What's your theory about 9/11?

Hans Peper said:
No Sire,... iconology.
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I notice you have ignored the large body of my text to correct this statement.
Allow me to rephrase the relevant questions:
Where can I find examples of your Iconological analysis of other materials in a peer reviewed journal?
Where did you study Iconology?
Why do those who study art history go to great pains to differentiate themselves as Iconographers?
What qualifications in Iconology do you hold, and with which professional bodies do you register?
Where can I obtain details of you valid methodology other than 'I watched films and thought something looked like something else'?
When exactly will you discuss how other text in this film (or indeed any other film) are eliminated as irrelevant?

Is Iconology a name you gave your study because it was in a Dan Brown Book? Or can you show me that you are actually perfroming a study based on the methodology of an academic branch?

I am now assuming the later, due in no small point due to your refusal to address these issues.

Hans Peper said:
I came here, after I had googled "conspiracy theorys" and your forum came out.
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So I see. Well done.

Hans Peper said:
All I want to know is, if you hear about the twin towers in FMJ final scene. I see, you have not.
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Perhaps. But it is your theory. I am asking more about it to find out if it is valid. So far I see no reason to believe.

Hans Peper said:
I do not want to convince you.
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Then for what purpose did you wish to know if I had heard of this?
For what purpose have you continued to discuss it?
Why frame the discussion as a theory?
Why tell us we "need" new theories?
What IS your belief?

Hans Peper said:
But I see your reaction : You say, I am wrong.
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No. My response was to point out flaws in the theory and ask how it can be varified, and to explain why it resembles other flawed speculations on simaler subjects.

Hans Peper said:
This is the best way for you, to explain, why you have not seen it befor.
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That is not what I was explaining.
Please do not misrepresent my side of this discussion. I am being very patient and am ignoring all the indicators that you may in fact be trolling, to have a reasonable discussion.

Perhaps you should establish there is something, rather than discussing why I did not see something that there is no reason to think is there.
Hans Peper said:
Okay, that is mankind's nature.
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So are seeing patterns and objects in the random. Shapes in the clouds. World trade centres in the set dressing. Faces on mars.
All the same.

Hans Peper said:
While this hard discussion with you,
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It would be much easier if you actually discussed the points I raised and established if:
1) Iconology is a valid field, and your claim to authority as an iconologist or practicer of the field is valid.
2) If your speculation is using a valid methodology.


Hans Peper said:
I found "MY...TO*N" and "N..Y"
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And based your theory on the * being a W, which it is not.
How does MY TOAN alter your theory?
 
carlitos said:
Google translate tells me that "my toan" means "my box" in Vietnamese.
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Wait, I think I just cracked the code!

hqdefault.jpg
 
Macgyver1968 said:
OK...so you presented what you thought were references to 9/11 in a movie from 1987, and were shown that you were wrong.

Just say it...."Sorry guys...I was wrong about the "my town" sign...it really says "My Toan"..and has nothing to do with 9/11."

Is that so hard?
:)
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And if I say that, you will be friendly to me ? :boxedin:
 
Have I not been friendly? So...how does the revelation that the sign in the movie reads "My Toan" and not "My Town" effect your 9/11 theory?
 
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Hans Peper said:
Hi WTC Dust,

I do not know how and why the WTC was destroyed.

But I just read a message from 1987, that it will happen in 2001.
14 years befor ! This could be the time, where the "screenplay" was made.

It is a message in icons, and they are :

fog bomb, cowboy dead, the press (magazins, TV), burning WTC.

I think, that the cowboys in this case are the honest US-citizens, who are upright.

That's what I found, and I do not know what it means, but is amazing.

Regards Hans
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Oh my! :eek:
 
carlitos said:
Google translate tells me that "my toan" means "my box" in Vietnamese.

ETA - I meant to start a title contest for the Biggie Smalls photo. I'll start - "Stanley Who-brick? I eated him."
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These ******* are goin DOWN!

A Small problem with your theory: No Biggie.
 
Some of the old netherland painters show Mary Magdalene pregnant. If you come tight to the painting it is only the folders of her clothes.

There is no evidence for an A .

I make an offer :
We call it a ^ just as Mac said. And he's right. In that moment of the screenshot is it a ^, It could have been an A and an W befor.

So the ^ is only wildcard for A or W.

I take the W and you take the A and every body is satisfied.

Can you sighn that, is that hard ?
 
Macgyver1968 said:
Have I not been friendly? So...how does the revelation that the sign in the movie reads "My Toan" and not "My Town" effect your 9/11 theory?
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I'm sure everyone wants to be friendly, Hans. It's just that this particular website was set up by Mr. Randi to help promote critical thinking in regards to paranormal claims and conspiracy theories.

