What did Democrats do wrong?

[Donal]

Deportation isn't really a punishment because illegal aliens do not have any right to be in the US.

Well, these days they don't. right? Unless they are rich and white and kiss the right ass.

And of course, you want to make sure they are sent back to their proper countyr of origin.

Obviously not, because citizens have a right to be in the US. Your confusion on these issues is concerning.

Provided said citizen fits the right profile and behaves.

 

[Random]

It's not clear to me that you approve of the thing.

Also, it's not clear to me that you approve of deporting illegal immigrants for the crime of entering or remaining in the country illegally.

I mean, giving the impression that they're against basic immigration enforcement seems to be perhaps one of the things Democrats have been doing wrong. Even now you're hedging.

Entering or remaining in the country illegally is not a crime, it is a civil violation. If it was a crime, it would put prosecutors in the awkward position of having to prove a negative (that a person residing in the US did not have legal permission).

 

[Brainster]

Fundamentally, what Democrats did wrong was not spend the last four years trying to Dictator Proof the US by massively divesting power from the President and putting in more checks and balances.

Unfortunately there is little incentive to scale back power when you are the one wielding it. Remember Obama running against the surveillance powers allowed the feds in the Patriot Act, and then reauthorizing and expanding them as President?

 

[ahhell]

First of all, it’s hilarious that we keep coming back to this idea that it’s up to any of us to appeal to the electorate. Pretty sure none of us are working for the DNC.

Secondly, I don’t see you - or anyone - actually refuting the points I’m making.

What is there to refute? You seem to be saying that there is nothing the Dems did wrong because anyone that voted for Trump buys into everything he believes and apparently now, everything his potential appointments believe. How can we possibly refute that?

I've tried to point out that we have a binary choice and I for one voted for Harris despite not agreeing with her on most things. I guess you can't believe that?

 

[ahhell]

Entering or remaining in the country illegally is not a crime, it is a civil violation. If it was a crime, it would put prosecutors in the awkward position of having to prove a negative (that a person residing in the US did not have legal permission).

One more thing the dems do wrong, nobody cares if its a "crime" or a "Civil Violation" and when folks say things like that, 90% of the room rolls their eyes.

 

[Donal]

Ya, what's a little thing like Constitutional rights of the accused?

By the way, do you know why corporations are suing to get the NLRB deemed unconsitutional?

 

[Ziggurat]

Ya, what's a little thing like Constitutional rights of the accused?

Noncitizens have no constitutional right to enter the country. And the law in question applies to people who have been convicted of sexual offenses. They aren't merely "accused".

You keep getting really basic stuff completely wrong. Why?

 

[Donal]

Noncitizens have no constitutional right to enter the country.

we're talking about the farce that is immigration court

And the law in question applies to people who have been convicted of sexual offenses. They aren't merely "accused".

The law that already exists and didn't need some more poorly written, racially charged legislation from right-wingers trying to work through their grear boig feelings.

You keep getting really basic stuff completely wrong. Why?

You mean like the fact that a law for deporting violent offenders after they compelte their sentence already exists?

 

[Ziggurat]

we're talking about the farce that is immigration court

No we aren't. We're talking about a proposed piece of legislation. The problems you pointed to with ICE are independent of that proposed legislation.

You mean like the fact that a law for deporting violent offenders after they compelte their sentence already exists?

Violent offenders are not synonymous with sex offenders. So yeah, you keep getting basic stuff wrong.

 

[Thermal]

Wasn't that particular piece of legislation voted against because Dems didn't like the wording, and found it too open to abuses? The bill specified behavior like repeated harassment and stalking, without clarifying exactly what was meant or even who decides, so an aggressively anti-brown person could say that José over yonder was stalking, and onto the Deportation Express he goes?

 

[Donal]

No we aren't.

yes we are

We're talking about a proposed piece of legislation.

A poorly written and redundant piece of legislation

The problems you pointed to with ICE are independent of that proposed legislation.

No, they are joined at the hip. You can't introduce more laws without consideration of the abuses by the agency that will be enforcing said laws.

Violent offenders are not synonymous with sex offenders.

true. "sex offender" is a lot mroe vague.

So yeah, you keep getting basic stuff wrong.

No, you 're just a Republcians and can't comprehend that maybe legislation needs to be thought out and vetted, no matter how big your feelings about it are.

 

[thaiboxerken]

Fundamentally, what Democrats did wrong was not spend the last four years trying to Dictator Proof the US by massively divesting power from the President and putting in more checks and balances.

I think Merrick did the wrong thing by not bringing charges as soon as possible after Trump tried to overthrow the government. It was naive.

