Webpage "Patriots Question 9/11" Addressed

lapman:

first two on the list are William Rodriguez, and his friend/co-worker Anthony Saltalamacchia. We have heard from both of them recently, so i think we know where each of them stands.

TAM:)
 
Phillip Morelli:
WTC 9/11 survivor.
WTC Construction Worker for 7 years

here is the quote as found at PQ911 from a RM file (audio), but with Mr. Miller's comments removed...

"... As I'm walking by the main freight car of the building, in the corridor, that's when I got blown. I mean the impact of the explosion, from whatever happened, it threw me to the floor. And that's when everything started happening. It knocked me right to the floor. You didn't know what it was. Of course, you're assuming something fell over on the loading dock, something very heavy, something very big. You don't know what happened. And all of a sudden you just felt the floor moving. ...

I was racing -- I was going towards the bathroom. All of a sudden. I opened the door. I didn't know it was a bathroom And all of a sudden a big impact happened again. And all the ceiling tiles were falling down. The light fixtures were falling, swinging out of the ceiling. And I come running out the door and everything, the walls were down. And I now started running towards the parking lots.

As I ran to the parking lots, you know, I mean, everybody screaming ... There was a lot of smoke down there. ... You gotta go clear across the whole -- from One to Two World Trade Center. That's the way you gotta run.

And then all of a sudden it happened all over again. Building Two got hit. I don't know that. I just know something else hit us to the floor. Right in the basement you felt it. The walls were caving in. Everything that was going on. I know of people that got killed in the basement. I know of people that got broken legs in the basement. People got reconstructive surgery because the walls hit them in the face."
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http://patriotsquestion911.com/survivors.html

http://real.ny1.com:8080/ramgen/real/RMmorelli00028467_020908_194213hi.rm

Here is a more complete transcription...

... As I'm walking by the main freight car of the building, in the corridor, that's when I got blown. I mean the impact of the explosion, of whatever happened, it threw me to the floor. And that's when everything started happening. It knocked me right to the floor. You didn't know what it was. Of course, you're assuming something fell over on the loading dock, something very heavy, something very big. You don't know what happened. And all of a sudden you, you just felt the floor moving, and you get up, and the walls, and then you know I mean now I'm hearing that the a..main freight car, the elevators, you know what I mean, fell down, so I was right near the main freight car so I assume what that was. Then you know you heard that coming toward ya.

I was racing -- I was going towards the bathroom. All of a sudden. I opened the door. I didn't know it was a bathroom And all of a sudden a big impact happened again. And all the ceiling tiles were falling down. The light fixtures were falling, swinging out of the ceiling. And I come running out the door and everything, the walls were down. And I now started running towards the parking lots...

I just thought something uh because I know the loading dock is on B1, thats 3 floors above me, I just assumed that a car or something exploded on B1, or somethin got delivered, and something big and heavy fell over, you you just knew it was something big, cause you know I just can't imagine living in San Francisco or earth quakes, but when the floor is moving underneath ya, and everything is just happening, and smoke and people screaming, it...that...then, you just...i, I never knew, I never knew, its like to this...when I got outside the building, and I was running down the west side, it was the only time I heard about planes hitting the building.

As I ran to the parking lots, you know, I mean, everybody screaming, I actually helped somebody get to a staircase, that had a broken leg, There was a lot of smoke down there, there was a lot of people screaming, people came with us, running up the ramps, we wanted to get help, for the people that couldn't move down there. And as we were running up the ramps, and you know its not like a regular mall, that your going straight up, you have to go, you gotta go clear across the whole -- from One to Two World Trade Center. That's the way you gotta run.

And then all of a sudden it happened all over again. Building Two got hit. I don't know that. I just know something else hit us to the floor. Right in the basement you felt it. The walls were caving in. Everything that was going on. I know of people that got killed in the basement. I know of people that got broken legs in the basement. People got reconstructive surgery because the walls hit them in the face..."
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Bolded = Words/sentences left out at the PQ911 site, but in actual interview...

This is about all I can find on him (this interview, comments about it, etc...).

