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Why Flight 93?

tomm said:
It essentially did! Minus the different length wing impressions.

Maybe you guys can show me another instance where a plane left an impression of itself like at Shanksville.
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WTC1 and WTC2, nice plane shaped holes in them
 
tomm said:
Then why did you get so upset if you're not a nerd?


who?


Can you show me a similar crash with similar results?


What lies have I spewed?


What lies are you talking about?


You insult like the kind of nerds I described.


That's what she says and I have no reason to believe she's making it all up.

I doubt the military will let us see photos of their top secret aircraft.


That allegedly flew after the fake crash, not before as witnessed. You have fallen for the lies of the FBI. You really think they wouldn't have a cover story ready as a backup for their conspiracy? You are not using your critical thinking skills mate.


Amusing you call us funny and immature. You guys should look in a mirror every once in a while.

Are there people in 9/11 truth that are shills and trying to make money off the movement? Sure. Every movement that threatens the government will be infiltrated by them and there are always greedy bad apples that will try to profit off any movement.

Insulting our esteemed researchers only makes you look desperate and unable to debunk them and if you are paid agents, it makes you look scared of them.
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Nerds seem to be the doctors, Air Force officers, nurses, engineers, and even people you believe on 9/11, who are full of lies on 9/11, finished college so they can sell books to idiots. Nerds won. Gee, do the jocks pick on you too?

You have passed on the lies of 9/11. Tarpley, and DRG are both pathetic liars on 9/11.

Yes, I can show you crash sites where the pilot and aircraft are all in one small hole. I can show you items that survived that were thrown from the crash. This is why no trained crash experts are joining the idiots of 9/11 truth. Sorry, but liars and those who follow them are idiots - that is 9/11 truth, liars and idiots who spew the hearsay junk like you do.

Most of what you spew are false information, if you continue to spew it without support in facts and evidence, you are a liar.

Pick some of your posts, and see for yourself. If you are not knowledgeable enough to see the lies of 9/11 truth, you need to go back and get an education to help you understand reality.

I am a nerd. I graduated with honors as an engineer. Is that nerdy enough. I flew jets for the USAF, kind of nerdy, since we did not get a stand down order and we are not in some grand CT, that makes me a nerd, not some secret agent of the NWO. I am a nerd, you are trying to insult me, I am glad I studied and became an engineer, it gave me something to think about when I was breaking the sound barrier over the skies of GA when I flew a supersonic trainer; even my classmates knew I was nerd. I passed it on to my kids but they do not look as nerdy as I. You can't insult anyone after they see the junk you post about 9/11 and flt 93. You can try but as you have failed to find facts on 9/11 so have you failed in your insults.

No expertise in crash scenes, no flying experience, no investigator experience so you have no clue how to evaluate witness statements. So you come armed with hearsay, and zero experience to understand flight 93 crash scene. You have zero experience, no idea what happen, no idea who did 9/11, no idea what happen to flight 93, and no idea how to research 9/11 and find facts and evidence to make rational conclusions. You are a no idea guy who posts other people lies on 9/11. Pathetic. You can not even come up with a rational story of what you think happen on 9/11 or to flight 93. She seems kind of nuts on this one, 50 feet, small jet. She only left out the green people! You have been had. You sure are easy.

You ignore the facts that 93 crash as seen on 9/11, and from evidence collected. Now you make up the secret jet! Funny stuff, you are deep into CT, I bet you see them everywhere! cool

You can call the pilot who flew the white jet, he is biz jet pilot. Sad, I could call him for you, but you seem to need first hand information like all the stuff you presented so far.

I think you just like to post other people ideas without proof on 9/11. You post stupid statements on 9/11 that are at best hearsay, and just plain lies, like you FBI statement. You make it up or spread it. What is it? What great 9/11 stuff is yours?

