VFF to Appear on Rational Alchemy

[Empress]

I got 40 odd minutes into it.

This is what Anita told Jeff Wagg:

"I recently had an experience where I tried to heal a man who is having devastating migraines, and he thinks it worked so now I'm having to investigate whether I'm a healer"

Jeff Wagg didn't pull her up on it, he wanted her to tell him about her ghosts claim. I don't know if he said anything about her above statement later, because I stopped listening in disgust.

Jeff Wagg also thinks Anita should be given credit for guessing (and Anita calls it guessing) the correct person in Trial 3.

What would James Randi say?

Oh christ on a popsicle stick! They played right into her mentally ill hands. This crap isn't good for anyone--including Anita.

I appreciate your posting this, Farencue. Now I know not to listen to it.

 

[Cuddles]

Very disappointing. Even if there's not enough time for the management to spend their time on the forum, you'd think Jeff would at least do some basic research before going on a public broadcast. It's not like it's hard to find the discussions about Anita's failures.

 

[Lisa Simpson]

It's really a dreadful interview.

 

[Grimes]

edit: gah, wrong website entirely. Darn tabs.

 

[likelystory]

The interviewers really sounded like they are encouraging Anita to take more tests. Anita must be a pretty young woman from how the men spoke such nice over polite words to her.

Where's the scrutiny in the interview?

 

[desertgal]

Where's the scrutiny in the interview?

You heard it. There wasn't any.

 

[GeeMack]

Jeff Wagg also thinks Anita should be given credit for guessing (and Anita calls it guessing) the correct person in Trial 3.

Jeff obviously didn't read and/or understand the protocol for the IIG show. If he did he would have known the same thing everyone else here knows (except Anita and maybe a few of her lust-struck defenders), and that is the objective of the test was to determine if she could see missing kidneys, not to determine which person was missing a kidney.

This can't be stressed enough. The test was not a guessing game to pick the person missing a kidney. What was being tested was Anita's claim that she can see inside people, right through their skin and flesh. And using that ability she was to determine, with that never-fail accuracy which she had so often claimed, specifically which kidneys were missing.

Anita failed the moment she didn't see the first missing kidney in the first round of the test. She got an "F" as sure as if she had wussed out on a college class. There was no sliding scale involved. See through people's cotton shirts, skin, and flesh, and spot the three missing kidneys, or not. She did not.

It's really a dreadful interview.

It certainly was. Maybe Jeff Wagg will apologize to Mr. Randi and the JREF for poorly representing the organization by being so ill prepared. And the whole thing seemed a far cry from Jeff's previously stated position on the matter...

VFF is allowed to be dishonest, just like everyone else. Having dealt with more challenge applicants than just abut anyone else, I'm familiar with people like her. She's most likely deluded, lying, or both. She's probably doing all this to get attention. And she's allowed to do all those things so long as she's staying within the rules of the forum.

So, "She's most likely deluded, lying, or both," eh? Given the opportunity to express those sentiments, it's a shame he let it slip away.

What would James Randi say?

Maybe he'd say he hired the wrong guy to go out in the world as a spokesman for one of the world's most respected, preeminent skeptics' organizations? Maybe he'd tell Jeff to study up a bit before he gets involved in similar interviews and discussions in the future? Or maybe he wouldn't say anything if he isn't paying any attention either.

 

[sadhatter]

Wow.....wtf. I mean....wow.

So Jeff Wag and some other guys give what is basically an internet troll that had 15 minutes of fame a while ago an interview.

Something seems up, april fools is coming up here soon, let's hope its that.

Can we get any commentary from Jeff on this one, this just seems very .....strange.

 

[GeeMack]

Wow.....wtf. I mean....wow.

So Jeff Wag and some other guys give what is basically an internet troll that had 15 minutes of fame a while ago an interview.

Something seems up, april fools is coming up here soon, let's hope its that.

Not likely. It's just that in this case, Jeff was wholly ill prepared. The JREF certainly should have sent someone to do the interview who actually knows something about the claims, the claimant, the protocol, the test, and the results. Too bad they didn't.

Can we get any commentary from Jeff on this one, this just seems very .....strange.

I'm doubting that will happen, either. It's probably rather embarrassing for him.

 

[Daylightstar]

I notice on the listen/download page there are links to IIG west and Anita's own site, no link to the jref forums.

 

[sadhatter]

Not likely. It's just that in this case, Jeff was wholly ill prepared. The JREF certainly should have sent someone to do the interview who actually knows something about the claims, the claimant, the protocol, the test, and the results. Too bad they didn't.




I'm doubting that will happen, either. It's probably rather embarrassing for him.