TAM:)
 
There's a small (read: miniscule) chance that I could contact some of the military or intelligence professionals on that page. It would depend (for the military) on if they're listed in the AKO White pages if they're Army; I'm not positive that would include other branches, but there might be some other avenues I could check. As for the intel people, there's another small (miniscule again) possibility I can locate an email address for them. Does anyone really think this is something that I should try, given the disclaimer posted there by the website creator, or would I just be wasting the time of people I hope to work with in the future?
 
Marlene Cruz:
WTC 9/11 survivor
WTC Carpenter (15 years)

On the PQ911 site, the only article given there is the Peter Jennings interview with her for ABC News, on 9/12/2001, here is the quote as found on PQ911 (Editor's Notes removed):

Peter Jennings: So tell me how you're feeling. How did you get there? What happened to you?

Marlene Cruz: I work for the Trade Center. I'm one of the carpenters. And I was gonna go do a job. And I got on the elevator, the freight elevator. And I heard the first explosion. And the elevator blew up. The doors blew up. And it dropped. I was lucky that the elevator got caught between two floors.

Peter Jennings: Which floors?

Marlene Cruz: The B Levels. The basement levels. ...

After the first explosion I was laying on the floor about 40 minutes.

Peter Jennings: And how well do you know that subterranean part of the World Trade Center?

Marlene Cruz: Well, I worked for the building for 15 years. I think I know it from the back of my hand. Really I didn't expect this bombing to occur after the first one, since I was in the first one, also. But when I heard that explosion that's the first thing I thought was; here we go again, another bomb.
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Here, however, is a more complete transcript of the section of the interview in question:

Peter Jennings: So tell me how you're feeling. How did you get there? What happened to you?

Marlene Cruz: I work for the Trade Center. I'm one of the carpenters. And I was gonna go do a job. And I got on the elevator, the freight elevator. And I heard the first explosion. And the elevator blew up. The doors blew up. And it dropped. I was lucky that the elevator got caught between two floors.

Peter Jennings: Which floors?

Marlene Cruz: The B Levels. The basement levels, where , you know all the mechanics are. And umm, with the screaming and yelling, other co-workers pulled the elevator guy out, and myself, I was laying there for about 40 minutes, and my boss couldn't wait for the EMS, he went crazy, says "Get her outta here, get her outta here." and he was able to get me out through Barkley Street, through the parking lot, and I wanna thank him for for saving me because if I was still down there, I wouldn't be here today.

Peter Jennings: Ummm, at what point did you actually get out of the building?

Marlene Cruz: Ahhh, when everything first started, you know, I according to the hospital I was the first trauma patient that walked in here. So I was lucky to be one of the first, but, I, after the first explosion I was laying on the floor about 40 minutes.

Peter Jennings: And how well do you know that subterranean part of the World Trade Center?

Marlene Cruz: Well, I worked for the building for 15 years. I think I know it from the back of my hand. Really I didn't expect this bombing to occur after the first one, since I was in the first one, also. But when I heard that explosion that's the first thing I thought was; here we go again, another bomb.
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Bolded= Added in by me...

Not much else on her either, except for this interview...anyone have any other comments from her.

TAM:)
 
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Sabrina said:
There's a small (read: miniscule) chance that I could contact some of the military or intelligence professionals on that page. It would depend (for the military) on if they're listed in the AKO White pages if they're Army; I'm not positive that would include other branches, but there might be some other avenues I could check. As for the intel people, there's another small (miniscule again) possibility I can locate an email address for them. Does anyone really think this is something that I should try, given the disclaimer posted there by the website creator, or would I just be wasting the time of people I hope to work with in the future?
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If it is a non risk venture for you, we can only gain from extra knowledge, however, unlike the truthers, I am not about to harass anyone about this, so I think if emails are acquired they should be kept by you and given ONLY to those you trust will not harass and will NOT make them public.

TAM:)
 
I have a question about Cruz though....

A lot of the truther sites quote her as a "witness to pre-planted explosives in the basement of WTC." but from that interview, I cannot tell (A) how far up she was when she got on the elevator, (B) if she had gone up at all before the explosion, (C) If there were pre-planted explosives in the basement, below where she was (she says the elevator fell), then why would this cause the elevator to drop? (I could see this happening if he explosions were from above and caused a severing of the cable for the elevator, but I do not know how the damn things work.), (D) Where in this interview does she say the explosion came from below her?