There at nuts spewing lies on 9/11, and some of them are selling the lies. Pilots for 9/11 truth, selling lies and has some idiots as members (as far as 9/11 ideas). LC videos, lies for dollars so Dylan can buy toys and spread more lies and sell more lies. You are have no clue about 9/11 and your posts show it. Why are you unable to back up your ideas with facts and evidence.

Start with proof the FBI is lying about the white jet. Good luck.

Your esteem researchers are crazy on 9/11. You have no idea do you? Why are only 0.00067 percent of all engineers in the 9/11 truth movement?
 
funk de fino said:
You think wings are the same thickness their entire length? Think about it skip
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We could remind him the plane was moving. The plane was moving, rolling, pitching, yawing, going forward, going up relative to the nose, and going right or left due to yaw and roll. Six degrees of freedom make flying real neat.

We could tell him about the wings exploding with fuel; fuel, thousands of pounds is stored in the wings. The wings hit and rip apart. Plus, like any impact in the ground there is an impression. Like a crater. Those are the craters from the wings. I do not thing this will help the masters of hearsay and JAQs.
 
So no one has bothered to update Tomm on the fact that the plane did not impact at a perfectly perpendicular angle to the ground? The fact that he can't figure out why the wing impressions are different lengths is extremely amusing to say the least.
 
The fact that 'truthers' think they're so clever at spotting faked evidence because the perps are so bad at faking it in the first place is even funnier!
 
flight 93, why are you making up stuff tomm

What lies have I spewed?
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tomm said:
Who said it crashed there?
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Trying to say flight 93 did not crash in PA, is a lie.
Implied lie at the least, just being disrespectful since you offer no facts and evidence to support your ideas. Why not say what you have to prove 93 did not crash in PA. Now you can say you did not mean anything by this post, but gee
That allegedly flew after the fake crash, not before as witnessed. You have fallen for the lies of the FBI.
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; oops this confirms you are telling lies. You are saying the crash site is fake and that is a lie.

Making up stuff without proof and you have zero evidence to support your position. Pathetic, you are saying the crash site is fake based on zero evidence. This is where it would help if you were trained as an aircraft crash investigator. Do you have any experience at anything to help you with 9/11?

tomm said:
Her testimony pretty much blows the official story to kingdom come!!!
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What a gem of a lie. No, there will be no Pulitzer Prize for silly statements by eyewitness who saw a plane so small at 50 feet. It does not make sense at all, and you are going to add it was a secret government plane?

The only plane around was a biz jet. Sorry, check her glasses and next time fly a plane by for her to see and compare. Stop being cheap and do your investigating right. If you are going to make up this stuff, do it right.

Not many lies, but you do not say anything, just a few lies and implied lies, but the rest of your posts are JASQs. Sorry, you post no facts, and JASQ, the only substance you post are the lie that her testimony will break some official story, and the two posts, where you say 93 did not crash in PA, it was fake.

Neat that you try not to say anything about 9/11, but you mess up and tell lies, or imply lies and later confirm your implied lie. You failed to keep your lies to yourself. I thought you had more lies, but your stupid questions threw me off (most of them {your stupid questions} try to imply lies from 9/11 truth; if you do not understand that now, you may never).
 
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Please stop insulting each other, and concentrate on the points put forward.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: chillzero
 
tomm I'd be curious as to if you think the first responders and volunteers who scoured the crash site for weeks picking up bits of airplane, tiny body parts, and charred bones are lying.
 
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TheRedWorm said:
tomm, I've asked you this a number of times. Please answer or concede that you cannot.
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I think the problem, when it comes to math and "twoofers," is that it doesn't matter who you are related to and/or who is paying you, adding one and one will always equal two.
 
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Pretty remarkable that no blood was found at the scene yet they managed to identify all 44 passengers with only 8% of their total mass. I little too remarkable for my taste.

In you link, I didn't quite see where they debunked the black boxes being from different makers. Looks like he confirmed it and then speculated why he thought two different brands were recovered.
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You parrot the "truther" sites very well - do want a cookie or cracker?

