he would not have to bother with his beloved waterboard, just some gay porn and they'd be reduced to Jello-brand gelatin dessert.

The ridiculous ancient fairy tales are trotted out to justify their homophobia, but what they are really afraid of is the loss of their patriarchal power structure.

It is widely believed that those who protest the most are also the ones that spend the most secret time in deep, dark fantasies of exactly what they fear.

This sort of twisted, self-destructive agony leads to the kind of exaggerated hate-mongering we have seen in this thread.

I wish the gurl would just go get laid and leave us civilized people alone.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

These parasites have no respect for the law or the United States and they steal American's jobs.

Because the first whites to come to the States had so much respect for the locals and their land, culture, language, territory, needs, and, most of all, life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness.

As opposed to the new immigrants, who'll be the death of us all and turn our culture upside down and etc. etc. etc.

Homosexuality in men is feared because of anal sex and the possibility of ass-rape. The very idea that a man can be raped by another man completely and utterly terrifies (and secretly excites) a lot of these people.

Not to mention the fact that men can be raped by women.

In what way is this explanation falsifiable???

[XenonII mode]Why, it's obvious!!11[/XenonII mode]

 

[JetLeg]

Homosexuality in men is feared because of anal sex and the possibility of ass-rape. The very idea that a man can be raped by another man completely and utterly terrifies (and secretly excites) a lot of these people.

After all, being a rape victim is something only a woman should be. If a big, strong, penis wielding man can also be raped, can be lowered to this standard of a female, well then that's just bedlam! It goes against the clearly defined black and white definitions and roles of male and female. Females are supposed to possess sexuality, men are supposed to take it. They aren't supposed to have it to begin with. Homosexuality throws this all into whack. Scary!

Uh...

In what way is this explanation falsifiable???

 

[Lonewulf]

Homosexuality in men is feared because of anal sex and the possibility of ass-rape. The very idea that a man can be raped by another man completely and utterly terrifies (and secretly excites) a lot of these people.

After all, being a rape victim is something only a woman should be. If a big, strong, penis wielding man can also be raped, can be lowered to this standard of a female, well then that's just bedlam! It goes against the clearly defined black and white definitions and roles of male and female. Females are supposed to possess sexuality, men are supposed to take it. They aren't supposed to have it to begin with. Homosexuality throws this all into whack. Scary!

Er, that's nice speculation, but I'm afraid that's all I really honestly see it as...

Though I admit, a large chick with a strap-on dildo can be damn scary!

 

[ponderingturtle]

Er, that's nice speculation, but I'm afraid that's all I really honestly see it as...

Though I admit, a large chick with a strap-on dildo can be damn scary!

How scary or sexy that is depends entirely on person preferences.

I have often wondered in more heterosexual men enjoy anal stimulation than homosexual men, just because of the higher number of heterosexuals.

 

[MajikPiG]

LEGAL immigrants should be required to speak English because it is America's national language.

I'm sorry, and somebody may have asked this already, but what law made English the national language of the United States of America? Or is it some other America we're talking about here?

-Matt

 

[Darat]

Of course English is the national language of the USA, that's why the Bible was written in English.... oh.... right... I'll get my coat.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

I'm sorry, and somebody may have asked this already, but what law made English the national language of the United States of America?

Yes. Which means I won't get to point out the fact that there were, in certain parts of Houston, road signs in some Asian language rather than English.

 

[bruto]

Uh...

In what way is this explanation falsifiable???

The existence of the fear would be falsifiable (even if true) by determining what homophobes actually do fear. A scientific study or well conducted poll might determine this. Well researched conclusions from psychological records might also work. I don't know whether this is practical, or whether or not it has been done.

Similarly, the basis for the contention that homophobes are secretly concerned with maintaining the status quo double standard with respect to domination and rape, while probably quite difficult to document, would be at least in theory falsifiable by determining if a significant number of these people actually do harbor those ideas.

The basis for the fear would be falsifiable (even if true, which I surely doubt) by studying the real world, and the behavior of real people in it. How likely is it that a heterosexual man will be raped or assaulted by a gay man? How often does it happen?

Whether it would be practical to test these statements scientifically, I do not know. They are, as far as I can see, statements of opinion, rather loosely expressed, without a pretense of being scientific. But for an idea to be falsifiable, one only needs a logically possible way to test it in a way that, if it were false, one could find that out. I think all of zombiexx's statements are at least logically falsifiable, even if implementing the test might prove more expensive and difficult than such assertions are worth (and by that I do not mean that they are bad assertions, simply that they are opinions).

My own (informal-and-I don't-care-a-whit-whether-it's-falsifiable) theory is related to the above. I think many men assume that a homosexual in, say, a shower room, would behave toward them just as they themselves would behave if they found themselves in a shower room with a naked woman: that is to say, very badly. To face that fear honestly they must look uncomfortably close at their own values and their own behavior, and few of us are willing to do this. As a secondary issue, I think also that many men fear a homosexual encounter because they realize the distinct possibility that they would find themselves more responsive than they wish, also a situation that requires a very uncomfortable re-evaluation, not only of their own sexuality, but of how they process the way that physiology and psychology diverge in a coercive situation. To understand that arousal and acquiescence can occur against one's desire requires that we understand and accept the possibility that the same thing can occur with the object of our own attentions. It's easier and far more comfortable simply to be homophobic.