Anyone know any more details on this, or have the truthers made a HUGE leap by insinuating that the above interview proves EXPLOSIVES IN THE BASEMENT?

TAM:)
 
TAM: Oh no question about it; I'd be doing all the contacting myself. I just wondered if people thought it might be a worthwhile venture to do so.
 
Sabrina said:
Does anyone really think this is something that I should try, given the disclaimer posted there by the website creator, or would I just be wasting the time of people I hope to work with in the future?
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I should think that most of the military people would like to be able to have their names expunged from a roster of lunatics. It could huirt their careers later to be too closely linked to some of the others there even if on false premises.

I know Wesley Clark would not want to advance Bunel's career, given what Bunel did to get cashiered out.
 
T.A.M. said:
Anyone know any more details on this, or have the truthers made a HUGE leap by insinuating that the above interview proves EXPLOSIVES IN THE BASEMENT?

TAM:)
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They don't even seem to realize that the lack of generalized fires in the parking level kind of rules out the detonation there of bombs adequately powerful to over-pressurize such large areas and do so much structural damage.

So, yes, it is a huge leap of faith. A belief utterly unsupported by the facts.
 
Engineers and Architects for Truth eh?

901_hi_boys.jpg

/
'9/11 was an inside job'
 
I still want to know where they are getting this "she survived explosions in the basement" line? I can find no reference made by her in her interview that the explosion came from the basement...none. And her description of events in NO WAY support explosions in the basement.

It really annoys me, cause I think they are taking her recollection of being there for the 1993 bombing, and then her first thoughts on 9/11, after the explosion, was "oh no, not another bomb.", and turning this into "multiple bombs in the basement of the WTC", which is biggest cherry twisting of testimony I have ever seen...disgusting actually.

TAM:)
 
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Here is what the site has to say about the survivors and their testimonies:

Many 9/11 survivors and many 9/11 victim family members have expressed significant criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report. Several even allege government complicity in the terrible acts of 9/11.

The public statements of many survivors contradict the Commission Report. And the words and actions of some of the victims on that terrible day are in conflict with the Commission Report. This section is a collection of their statements. This website is not an organization and it should be made clear that none of these individuals are affiliated with this website.

Listed below are statements by more than 190 9/11 survivors, victims and family members that contradict or are critical of the 9/11 Commission Report. Their collective voices give credibility to the claim that the 9/11 Commission Report is tragically flawed.

These individuals cannot be simply dismissed as irresponsible believers in some 9/11 conspiracy theory. Their statements are based on their intimate familiarity with and intense study of the events of 9/11. Their criticism of the Commission Report is not inherently irresponsible or illogical, In fact, it is based on their desire to honor the victims of that terrible day by finding the truth and bringing to justice those responsible for these terrible acts.
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http://patriotsquestion911.com/survivors.html

TAM:)
 
Mike Pecoraro
WTC 9/11 survivor.
Stationary Engineer - the World Trade Center.

Here is the quote used at PQ911 (with Editor's Notes removed) from the Chief Engineer 2002 Article:

Article Chief Engineer 2002: Mike Pecoraro and a co-worker were working in the sub-basement of the North Tower when the first airplane hit. "They had been told to stay where they were and "sit tight" until the Assistant Chief got back to them. By this time, however, the room they were working in began to fill with a white smoke. "We smelled kerosene," Mike recalled, "I was thinking maybe a car fire was upstairs", referring to the parking garage located below grade in the tower but above the deep space where they were working.

The two decided to ascend the stairs to the C level, to a small machine shop where Vito Deleo and David Williams were supposed to be working. When the two arrived at the C level, they found the machine shop gone.

"There was nothing there but rubble, " Mike said. "We're talking about a 50 ton hydraulic press? gone!" The two began yelling for their co-workers, but there was no answer. They saw a perfect line of smoke streaming through the air. "You could stand here," he said, "and two inches over you couldn't breathe. We couldn't see through the smoke so we started screaming." But there was still no answer.

The two made their way to the parking garage, but found that it, too, was gone. "There were no walls, there was rubble on the floor, and you can't see anything" he said.

