Who started both World Wars?

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You just have to look at the battle of Seelow Heights. The Germans were out numbered 10:1 under resourced, lacking real options. And it still took a very battle hardened Soviet Army 3 days to break through with loss of virtually every tank they had, (approximately 3000)
Well I can't blame the Germans for fighting hard at Seelow Heights. They knew what they did to the Russians when they were winning ....and it was going to come back onto them. To quote Caesar..."They asked for it"
 
Well I can't blame the Germans for fighting hard at Seelow Heights. They knew what they did to the Russians when they were winning ....and it was going to come back onto them. To quote Caesar..."They asked for it"

The Russians used the same tactics that they employed at Waterloo. Neil11 can tell you all about that,and it is in his fantasy blog.
 
Russians? Waterloo? must have missed that bit.
Erm why is 9/11 suspended again? What did he say this time?
 
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Something to get himself banned, no doubt, so he could avoid having to deal with the questions posed to him.
Expect him to come back with an entirely different argument, as though nothing had happened.
 
Russians? Waterloo? must have missed that bit.
Erm why is 9/11 suspended again? What did he say this time?

I don't know if it was this thread but he said that the Russians fought at Waterloo. What a grasp on history that man has.
 
I don't know if it was this thread but he said that the Russians fought at Waterloo. What a grasp on history that man has.

Oh, it was this thread.
I don't generally read the other one.
Must have been a month or so back.
 
Propaganda, Lebensraum, German imperialism


The myth of German imperialism was created and is upheld mostly by British born propaganda. The German Reich existed since 1871, after having defeated Napoleon III. Napoleon under the „threat“ of being surrounded by pro-German rulers in case that the Duke of Hohenzollern would climb on the Spanish throne had declared war against Germany in 1870. That must be kept in mind re evaluating how the Reich felt threatened after the French-Russian alliance treaty, which explicitly aimed to draw the Reich into a two-front war. That German nightmare materialised when Russia mobilised her troops along the borders of Austria and the German Reich after Austria's declaration of war against Serbia. A two front war was regarded to be unwinnable by German military leaders. For this event the „Schlieffen plan“ was prepared, which gave the German army a 6 week period to beat France before the Russian army was fully mobilised along the German east borders. These events led to WWI. For having used a shortcut through Belgian territory in order to keep the timeline, the British empire declared war aginst Germany. However, the British empire not being bound to any treaty, had to justify their military engagement on the continent, not revealing their true interest, which was the doctrine of the „balance of powers“, mainly to avoid the formation of a european continental superpower. For this sake the myth of German imperialism was created. A few details: To foster the alleged German guilt on WWI, the „blanco cheque“ of the German Kaiser, given to Austria is quoted frequently. It allegedly meant unlimited backup of Austrian activities aginst Serbia. However, the Kaiser had answered on Austrian request, how the Reich would behave in case of an Austrian attack: „We will remember our old friendship and stand firm to our obligations from the treaty.“. The German-Austrian treaty forsaw any assistance only for the case of one member being attacked by France or Russia. Any other attacks, like an Austrian war against Serbia, did not lead to any contractual obligation for the Reich. That is what the Kaiser said to the Austrians. When the Russian army mobilised along the German east border, which was and is a valid war declaration, the WWI spiral commenced.

But not enough:
At the end of WWI the British empire upheld the total sea blockade against the Reich until September 1919, leading to the starvation of 800.000 German civilians. In September 1918, one English journalist, in an article titled "The Huns of 1940," wrote hopefully of the tens of thousands of Germans now in the wombs of famished mothers who "are destined for a life of physical inferiority“. The famous founder of the Boy Scouts, Robert Baden-Powell, expressed his satisfaction that the German race is being ruined; though the birth rate, from the German point of view, may look satisfactory, the irreparable harm done is quite different and much more serious." In early March 1919, General Herbert Plumer, commander of the British Army of Occupation, informed Prime Minister Lloyd George that his men were begging to be sent home; they could no longer stand the sight of "hordes of skinny and bloated children pawing over the offal" from the British camps. (1).

Interestingly those who were addressed, the generation born in 1918 and 1919, allegedly started WWII, which included atrocities resembling their own misery during their first years of life. Today that is called „re enactment of trauma“. The post WWI treaties had driven Germany into a full scale civil war. The threat from the innner was multipled by the invasion threats from surrounding states, having to be taken seriously with an army half the size of that of Swizzerland defending German territory. Paying reperations in undefined amounts for an event which had happened before their lifetime, took off the last rest of hope from this generation. WWII and the famous „Lebensraum“-philosophy did not mean to conquer the world, but to find room where life is possible at all. From this perspective there was no war which had to be started. There was always war around. For those born in 1918, war was meant to be ended, not to be started.

Regarding propaganda, even WWII shows some interesting similarities to WWI. It was started by a foul guarantee of the British empire towards Poland, which immediately cut negotiations about a rather simple topic: a motorway through former German territories towards areas, still in German possession.