 

[MajikPiG]

I think you got it right. Whenever we see Fundie trolls ranting and raving about homosexuality it is always anal sex that they mention. Often they make the claim that male on male anal sex is literally the definition of homosexuality. In reality they are not defining homosexuality, just telling us about their most secret fear.

The ridiculous ancient fairy tales are trotted out to justify their homophobia, but what they are really afraid of is the loss of their patriarchal power structure.

Hrmm... Ok, I think I'm getting it now. I assume this is the same reason atheism is feared? Loss of power structure, I mean, not anal rapage.

I mean, people who are homosexual are not going to steal away our women, nor are they going to harm us (Gay Liberation Army aside for a moment), but if we accept homosexuality, manhood loses power. (And power is represented by a phallus after all -- neck ties, the Washington Monument, the Empire State Building.) Likewise, if atheism becomes more prevalent, it harms by weakening the power structure (even though most atheists are honest, decent, people who don't fight in the Gay Liberation Army).

-Matt

 

[MajikPiG]

The basis for the fear would be falsifiable (even if true, which I surely doubt) by studying the real world, and the behavior of real people in it. How likely is it that a heterosexual man will be raped or assaulted by a gay man? How often does it happen?

Oh, but human fears and hopes never stem from what is likely. How many more people fear shark attacks and plane crashes than car crashes? How many people believe they might win the lottery? The human brain is quite poor at understanding probability.

-Matt

 

[slingblade]

Uh...

In what way is this explanation falsifiable???

This is how I know you do not understand the terms you've read here.

This is why I rant so much at you to educate yourself. You only picked up the term. You haven't tried to learn what it means, or how to use it. You're like a parrot.

I'll tape my spoon back together briefly to explain superficially. You will, I predict, have questions. Find the answers to them for yourself, so that you actually learn something from it.

Falsifiability. The key element there is "able." For something to be falsifiable, it has to exist in a form we can access, a form we are able to test. If it can't be tested, it can't be verified or falsified.

Falsifiable does not mean to find the falsity in a thing. Many things which are falsifiable are quite true. But we only know that because we can test them.

One will do better to think of "falsifiable" as equal to "testable."

 

[zombiebex]

Yeah, it's just my opinion. Should have put that little disclaimer in there. And consider it here as well.

But yes, I'd connect it all to the patriarchy and the sexual roles within the patriarchy. In order for the patriarchy to keep control over the women of society, it needs to establish certain lesser roles and purposes for them. In a nutshell, women in a patriarchy exist only to sexual satisfy a man, keep his home, and raise his children. Women exist only in the private sphere, where men dominate both the private sphere and the public sphere.

To make sure that women remain within the private sphere, there have to be certain consquences for those that go outside it. A woman who has sex outside the private sphere (casual sex) is a whore, her punishment is to become nothing more than a sexual object to be violated on a whim. For instance, take a look at the abortion debate. The argument is less and less about "saving babies" and more and more about punishing women who have sex by locking them into the private sphere where they belong.

I could go on and on about that, but let's get back to the matter at hand. Men function easily in both spheres. They go to the women in the private sphere to have sex, then occasionally to a whore/less-than-a-woman in the public sphere if the mood strikes them. They are in charge, they are entitled.

Now lets throw in another possibilty. The man-whore. Men aren't supposed to be sexual objects. They are supposed to control sexual objects. A man who willingly submits to the whore/less-than-a-woman role threatens the patriarchy and male rule.

 

[DoubtingStephen]

(even though most atheists are honest, decent, people who don't fight in the Gay Liberation Army)

I'm glad you worded this in such a way as not to exclude the honest, decent atheists in the Gay Liberation Army who are working to use military force and the threat of global terr'ism to force Fundamentalist parents to indoctrinate their children in the glories of the Homosexual Lifestyle Choice.

The Gay Liberation Army is a leading provider of weapons of homosexual recruitment (WHR), dildos used by lesbians to perform anal rape of innocent, virginal Christian males, and children's books about gay penguins. Through our advanced terr'rist techniques we have been able to infiltrate the courts with activist judges, promote pro-gay legislation, and completely destroy the Sanctity of Marriage in one New England state.

Through our partnership with the Atheist Front of Judea we are working to criminalize the worship of all heterosexual deities, establish a mandatory 15% minimum level of homosexual kindergarten students, and outlaw plaid men's shorts.

You can help to support the homosexual agenda by donating to our War on Christmas kettles. Just look for the man in the Satan costume outside your local Wal*Mart.

Thank you for your support of the Gay Liberation Army! We hope to recruit your children soon.

 

[slingblade]

Can you at least upgrade the recruitment prize to something more modern and techno than a toaster oven?

I'd like an iPod, myself.