They decided to ascend two more levels to the building's lobby. As they ascended to the B Level, one floor above, they were astonished to see a steel and concrete fire door that weighed about 300 pounds, wrinkled up "like a piece of aluminum foil" and lying on the floor. "They got us again," Mike told his co-worker, referring to the terrorist attack at the center in 1993. Having been through that bombing, Mike recalled seeing similar things happen to the building's structure. He was convinced a bomb had gone off in the building. Mike walked through the open doorway and found two people lying on the floor. One was a female Carpenter and the other an Elevator Operator. They were both badly burned and injured."
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http://patriotsquestion911.com/survivors.html
http://www.chiefengineer.org/article.cfm?seqnum1=1029


Here is a more complete production of the relevant section(s):

Mike's assignment that day would be to continue constructing a gantry that would be used to pull the heads from the 2,500 ton chillers, located in the 6th sub- basement level of the tower. 49,000 tons of refrigeration equipment were located in the lower level of the tower. The 2,500 ton units were the smallest in use.

Donning his hearing protection, respirator, gloves and eye protection, Mike, along with another engineer, began the work day using a large grinder to smooth down the welds on steel they were using for the gantry. Deep underground, in an area surrounded by solid bedrock, the noise made by the grinder reverberated from the walls as sparks flew from the spinning grinding wheel.

Deep below the tower, Mike Pecoraro was suddenly interrupted in his grinding task by a shake on his shoulder from his co-worker. "Did you see that?" he was asked. Mike told him that he had seen nothing. "You didn't see the lights flicker?", his co-worker asked again. "No," Mike responded, but he knew immediately that if the lights had flickered, it could spell trouble. A power surge or interruption could play havoc with the building's equipment. If all the pumps trip out or pulse meters trip, it could make for a very long day bringing the entire center's equipment back on-line.

Mike told his co-worker to call upstairs to their Assistant Chief Engineer and find out if everything was all right. His co-worker made the call and reported back to Mike that he was told that the Assistant Chief did not know what happened but that the whole building seemed to shake and there was a loud explosion. They had been told to stay where they were and "sit tight" until the Assistant Chief got back to them. By this time, however, the room they were working in began to fill with a white smoke. "We smelled kerosene," Mike recalled, "I was thinking maybe a car fire was upstairs", referring to the parking garage located below grade in the tower but above the deep space where they were working.

The two decided to ascend the stairs to the C level, to a small machine shop where Vito Deleo and David Williams were supposed to be working. When the two arrived at the C level, they found the machine shop gone.

"There was nothing there but rubble, "Mike said. "We're talking about a 50 ton hydraulic press ? gone!" The two began yelling for their co-workers, but there was no answer. They saw a perfect line of smoke streaming through the air. "You could stand here," he said, "and two inches over you couldn't breathe. We couldn't see through the smoke so we started screaming." But there was still no answer.

The two made their way to the parking garage, but found that it, too, was gone. "There were no walls, there was rubble on the floor, and you can't see anything" he said.

They decided to ascend two more levels to the building's lobby. As they ascended to the B Level, one floor above, they were astonished to see a steel and concrete fire door that weighed about 300 pounds, wrinkled up "like a piece of aluminum foil" and lying on the floor. "They got us again," Mike told his co-worker, referring to the terrorist attack at the center in 1993. Having been through that bombing, Mike recalled seeing similar things happen to the building's structure. He was convinced a bomb had gone off in the building. Mike walked through the open doorway and found two people lying on the floor. One was a female Carpenter and the other an Elevator Operator. They were both badly burned and injured. Realizing he had to get help, Mike ascended to the Lobby Level where he met Arti DelBianco, a member of his work crew. People were now coming down the same stairway from above the lobby and Arti and Mike had to stay where they were to direct people out of the stairway door and into the building's lobby. If they didn't, people descending could walk past the lobby door and unwittingly keep descending into the sublevels of the building.

Mike and Arti stayed in the stairwell at the first floor of the tower directing people through the doors. People flooded the stairwell and a great amount of water was also streaming steadily down the stairs. Describing the people coming down Mike said: "Some were burnt, some cut, some screaming, some fine; like there was nothing going on".

