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VP Debate Thread

not_so_new said:
I am watching this on Tivo and I am just getting to the end. I think she just starts to fall apart here at the very end here when she started talking about the VeeP responsibilities.
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Arcane constitutional stuff that no one will remeber come tomorrow.
 
Meh. Tie. Better than the first presidential debate. I think Biden was the better debater, but I don't think the polls will reflect that tremendously. Might be some small gains for McCain due to low Palin expectations and the firming effects we saw after the presidential debates - regression to the mean and whatnot.

Dark horse impact point might be Palin's demeanor - she was obviously trying to get a rise out of Biden and he wasn't biting.
 
corplinx said:
...both are against gay marriage.
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Interestingly, I thought that was one place where there was a clear difference. Yes, they're both against "redefining marriage", but Biden came down solidly on why same-sex couples deserve equal protection under the constitution and listed some of the ways that same-sex couples are currently discriminated against. I halfway expected him to say he would consider approving gay marriage. Palin gave it lip service, and not very convincing lip service at that.
 
I thought a bad moment for Palin was when she reminded us of the Couric interview, repeating her line about how "McCain is a maverick taking shots from both sides of the aisle," which is what she said when she couldn't give a specific answer about what he's done about regulation.
 
You know, if Palin was really interested in world affairs and economics, she would have done soooo much better. She clearly isnt that interested in what happens in the world. I know many many women who know sooo much more then she does.
 
I thought Biden won, though Palin did have a few decent moments. Biden seemed much better on content and addressing the moderator's questions directly rather than moving to canned talking points. Palin certainly played to her "down home hockey mom" persona to a T, and did it pretty well, but Biden was much more pointed in his criticisms, and Palen really didn't seem to respond very well.

I thought Palin got stronger toward the end, and did nail Biden on a couple of points:
- On Afghanistan, after he discussed Gen. McKiernan's statement on "the surge" strategy, she shot right back and it was the only time in the debate Biden actually seemed somewhat flustered and had to back off.
- Ditto on Iraq, after she pointed out that he voted for the war in spite of trying to pass it off as if he had been against it. Oddly, he shortly thereafter started listing all of the blunders in Iraq, and it seemed it would have made sense for Gov. Palin to re-emphasize that he had voted for the war that caused all of those blunders, but she actually seemed kind of flustered by it again.

Beyond those two points, though, I thought Biden had her on the ropes a lot more. There were two many points he made about John McCain that she flat-out ignored or didn't have a response to, especially all his remarks about John McCain not being a maverick. Seems like that would have been a pretty important point to rebut.
 
Cain said:
The Shia extremists? What'd she say? I was typing. Bitch.
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Mentioned them as a problem along with al qaeda. Which is quite correct. The big winners in the middle east of late have been the shia. Problem is the way she ran them together. Much like we saw with al qaeda and Iraq back before the invasion. Not good.
 
Hummmmmmmmmm......

I just realized that this is one huge Couric interview.

There is not one coherent answer to a question that was asked. It was just like Couric asking questions and her dancing.

I think she she did a MUCH better job than in her Couric interviews but the fundamental answers were pretty much the same. I quick half line on point that leads to a diversion to a different topic then a whole new topic completely.

I think the difference is that Couric was not there to ask the follow up and try to steer her back on point so the wandering answers just didn't seem quite out of place.

Biden was not ALWAYS on point than I would have liked but I think he did a WHOLE lot better at answering the questions directly.
 
aerosolben said:
Too bad, too. That should have been Biden's biggest win.
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Got a few points for raiseing the spector of Cheney but that would be the limit unless the obama campain can find a way to make it interesting.
 
In general, my number one issue is fast-tracking nuclear/solar/wind power and drilling. This makes me a McCain voter if I only vote on my number one issue. I leaned towards Obama/Biden however on social issues until tonight. I apparently was under the incorrect assumption that the Obama-Biden ticket supported ending the discrimination against gays who want to marry. I consider it the last big legal discrimination.