 

[Donal]

I think Merrick did the wrong thing by not bringing charges as soon as possible after Trump tried to overthrow the government. It was naive.

that was a blunder that qualifies as malpractice

 

[bruto]

Wasn't that particular piece of legislation voted against because Dems didn't like the wording, and found it too open to abuses? The bill specified behavior like repeated harassment and stalking, without clarifying exactly what was meant or even who decides, so an aggressively anti-brown person could say that José over yonder was stalking, and onto the Deportation Express he goes?

Of course, but it's easier just to lay simple blame. If there were a bill that solved the immigration problem by massacring them all, you could always still blame the bleeding hearts who oppose it for not solving the problem. If you think about a complex problem in a complex way you will never prevail against thoughtless simplicity.

 

[theprestige]

On "the majority of Americans are too stupid to vote they way they should" - Maybe that's another thing Democrats did wrong.

The vast majority of Americans received public education up to age 18.

Both of these institutions are dominated by progressives, and have been for generations. The people who voted this year have by and large been educated by people who overwhelmingly vote Democrat. Sure, some districts are required by law to "teach the controversy" or omit sex education. And some affluent families do send their kids to private schools. But as a demographic, American voters have predominantly been a captive audience for progressive educators during their most formative years.

So that's - what? - three, maybe four generations of voters out there right now, products of American public education. And you're saying that a majority of them are too stupid to vote the way they should. So maybe (probably) the scope of what Democrats did wrong goes far, far beyond the way the they managed this election campaign.

 

[Olmstead]

On "the majority of Americans are too stupid to vote they way they should" - Maybe that's another thing Democrats did wrong.

The vast majority of Americans received public education up to age 18.

Both of these institutions are dominated by progressives, and have been for generations. The people who voted this year have by and large been educated by people who overwhelmingly vote Democrat. Sure, some districts are required by law to "teach the controversy" or omit sex education. And some affluent families do send their kids to private schools. But as a demographic, American voters have predominantly been a captive audience for progressive educators during their most formative years.

So that's - what? - three, maybe four generations of voters out there right now, products of American public education. And you're saying that a majority of them are too stupid to vote the way they should. So maybe (probably) the scope of what Democrats did wrong goes far, far beyond the way the they managed this election campaign.

It's almost like public schools aren't the hotbed of progressive indoctrination you think they are, but just underpaid educated people doing their best to teach the basics.

I don't see how Democrats get the flak for this, other than the fact that educated people inexplicably seem to end up with progressive values.

 

[Thermal]

On "the majority of Americans are too stupid to vote they way they should" - Maybe that's another thing Democrats did wrong.

The vast majority of Americans received public education up to age 18.

Both of these institutions are dominated by progressives, and have been for generations. The people who voted this year have by and large been educated by people who overwhelmingly vote Democrat. Sure, some districts are required by law to "teach the controversy" or omit sex education. And some affluent families do send their kids to private schools. But as a demographic, American voters have predominantly been a captive audience for progressive educators during their most formative years.

So that's - what? - three, maybe four generations of voters out there right now, products of American public education. And you're saying that a majority of them are too stupid to vote the way they should. So maybe (probably) the scope of what Democrats did wrong goes far, far beyond the way the they managed this election campaign.

I wouldn't say stupid in the sense of being *unable* to work it out, but more stupid in the sense of being *unwilling* to give voting the consideration it is due. Willful, or negligent stupidity.

Also, I'd humbly opine that the failing extends well into conservative state's educational systems, as well as very conservative private institutions

 

[Reformed Offlian]

On "the majority of Americans are too stupid to vote they way they should" - Maybe that's another thing Democrats did wrong.

The vast majority of Americans received public education up to age 18.

Both of these institutions are dominated by progressives, and have been for generations. The people who voted this year have by and large been educated by people who overwhelmingly vote Democrat. Sure, some districts are required by law to "teach the controversy" or omit sex education. And some affluent families do send their kids to private schools. But as a demographic, American voters have predominantly been a captive audience for progressive educators during their most formative years.

So that's - what? - three, maybe four generations of voters out there right now, products of American public education. And you're saying that a majority of them are too stupid to vote the way they should. So maybe (probably) the scope of what Democrats did wrong goes far, far beyond the way the they managed this election campaign.

"What Democrats did wrong is not indoctrinate kids hard enough in school" is a weird take.

 

[Donal]

because he isn't making good faith arguments

 

[Reformed Offlian]

because he isn't making good faith arguments

At least he didn't start his post with the word "So".