"Literally thousands of people came by us down those stairs," Mike said. At one point, an engineer had to run down the stairs to bring some tenants who had inadvertently passed the first floor, back up to the lobby level.

The smoke in the stairwell was constant and at one point, Mike told Arti that he was going to catch a quick breath of fresh air. He walked out into the main lobby of the building, seeing it for the first time.

"When I walked out into the lobby, it was incredible," he recalled. "The whole lobby was soot and black, elevator doors were missing. The marble was missing off some of the walls. 20-foot section of marble, 20 by 10 foot sections of marble, gone from the walls". The west windows were all gone. They were missing. These are tremendous windows. They were just gone. Broken glass everywhere, the revolving doors were all broken and their glass was gone. Every sprinkler head was going off. I am thinking to myself, how are these sprinkler heads going off? It takes a lot of heat to set off a sprinkler head. It never dawned on me that there was a giant fireball that came through the air of the lobby. I never knew that until later on. The jet fuel actually came down the elevator shaft, blew off all the (elevator) doors and flames rolled through the lobby. That explained all the burnt people and why everything was sooted in the lobby."

Spotting someone from the New York Port Authority, Mike asked him what had happened. He told Mike that a helicopter had struck the building. Mike immediately thought the helicopter must have struck at or near the lobby level. He made his way back to the stairwell and told Arti what he had found.
"Arti, I think we better get out of here," Mike recalled telling him. "If something falls on us here, we are done."

They decided to try and re-group with the other Engineers and together left the stairwell. There were hundreds of firemen on the scene by then. "Everything was chaotic," he said. "People were running in every direction. People were on the mezzanine. The second floor had a ledge that went all the way around the inside of the building's lobby. It was packed with people that were coming out of all the other stairwells".

Mike Pecoraro and Arti made their way out of Tower One and went to Tower Two. They encountered a crowd of people standing outside the tower, not knowing what had happened. Apparently, they had witnessed a fireball come through the lobby after the second airplane had struck that tower, but they were entering directly from the subway underground and had as yet, no idea of what was happening. Mike and Arti told them all to leave and go home. They then made their way to 4 World Trade Center where they encountered a guard who initially was refusing to leave her post. "Just go home," Mike told her. "You don't have a job, it's done". Reluctantly, the guard left and walked towards the north side of the complex.
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Bolding is mine, for emphasis.

Once again, apart from this interview with his story, there seems to be nothing more on this man, just truther postings of the same...

Here is my take on it...

1. He never suggests "bombs" or "explosives". He did not even witness, visually or audibly, an explosion. He has relayed to him by a co-worker that the Assistant Chief Engineer said he/she did not know what happened but that the whole building seemed to shake and there was a loud explosion.

2. They smelled KEROSENE (hmmmm...like jet fuel, not explosives).

3. A lot of the details I have bolded, seem to indicate a large destructive force occured in the sublevels, but as to whether it was an explosive, versus a fireball, versus damage caused from the building shifting/shaking, or more than one of the above, the details do not help.

TAM:)
 
All right then, I'll see what I can do.

I happen to belong to a mailing list for current and former military intelligence professionals; I'll post the website and see if I can get some assistance locating the ones who seem to be more on the level (I'll leave off people like Kwiatkowski and Razer, for instance) so that they can be informed their good names are being used to smirch the reputation of the very government they used to (and in many cases still do) serve. They might be able to help with locating some of the intel professionals as well. I'll let everyone know what's said in response.
 
I am having trouble locating any other source for the following...

September 23, 2007 – Seven CIA veterans have severely criticized the official account of 9/11 and have called for a new investigation. “I think at simplest terms, there’s a cover-up. The 9/11 Report is a joke,” said Raymond McGovern, 27-year veteran of the CIA, who chaired National Intelligence Estimates during the seventies. “There are a whole bunch of unanswered questions. And the reason they’re unanswered is because this administration will not answer the questions,” he said. McGovern, who is also the founder of VIPS (Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity), is one of many signers of a petition to reinvestigate 9/11.[1]
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Which appears in this OpEdNews article by Alan Miller, also the founder of PQ911.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/genera_alan_mil_070922_seven_cia_veterans_c.htm


A google search for this only comes up with reference to this article. Given that within the article he does not source this comment (he sources the petition, but when you go to the petition, there is no mention of the above comments on the commission report by him, so I assume the reference to the petition is only to confirm McGovern is a signer), I can only assume that these words were said to Mr. Miller, by Mr. McGovern...interesting.

