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What must be said

Childlike Empress

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Childlike Empress
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Today Günter Grass - famous German Nobel literate - published a poem callled "Was gesagt werden muss (What has to be said)" about the situation in the middle east, talking straight about the hypocrisy of blaming Iran for allegedly building a nuke while Israel has them stockpiled, unchecked for and is threatening war - with high-tech German submarines they get for free.

The press sycophants are already falling over themselves, they can't even write straight anymore:

Outrage in Germany
Nobel Laureate Grass Attacks Israel in New Poem

In a poem that has drawn angry reactions in Germany, Nobel Prize-winning author Günter Grass has published a new poem criticizing Israel's policies against Iran. Historically, Grass has been outspoken in his political views, but many believe the author has now broken a taboo.
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A taboo indeed.

In response to the publication, the Israeli Embassy in Berlin issued a statement offering its own version of "What must be said." "What must be said is that it is a European tradition to accuse the Jews before the Passover festival of ritual murder," the statements reads. "Earlier, it was Christian children whose blood the Jews allegedly used to make their unleavened bread, but today it is the Iranian people that the Jewish state allegedly wants to annihilate. What also must be said is that Israel is the only state in the world whose right to exist is openly doubted. That was true on the day of its founding and it remains true today. We want to live in peace with our neighbors in the region. And we are not prepared to assume the role that Günter Grass is trying to assign to us as part of the German people's efforts to come to terms with the past."
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If you're so afraid of words, something is utterly wrong.
 
What does Gunter Grass say about Iran's policies to destroy Israel for the last 30 years? Anything at all? Does he think maybe, just maybe, that policy is what makes Israel a bit leery of Iran?
 
WildCat said:
What does Gunter Grass say about Iran's policies to destroy Israel for the last 30 years? Anything at all? Does he think maybe, just maybe, that policy is what makes Israel a bit leery of Iran?
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Regardless of why he came to his opinion, it seems harsh to call him antisemitic because he criticizes Israel
 
MG1962 said:
Regardless of why he came to his opinion, it seems harsh to call him antisemitic because he criticizes Israel
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Maybe so, but his enlistment in the Waffen SS could be seen as something on the dubious side. Apparently Grass kept quiet about this for years while wagging his finger at anyone else who may have been guilty in the past. When it turned out that he has also been in the SS it made him look a tad hypocritical.
 
angrysoba said:
Maybe so, but his enlistment in the Waffen SS could be seen as something on the dubious side. Apparently Grass kept quiet about this for years while wagging his finger at anyone else who may have been guilty in the past. When it turned out that he has also been in the SS it made him look a tad hypocritical.
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Odd (according to Wiki) he was drafted - He was trying to get into the submarine service. And all that in Nov 1944 and the grand age of 17. Might need to throw some wetter mud to see what will stick
 
MG1962 said:
Odd (according to Wiki) he was drafted - He was trying to get into the submarine service. And all that in Nov 1944 and the grand age of 17. Might need to throw some wetter mud to see what will stick
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If it was so innocuous and involuntary, why did he keep it a secret for sixty years?
 
MG1962 said:
Odd (according to Wiki) he was drafted - He was trying to get into the submarine service. And all that in Nov 1944 and the grand age of 17. Might need to throw some wetter mud to see what will stick
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How is it any better that he "was trying to get into the submarine service"?

Anyway, from the Wiki there is a quote by the German historian, Joachim Fest:

After 60 years, this confession comes a bit too late. I can't understand how someone who for decades set himself up as a moral authority, a rather smug one, could pull this off
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From what I understand, Grass was someone who demanded that Germany be a bit more honest about her past and he portrayed himself as that moral gadfly who constantly disturb any perceived German complacency. It is a bit rich of him then to say, 60 years later, "Oh, yeah, I was in the SS by the way."
 
MG1962 said:
And.......... How many times was he asked?
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So, all the times he criticised Germans and Germany for not acknowledging and dealing with their Nazi past (as part of the Vergangenheitsbewaeltigung movement), he never once saw the need to, y'know, mention and deal with his own Nazi past?

And it's not like he never talked about it just because no one ever asked. He consciously kept it hidden, and after it came out, he talked about how keeping the secret for so long weighed on his mind.
 
angrysoba said:
How is it any better that he "was trying to get into the submarine service"?
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Because it wasn't operated by the SS

From what I understand, Grass was someone who demanded that Germany be a bit more honest about her past and he portrayed himself as that moral gadfly who constantly disturb any perceived German complacency. It is a bit rich of him then to say, 60 years later, "Oh, yeah, I was in the SS by the way."
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Drafted into an SS Panzer division for three months. After being drafted into the German equivalent of the Air League the year before that
 
84-years old Grass is as important as one can get in the German "cultural establishment". Every fart he made before was analyzed and bewältigt to the n-th degree in the Agora.
 
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ANTPogo said:
So, all the times he criticised Germans and Germany for not acknowledging and dealing with their Nazi past (as part of the
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What Nazi past - Have you evidence he was ever a member of the National Socialist party? Being drafted into a manpower strapped SS division is evidence of no such thing
 
Does the poem have anything about Iran being the world's largest state sponsor of terrorism?

If I was Israel and surrounded by countries that tried to destroy me three times and hated my guts, I'd nuke up.
 
Virus said:
Does the poem have anything about Iran being the world's largest state sponsor of terrorism?

If I was Israel and surrounded by countries that tried to destroy me three times and hated my guts, I'd nuke up.
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Does Israel have nukes???? - When did that happen?
 
MG1962 said:
What Nazi past - Have you evidence he was ever a member of the National Socialist party? Being drafted into a manpower strapped SS division is evidence of no such thing
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You know what she means. The point is that Gunter Grass was not honest about his past while demanding that others be far more so about theirs. You do agree with that, right?

Virus said:
Does the poem have anything about Iran being the world's largest state sponsor of terrorism?

If I was Israel and surrounded by countries that tried to destroy me three times and hated my guts, I'd nuke up.
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And if you had been in 1940's Germany you'd have been first in the queue to join the Waffen SS, in my opinion.
 
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