If you continue to propose nonsense explanation of mundane events, your arguments will be shot down and, at times, ridiculed.

I know that Kubrik is big on symbolism, but that's his artistic style. What symbols mean in art can be inferred at times. Other times it's just a mystery to anyone but the artist. Either way, symbols in art are not to be interpreted to mean just whatever you want them to mean.

Could we have a bit more background on you iconology claims? I mean, other than "read Panofsky".
 
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Except we aren't the only ones who see an "A"....the makers of the game COD saw and "A" too, and included it in their game...and the guys at IMDB.

You seem to be the only one who sees "Town"...because it fits your theory..."Toan" does not.

Here's a screenshot of the sign from a different angle...I just pulled myself from the movie:

fmj.jpg


Clearly...it's not a "W".

You can see the scene yourself here:
The Scene starts at 97:30
 
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As an example of how you can such symbols in a film through confirmation bias:

The Empire Struck:

Star Wars glorifies an attack on a target that is thought to be untouchable by an armed super power.

The Death Star is blown up by a small band of armed rebels (Or freedom fighters).

The explosive used to detonate the Deathstar is far smaller than any Truther would consider even remotely possible.

The "Heroes" are Martyrs who all conveniently die in the attack with a few exceptions.

The "Heroes" are glorified terrorists, from a desert, with minimal training, yet manage to slip past the armed forces? To make an attack.

R2D2= Are 2 Destroyed too?

There is a very obvious point of describing a false flag attack, and posting the blame on Tusken Raiders (poor desert people, in head dresses!) when the Sandcrawler is found burned out and destroyed. Note the iconic rectangular shape. Note also it is Lukes family who have been burned away in this false flag attack.

This tower like shape is often repeated in the film as a motif: There are tower-ish droids, towers on the deathstar, towers on Yavin. There are lots od scenes in which people stand rigid and tower like.

One of the stormtroopers bumps his head on the doorway. Is that a coincidence? I think not. It is clearly a sign especially as looking as they have 011 on their back. What does that look like? Two towers? Being hit? Hmmmmm?
 
Hans Peper said:
Some of the old netherland painters show Mary Magdalene pregnant. If you come tight to the painting it is only the folders of her clothes.

There is no evidence for an A .

I make an offer :
We call it a ^ just as Mac said. And he's right. In that moment of the screenshot is it a ^, It could have been an A and an W befor.

So the ^ is only wildcard for A or W.

I take the W and you take the A and every body is satisfied.

Can you sighn that, is that hard ?
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I see the message here.
Yes it was hard and satisfying.
I'm getting the hang of this.
 
I don't find a translation for "my", but "Mỹ" means "U.S."

I'd love an explanation from someone who understands Vietnamese.

All I have is "box" for "toan" from an e-translator ,and "safe, secure" for "Toan" as a Vietnamese boy's name.

That's just me googling. I wonder how much more information I could find if I were a trained iconologist?

Seems to me Kubrik's symbolism is fascinating. Why degrade his art with nonsense hypotheses?

ETA: Thanks for the latest screenshot, where I saw the accent on the A. e-translator says: Mỹ toàn = U'S. Complete

I know very well that e-translators are the worst source for accuracy, but I find this more fascinating than any speculation based on "my town" as though it were actually in English.
 
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Thanks for the link Mac
I can see you are digging in that problem.

It is clearly not a W but it is clearly not an A. It is war and the whole building is damaged. The letters are also damaged. The Y is not more vertical.
And a letter ^ does not exist.
So the question is, what was it befor. Everyone awaiting a vietnamesic word like My Toan.
Everyone, who is looking for an explanation for the camara position and strange alighnment in the scene where the "monolithe" is burning is open for " My Town".
And the letters which stay back in the end are Y N .
So shall I choice MY TOAN when MY TOWN fits ?
 
wikipedia said:
Nguyễn Văn Toàn (October 6, 1932 -) was born in Huế and served as a general in the Army of the Republic of Vietnam (ARVN).
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Hmm, a General TOÀN. In the ARVN. Maybe his parents misspelled his name from "Town" or something. :rolleyes:
 
Hans Peper said:
Thanks for the link Mac
I can see you are digging in that problem.

It is clearly not a W but it is clearly not an A. It is war and the whole building is damaged. The letters are also damaged. The Y is not more vertical.
And a letter ^ does not exist.
So the question is, what was it befor. Everyone awaiting a vietnamesic word like My Toan.
Everyone, who is looking for an explanation for the camara position and strange alighnment in the scene where the "monolithe" is burning is open for " My Town".
And the letters which stay back in the end are Y N .
So shall I choice MY TOAN when MY TOWN fits ?
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http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/00dd/index.htm


Go forth and learn.
 
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