As someone who has seen crash/accident scenes up close and haelped remove
dismembered/charred bodies can speak with some authority.

Was at scene of Lear 35 crash number of years back - there was no blood on the scene
even though area was full of body parts. Had to walk scene and plant flags for
coroner to recover body parts. The impactis too swift and violent - the arteries spasm
shut when severed heence little blood. Also post crash fires tend to burn away lot of
body parts.

You wonder how could identify passengers/crew from only 8% of remains - modern DNA
science can generate profile from minute traces of blood/hair/saliva.

Also claim that flight/data recorders are "different" - actually both are from same
company, ALLIED SIGNAL. It was bought by HONEYWELL. The ALLIED SIGNAL plant
was right across street from where I used to work in Morristown, NJ. Had number of
friends who worked there. The recorders were (are) built by ALLIED SIGNAL only after
the merger HONEYWELL name was placed on boxes.
 
What we have here from tomm is a textbook argument from personal incredulity. If he can't figure out how it happened, it MUST have been faked.

Sigh
 
tomm said:
Pretty remarkable that no blood was found at the scene yet they managed to identify all 44 passengers with only 8% of their total mass. I little too remarkable for my taste.
(...)
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A W Smith said:
Blood is they first substance in your body to start decomposition. It will still be there but It will not look like blood to the naked eye

(...)
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tomm said:
It all decomposed in 10 minutes?
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So we start with the idea that identifying all the victims on 93 was incredible because there was no apparent blood or more specifically that only 8% of the victims's bodily mass was recovered. This was replied to as any blood spilled (I use the term loosely given that it was a violent crash) would decompose though I would say that it would coagulate, dry up (which would change its color I believe). This was replied to as if decomposition meant that there would be no blood remnants remaining in the 10 minutes (I presume referring to the arrival of responders after the crash).

First, I would point out that in past, before things like DNA analysis, the result of a crash like 93 would likely have been a mass grave for all the victims. Indentifying indivduals or individual remains would not have been reasonably possible due to the violence of the impact and the destruction of the physical bodies (by destruction I mean rendering into tiny pieces, ok). Though if something like a jaw fragment with some intact teeth was found there might be an identification via dental chart.

I would point to The Joint POW-MIA Accounting Command in Hawaii as an example of how far the art and science of identifying remains has progressed. IIRC, in many cases, they have to deal with people dead for decades and recovered in pieces, often tiny pieces.

Second, while it is true that blood would decompose (and coagulate/clot and dry out) it should not be forgotten that a person normally has only a couple of gallons of blood in their body. That's roughly 16 pounds of blood and with 44 people we're talking on the order of 700-800 pounds of blood in a crash scene where a couple hundred thousand pounds of aircraft crashed rather directly (i.e. violently) into the ground at high speed (500 mph). To expect that responders would find things like pools of blood or blood dripping off the trees is not reasonable. The responders would be lucky to find identifiable body parts much less enough to identify a particular person without referring to things like dental charts and such.

The closest comparison I can think of would be to take a ballon or bag filled with a couple gallons of water (dyed for identification) and slam it into the ground at 500 mph and see the result. If one would prefer, try taking 80-90 gallons in one container and doing the same thing. I am fairly sure one would not find pools of water nor any significant amount of water dripping off anything in the near vicinity. And this is just dealing with what might happen to the blood without considering all the other stuff crashing into the ground at the same spot. Admittedly this is a simplistic comparison.

So is there a problem with the responders not finding pools of blood or blood dripping off trees and such, or that they could only collect a small amount of the total body mass of the victims with which to try and effect an identification? In most, if not all, of the cases, they were seeking to identify the particular remains as belonging to one of a known set of people, not trying to effect an identification of a complete unknown.
 
Tomm give me a few hours and I'll peruse through my crash files. I'll present other crashes that are similar to UA93. Beachnut is correct in saying that there is nothing nefarious about the crash scene. It indeed looks like a high speed impact from a large aircraft...............in this case a 757.
 
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