After having invaded Poland, Fance having declared war against the Germans, nothing happened for eight months, a period known as the „phoney war“. Not until the RAF bombed German industrial plants in the Rhineland from French airbases, the Wehrmacht invaded the French neighbour. In the armistice between both countries it was fixed that the occupation would be time limited until a peace treaty is negotiated and the Germans had settled their difficulties with the British Empire. Not to give away that option, the British Expedition Force was left widely unharmed and was evacuated at Dunkerque. However the British doctrine of balance of powers again required a total defeat and again the USA were the willing helpers. The rest is known. For having let the BEF escape unmolested Germany was rewarded with aerial bombing and the destruction of Dresden. Until present billions of hours of intellectual worktime are wasted to justify those engagements.

Today almost nobody is discussing the 30- years -war or even WWI. WWII has left an open wound to society. WWII propaganda has left the postwar generation in a state of deception. Thats why we talk about it until today. That wound will not heal by adding more deception. Germans did not intend to take over the world or intend to do so – truth will.
 
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That whole first paragraph is just the usual twisting and turning.

It appears that it's OK for Germany to fulfill its treaty obligations by supporting Austria should Russia make a move against them, but not for Britain to fulfill its obligation to Belgium, or Russia to fulfil its obligations to Serbia.

Twisty, twisty...
 
A couple of comments.

For this event the „Schlieffen plan“ was prepared, which gave the German army a 6 week period to beat France before the Russian army was fully mobilised along the German east borders. These events led to WWI.

So, in other words, it was Germany's attack on France through Belgium that started the First World War. This is rather an important point to remember.

For having used a shortcut through Belgian territory in order to keep the timeline, the British empire declared war aginst Germany.

Beautifully chosen weasel words there. Germany didn't "use[d] a shortcut through Belgian territory", they invaded Belgium, killed Belgian soldiers and took Belgian territory, despite Belgium having undertaken no hostile actions to justify this. The form of words used implies that Germany had the right to employ the territory of other countries as it thought fit; that attitude on the part of Germany was precisely the problem, and a reasonable cause to oppose Germany in doing so.

For this sake the myth of German imperialism was created.

There's nothing mythical about the German invasion of Belgium. The myth is that invading a neutral country was a perfectly innocent and reasonable act.

At the end of WWI the British empire upheld the total sea blockade against the Reich until September 1919, leading to the starvation of 800.000 German civilians.

I think you need to look up the meaning of the word "armistice". It doesn't mean a war is over, just that both sides are temporarily ceasing to fight. The First World War wasn't over until June 1919, when the Treaty of Versailles was signed.

Regarding propaganda, even WWII shows some interesting similarities to WWI. It was started by a foul guarantee of the British empire towards Poland, which immediately cut negotiations about a rather simple topic: a motorway through former German territories towards areas, still in German possession.

Again, weasel words. By the same argument, WWI was started by a foul guarantee of the German empire towards Austria, which immediately resulted in Germany attacking France as a pre-emptive move in case France should "remember [its] old friendship and stand firm to [its] obligations from the treaty" to Russia.

Not to give away that option, the British Expedition Force was left widely unharmed and was evacuated at Dunkerque.

At this point your spin turns to outright lying. The British evacuation at Dunkirk was not passively allowed to happen by the German army; it was opposed in force by the Luftwaffe, who sank nine warships and over 200 smaller craft and shot down 177 allied aircraft.

All in all, your post starts from the assumption that everything Germany has ever done is completely justified, and that everything the Allies ever did was therefore a crime against the divine right of Germany to do whatever it pleased. Starting from these premises, it's hardly surprising that you conclude that Germany was in the right; you're simply completing the circular argument.

Dave
 
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Propaganda, Lebensraum, German imperialism


The myth of German imperialism was created and is upheld mostly by British born propaganda. The German Reich existed since 1871, after having defeated Napoleon III. Napoleon under the „threat“ of being surrounded by pro-German rulers in case that the Duke of Hohenzollern would climb on the Spanish throne had declared war against Germany in 1870. That must be kept in mind re evaluating how the Reich felt threatened after the French-Russian alliance treaty, which explicitly aimed to draw the Reich into a two-front war. That German nightmare materialised when Russia mobilised her troops along the borders of Austria and the German Reich after Austria's declaration of war against Serbia. A two front war was regarded to be unwinnable by German military leaders. For this event the „Schlieffen plan“ was prepared, which gave the German army a 6 week period to beat France before the Russian army was fully mobilised along the German east borders. These events led to WWI. For having used a shortcut through Belgian territory in order to keep the timeline, the British empire declared war aginst Germany. However, the British empire not being bound to any treaty, had to justify their military engagement on the continent, not revealing their true interest, which was the doctrine of the „balance of powers“, mainly to avoid the formation of a european continental superpower. For this sake the myth of German imperialism was created. A few details: To foster the alleged German guilt on WWI, the „blanco cheque“ of the German Kaiser, given to Austria is quoted frequently. It allegedly meant unlimited backup of Austrian activities aginst Serbia. However, the Kaiser had answered on Austrian request, how the Reich would behave in case of an Austrian attack: „We will remember our old friendship and stand firm to our obligations from the treaty.“. The German-Austrian treaty forsaw any assistance only for the case of one member being attacked by France or Russia. Any other attacks, like an Austrian war against Serbia, did not lead to any contractual obligation for the Reich. That is what the Kaiser said to the Austrians. When the Russian army mobilised along the German east border, which was and is a valid war declaration, the WWI spiral commenced.

