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Why do Christians believe Jesus was God himself?

Hey! I was going to say that!

Avalon, where does it say that Jesus and the Word are the same thing?


Have a look at the verses in this post.

These in particular but ALL are part of the proof.

John
{1:1} In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

{1:14} And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
 
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John
{1:1} In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

{1:14} And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.


Well, that's very silly.
 
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But seriously, i sometimes see that some Christians belief that Jesus was YHWH himself. but the bible clearly states he is the son of God.
where did they get the idea that Jesus is YHWH?

Both sides (trinity vs Jesus as sub-deity or even just an inspired human) are in the bible. Like most things, people pick and choose as they like. In this case part of the decision is based on avoiding polytheism. If god and Jesus are two separate entities, and both are holy and deserving of worship, then you've got multiple gods... Why this is a problem for people who believe that representative cannibalism is a good thing is beyond me, but the council of Nicea apparently though it mattered.
 
Well, that's very silly.


Quite.....

You know the aphorism.....reality is sometimes stranger than fiction....

Well.... in this case it is Virtual Reality that they are fully immersed in and fully believe to be real more than reality itself…..


REAL VIRTUALITY TM... :D
 
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This is the reason. Mainstream Christianity has ever since 300 AD or so strictly required belief in the divinity of Jesus. Anyone who teaches otherwise is quickly labeled an apostate, even in today´s otherwise quite liberal atmosphere. A believer has no other choice than to publicly stand behind the doctrine of Jesus´divinity.
Yep. Though technically they'd be a heretic unless they abandoned the faith entirely, e.g. to the RCC protestantism is a heresy, or collection of heresies (though the euphemism "separated brethren" is preferred over "heretics" today).
Though at least the RCC hasn't executed anyone for heresy for ~180 years.:rolleyes:
 
Translations differ, however. For example, Jehovah's Wittnesses translate it "... and the Word was a god", which changes the meaning quite a bit.

"a god" ? as in... more than one? This means they are Monolatrist Polytheists? :jaw-dropp
 
I thought it was because believers in the Arian heresy were successfully slaughtered/exiled/converted before they (the Arians) could slaughter/exile/convert the Trinitarians.
 
John: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word as with God, and the Word was God."
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God. 1:3 All things were made through him; and without him was not anything made that hath been made. 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Fascinating enough, few people apparently understands these passages. Trinitarians will tell you that it says Jesus is God! Totally ignoring that the passage as seen in John 1:4 deals with God’s wisdom which CAN NOT be a person, totally ignoring that it doesn’t say that the Word was God, but that the word was God and with God.

What John 1:1 expresses is that this word of wisdom came from God. The capital ‘W’ is misleading indeed and isn’t present in older Bibles nor does the Greek give ground for a capital letter. It’s a word, a word is not a person. However as said in John 1:14 it became a person, flesh. Matthew 1 details the creation of Jesus. He was a man and created as such.

Here are ways to express John 1:1 and 1:14 by some scholars: “In the beginning there was the divine word and wisdom. The divine wisdom and word was there with God and it was what God was.” (The Complete Gospels, Annotated Scholars version, Revised, Ed Miller, Harper, San Fran. 1994).

“In the beginning there was the Message. The Message was with God and the Message was deity. He was with God in the beginning” (Simple English Bible).

“At the beginning God expressed himself. That personal expression, that word, was with God and was God, and he existed with God from the beginning” (Philips New Testament in Plain English).

“In the beginning was God’s purpose, and this purpose was revealed in a historical encounter.”

(The Early Christian Doctrine of God, R.M. Grant, D.D., Professor of New Testament and Early Christianity, Divinity School, University of Chicago).

“The Word,” said John, “became flesh.” We could put it in another way — “the Mind of God became a person"

William Barclay, Gospel of John, Saint Andrews Press, 1957, Vol. 1, 14. God’s wisdom became flesh in the man Jesus.

&

The EMPHATIC Diaglott Original Greek NT Text Interlinear Footnotes, p. 313 Re: John 1:14 reads: -

14. Newcome in his Translation of the New Testament remarks, "Jesus the Son of God, is called the Word, because God revealed himself or his word by him." The following singular Eastern custom may perhaps illustrate the phraseology of the first part of this chapter. "In Abyssinia, there is an officer named Kal Hatze ; the word or voice of the king, who stands always upon the steps of the throne, at the side of a lattice window, where there is a hole, covered in the inside with a curtain of green taffeta. Behind this curtain the king sits; and speaks through the aperture to the Kal Hatze, who communicates his commands to the officers, judges, and attendants .- Bruce's travels (My Bold Text)

(Composer writes: Thus we can see that Story book jesus was not "the Word" but rather his Story book god's word was "made manifest / manifested / reflected / revealed" THROUGH Story book jesus.)
 
Kind of like running for president when your church believes that being black is a curse.
IF this Story book mythical character had ever literally existed it would have been of a black(ish) - Olive-skinned, Brown-eyed, short dark-hair and of Jewish Stock!

bbc_news: (Source: ://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/3958241.stm)

Extracts -

Traditional depictions

Dr Goodacre was involved in the reconstruction of a Middle Eastern first century skull for the BBC's Son of God programme in 2001, which resulted in a suggestion of what a man like Jesus might have looked like. He advised on hair and skin colour.

"The hair was the easiest - there's a reference in Paul which says it's disgraceful for a man to wear long hair, so it looks pretty sure that people of that period had to have reasonably short hair. The traditional depictions of Jesus with long flowing golden hair are probably inaccurate."

Deciding on skin colour was more difficult, though. But the earliest depictions of Jews, which date from the 3rd Century, are - as far as can be determined - dark-skinned.

"We do seem to have a relatively dark skinned Jesus. In contemporary parlance I think the safest thing is to talk about Jesus as 'a man of colour'." This probably means olive-coloured, he says.

'Fascinating' debate

Professor Vincent Wimbush, of California's Claremont Graduate University, who is an expert on ethnic interpretations of the Bible, says the matter of the historical colour of Jesus seems to him a "flat, dead-end issue".

"He's of Mediterranean stock, and it's quite clear what that means. We see people like that in the world today, and that should end the matter.

Hence so called christians worship a black(ish) skinned man!
 
Here are the verses that are usually used to affirm the Trinity
1 John
{5:7} For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.​

That one is found only in the King James Version of the Bible, and it's universally recognized to have been added in the middle ages. Most Christians in the US use more modern versions of the Bible, like the NIV or RSV, which don't have that "these three are one" thing.
 
Correction to the thread title: Christians believe that Jesus IS God Himself.
 
Nonsense.

Christians believe this garbage because they are superstitious, intellectually lazy imbeciles.

Are you a bot? Your post has nothing to do with what I said. I was simply correcting the original post.

In case you truly didn't understand it: Christians don't believe that Jesus was just some guy that lived and died in the past. The resurrection and ascension mean that he is present in the here and now, hence we believe he is God, not was God.
 

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