I mention this, as it is linked at the top of every one of the PQ911 pages...

http://patriotsquestion911.com/survivors.html

TAM:)
 
Thanks T.A.M. for your great work :) I'm getting to the survivors - part after I finish the military section. Your input helps a great deal!
 
I think Doug Rokke could be counted among disaffected cranks. He did some good work on the hazards of DU penetrator rounds, but seems to think that one of them might have been used at he pentagon, and he insists that there were internal concrete walls where the plane penetrated. He does associate freely with the whackadoo press a lot. He seems to be in with Alex Jones.

Kind of a pity, really. He could be worth something to the country if he stuck to what he knows and and stayed away from the woo-woo pile.
 
T.A.M. said:
I have a question about Cruz though....

A lot of the truther sites quote her as a "witness to pre-planted explosives in the basement of WTC." but from that interview, I cannot tell (A) how far up she was when she got on the elevator, (B) if she had gone up at all before the explosion, (C) If there were pre-planted explosives in the basement, below where she was (she says the elevator fell), then why would this cause the elevator to drop? (I could see this happening if he explosions were from above and caused a severing of the cable for the elevator, but I do not know how the damn things work.), (D) Where in this interview does she say the explosion came from below her?

Anyone know any more details on this, or have the truthers made a HUGE leap by insinuating that the above interview proves EXPLOSIVES IN THE BASEMENT?

TAM:)
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She was in freight elevator #50A with Arthuro Griffith, who was the elevator operator. This elevator goes all the way from B4 to the top of WTC 1:

A. GRIFFITH: Well, I was on my way from B-2 to 49th floor. And as I took off, it was amount it was a matter of seconds -- five, six, seven seconds, I don't know. And there was a loud explosion and the elevator dropped. And when the elevator dropped there was a lot of debris and cables falling on top of the elevator. And I just -- I just put my hand over my said and I said, oh God I'm going to die. But I didn't know what was happening.
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Source: CNN

The elevator stopped just below the B1 level. There they both were rescued out of the elevator car by coworkers on that level seconds before the fireball came down the elevator shaft.

Flight 11's path of impact inside WTC 1 went straight trough the elevator shaft of #50A up in the impact zone. So when Flight 11 hit WTC 1 the cables to their elevator car were cut when the debris from Flight 11 crashed trough the core of the building. As indicated by the text I bolded in the quote above. And the quote below.

Arturo Griffith, a Panamanian, was in a lift at the time of the impact. The whole car shook and juddered as he heard an ominous noise from above
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Source

The hoist cable would have been attached to a counterweight that goes down when elevator goes up and vice versa. This is standard procedure to save energy, I would expect that the elevators in WTC 1 where constructed in this manner to. But that counter weight would still be high above their car when it fell. So there is no way an explosion below the car could cut the cables above the car, neither is the truther's claims supported by Arturo's accounts, nor everything else known about what happened inside WTC 1 that day.

Yes, the truhter's are definitely taking a BIG leap not supported by facts regarding the interview with Marlene Cruez.

You will find a lot more about this, as always, on Gravey's excelent pages:
http://911stories.googlepages.com/home
http://911stories.googlepages.com/comparisonofwitnessaccountstorodriguezst2

Here is a YouTube video of the inteview with Peter Jennings:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TSGZYP--wz0

By the way in the post about Mike Pecaro:
Mike walked through the open doorway and found two people lying on the floor. One was a female Carpenter and the other an Elevator Operator. They were both badly burned and injured.
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This is very likely Arturo Griffith and Marlene Cruz, though neither of them complained about burns, but possibly their cloths could have been scorched by the fireball, but they very likely avoided any direct contact with the fireball since they likely would have been laying on the floor due to their injuries, when the fireball arrived. That in contrast to the worker who came in to Rodriguz's office badly burnt, after he walked past the freight elevator.

Keep on the good work T.A.M:)
Norseman
 
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