But not enough:
At the end of WWI the British empire upheld the total sea blockade against the Reich until September 1919, leading to the starvation of 800.000 German civilians. In September 1918, one English journalist, in an article titled "The Huns of 1940," wrote hopefully of the tens of thousands of Germans now in the wombs of famished mothers who "are destined for a life of physical inferiority“. The famous founder of the Boy Scouts, Robert Baden-Powell, expressed his satisfaction that the German race is being ruined; though the birth rate, from the German point of view, may look satisfactory, the irreparable harm done is quite different and much more serious." In early March 1919, General Herbert Plumer, commander of the British Army of Occupation, informed Prime Minister Lloyd George that his men were begging to be sent home; they could no longer stand the sight of "hordes of skinny and bloated children pawing over the offal" from the British camps. (1).

Interestingly those who were addressed, the generation born in 1918 and 1919, allegedly started WWII, which included atrocities resembling their own misery during their first years of life. Today that is called „re enactment of trauma“. The post WWI treaties had driven Germany into a full scale civil war. The threat from the innner was multipled by the invasion threats from surrounding states, having to be taken seriously with an army half the size of that of Swizzerland defending German territory. Paying reperations in undefined amounts for an event which had happened before their lifetime, took off the last rest of hope from this generation. WWII and the famous „Lebensraum“-philosophy did not mean to conquer the world, but to find room where life is possible at all. From this perspective there was no war which had to be started. There was always war around. For those born in 1918, war was meant to be ended, not to be started.

Regarding propaganda, even WWII shows some interesting similarities to WWI. It was started by a foul guarantee of the British empire towards Poland, which immediately cut negotiations about a rather simple topic: a motorway through former German territories towards areas, still in German possession.

After having invaded Poland, Fance having declared war against the Germans, nothing happened for eight months, a period known as the „phoney war“. Not until the RAF bombed German industrial plants in the Rhineland from French airbases, the Wehrmacht invaded the French neighbour. In the armistice between both countries it was fixed that the occupation would be time limited until a peace treaty is negotiated and the Germans had settled their difficulties with the British Empire. Not to give away that option, the British Expedition Force was left widely unharmed and was evacuated at Dunkerque. However the British doctrine of balance of powers again required a total defeat and again the USA were the willing helpers. The rest is known. For having let the BEF escape unmolested Germany was rewarded with aerial bombing and the destruction of Dresden. Until present billions of hours of intellectual worktime are wasted to justify those engagements.

Today almost nobody is discussing the 30- years -war or even WWI. WWII has left an open wound to society. WWII propaganda has left the postwar generation in a state of deception. Thats why we talk about it until today. That wound will not heal by adding more deception. Germans did not intend to take over the world or intend to do so – truth will.


New Name, Same Old BS.

Yeah, I smell Sock Puppet here.
 
New Name, Same Old BS.

Yeah, I smell Sock Puppet here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sockpuppet_(Internet)

Are you suggesting I am posting under 2 nicks? Why should I? I am not (yet) banned.

Whatever...

Today on LewRockwell, the Jewish journalist (albeit with extremely low Protocols of Elders of Zion coefficient ;) ) Eric Margolis comes with surprising revelations:

http://lewrockwell.com/margolis/margolis243.html
Let’s Bury These Phony Myths About World War II

My opponents will have a hard time categorizing Margolis as my sock puppet.

I would not be surprised if he lurks in this thread:

It was a world conflict over land and resources pitting the British Empire which controlled 25% of the entire globe, the French Empire, Dutch Empire, and Belgian Empire, and, later, the US imperium (Philippines, Pacific possessions, Central America), against the Italian and Japanese empires. The Soviet Union was an empire unto itself.

In 1939, the only major powers without colonies – that were not imperial powers – were Germany (who lost her few colonies in World War I) and China.

I was not aware of this:

In 1940, Germany led the world in technology: 75% of all technical books were then written in German.

Incredible! No wonder that the British and French were keen of getting rid of such a dominant competitor. Not that they had a moral case...

Margolis concludes:

Fourth – World War II was not a good and evil struggle between "western
democracies" and "totalitarian powers," as we are still wrongly taught.


How do you like them apples!?

But... but... but... what about the hollowcause, mr Margolis?

Margolis does not mention the h-word, nevertheless according to him there were no good nor bad guys.
His real belief is already factored in his statement.
Margolis knows.
 
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I was not aware of this:


In 1940, Germany led the world in technology: 75% of all technical books were then written in German.


If that's a claim Margolis is making, you'd better ask for the source. Because as has been pointed out in the 9/11 conspiracies forum, Margolis has shown a tendency to get his stories confused i.e. when he did or did not meet Bin Laden etc.
 
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