You can imagine then how surprised I was to hear that Obama-Biden are against it tonight in the debate. I thought they were for it.

What then is left to vote for?

Both tickets support:
leaving iraq
more troops in afhanistan
low taxes
no gay marriage
more drilling
an interventionist foreign policy
health care plans we can't afford in the current economy and will never pass the house/senate

Its like picking between two clones of Ronald Reagan who have been tainted with a tiny bit of Hillary Clinton DNA.

Where's the change?
 
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parky76 said:
You know, if Palin was really interested in world affairs and economics, she would have done soooo much better. She clearly isnt that interested in what happens in the world. I know many many women who know sooo much more then she does.
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Palin was never going to match Biden on world affairs. Questionable if McCain could. Economics? Alaska's economy is very different from the rest of the US's so no opertunity to pick that kind of stuff up as she went along.
 
Tricky said:
Interestingly, I thought that was one place where there was a clear difference. Yes, they're both against "redefining marriage", but Biden came down solidly on why same-sex couples deserve equal protection under the constitution and listed some of the ways that same-sex couples are currently discriminated against. I halfway expected him to say he would consider approving gay marriage. Palin gave it lip service, and not very convincing lip service at that.
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In his original statement, I thought he came down solidly for it. However, when he responded to her remarks on it, he made it clear Obama/Biden don't support gay marriage.
 
GreyICE said:
This is the end. Palin has done all she ever will for the McCain campaign, and it's not enough. She went up there and performed reasonably competently. She provided all the answers which will energize her base, while Biden gave rational, logical points with a minimum of fuss.

Problem is, Biden's base is already energized by two deeply polarizing personalities. He managed to come off much more experienced, which I think will play well, and Palin fed h her base its scraps (The ones who are angry about "those who believe in statistics over testimonials of honest men of good character") but it's not enough.

After seeing this, it's reasonably obvious. President Obama will be leading our nation in 2009, and I will bet on that. The usual suspects (like Brainsty, Whiplashed and B.A.C.) will proclaim that Palin somehow won by exceeding low expectations (she didn't wet herself, which is about the only way she could have come off worse than she has in the interviews) but the fact of the matter is, barring a revalation that Obama is a drug addict or McCain secretly traveled in time and rescued Jesus Christ, Plato, and our Camelot just to get the best advisers possible, we're through.
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Interesting analysis. There are still two more debates, but I agree that it would take some sort of major October Surprise to save McCain-Palin now.
 
I didn't hear Biden say a single thing about "more drilling". The only thing he mentioned was that no new oil could be brought on-line for ten years (which may be an underestimation). Instead he hammered on alternative energy and how McCain had voted against it. (I'll need some fact-checking on that.)

But I'm happy to let all our oil go undrilled, or at least unproduced. "Burn theirs first, save ours for later" is my motto. We don't have nearly enough energy to compensate for our imports anyway. All that "drill-baby-drill" would do is hasten the day when we are 100% dependent on foreign sources of petrochemicals.
 
corplinx said:
In his original statement, I thought he came down solidly for it. However, when he responded to her remarks on it, he made it clear Obama/Biden don't support gay marriage.
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Yes and that bothered me greatly.

I know that I am not going to agree with any politician 100% EVER so I will still vote for Obama / Biden but I don't like this point from Biden at all.
 
Sarah Palin held her own and at least undid some of the damage she had done to herself in her earlier interviews. She is however nowhere near ready to be VP.

Biden did great too, most of all, he was a gentleman who showed kindness and respect as well as complete command of the issues.

All in all-A good debate!
 
corplinx said:
In general, my number one issue is fast-tracking nuclear/solar/wind power and drilling. This makes me a McCain voter if I only vote on my number one issue.
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Vote Obama not McCain. He has a much better grasp on that issue than McCain does.
 
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