Isn't that one of the main points about being a skeptic though, admitting when you have been wrong? If Jeff avoids the issue completely i will not exactly have soaring confidence in the man.

This just seems like such a clustermug , i almost have trouble believing there isn't some kind of joke going on here i mean i am no VFF veteran, but even i could tell that this is the type of thing that would look good on her resume but not on jeff's.

 

[Daylightstar]

Is she pretty?

Not so much, but she flirts a lot.

 

[Akhenaten]

I honestly don't understand why she is being interviewed on a skeptics program especially one that involves Mr. Wagg. IMO that is playing right into Ms. Ikonen's new modality of being a premier skeptic. This is a woman who has advocated and given lectures about Breatharian principles and who peddled this woo on a website and YouTube videos. This person failed the IIG test and yet broke her promise to falsify the claim if she failed. She's also broken her promises to the posters on this board who spent a large amount of time helping her with writing a protocol (which she blithely discarded) This is a person who posted private information about members, harassed an admin and several posters via PM and, to top it all off, put a fake link in her signature which would have meant instant banning on many other forums. At the moment Ms. Ikonen is suspended again. I really have to wonder why anyone would want to promote her and her failed ideas. Sorry for the rant but I find this whole situation ludicrous.

I can't improve on this, Your Audibleness, so I hope you don't mind me simply echoing your words.

What an absolute disgrace this entire situation is.

 

[wardenclyffe]

Jeff Wagg says he wants to go ghost hunting with her. Does he post here under the name Senex?

Ward

 

[Akhenaten]

The interviewers really sounded like they are encouraging Anita to take more tests. Anita must be a pretty young woman from how the men spoke such nice over polite words to her.

30-ish. The other bit is, of course, subjective, but the consensus is "Ooh my wordy lordy no".

Where's the scrutiny in the interview?

Same place as the references to the thousands and thousands of man-hours that members of this Forum have put into trying to put and end to this fiasco.

Considered, at least by the JREF, to be completely worthless.

What would James Randi say?

Maybe he'd say he hired the wrong guy to go out in the world as a spokesman for one of the world's most respected, preeminent skeptics' organizations? Maybe he'd tell Jeff to study up a bit before he gets involved in similar interviews and discussions in the future? Or maybe he wouldn't say anything if he isn't paying any attention either.

Maybe he'd say 'Jeff, I think the Forum is surplus to our requirements. Can you think of a way to make it go away without us actually closing it down like they did with Richard Dawkins' Forum."

 

[Akhenaten]

Jeff Wagg says he wants to go ghost hunting with her. Does he post here under the name Senex?

Ward

Geeze I'm glad I'm not the only one who had that thought.

 

[TheSkepticCanuck]

Jeff should get a shot at the MDC. He predicted in advance that he would get a lot of flack over the interview, and he was 100% correct. He also stated that he didn't believe she had any paranormal abilities, but he was willing to have a conversation with her, and keep an open mind, just in case he is wrong. I think he clearly showed the difference between a skeptic and a cynic. Many of us here have been more cynical than skeptical, myself included. That being said, I don't believe she has the slightest paranormal ability. I do however believe she has a fantastic imagination.

 

[wardenclyffe]

Jeff should get a shot at the MDC. He predicted in advance that he would get a lot of flack over the interview, and he was 100% correct. He also stated that he didn't believe she had any paranormal abilities, but he was willing to have a conversation with her, and keep an open mind, just in case he is wrong. I think he clearly showed the difference between a skeptic and a cynic. Many of us here have been more cynical than skeptical, myself included. That being said, I don't believe she has the slightest paranormal ability. I do however believe she has a fantastic imagination.

I have no criticism of Jeff offering her a platform, nor do I have a criticism of Jeff making nice with her. I just think it's odd that he seemed willing to have the JREF test her (when he must know that she does not have the academic affidavits) and that he seemed so excited about the idea of ghost hunting with her.

She is a rare bird in that she seems to be so willing to engage with the skeptical community. Maybe that's the attraction.

Also, the whole panel's reaction to the IIG test seemed a bit strange. Maybe they're trying to lure her into something.

Ward

 

[zooterkin]

Jeff should get a shot at the MDC. He predicted in advance that he would get a lot of flack over the interview, and he was 100% correct. He also stated that he didn't believe she had any paranormal abilities, but he was willing to have a conversation with her, and keep an open mind, just in case he is wrong.

Where did he say all this? The first I've seen about this podcast was this thread, but I've not been following VfF closely.

 

[Audible Click]

Where did he say all this? The first I've seen about this podcast was this thread, but I've not been following VfF closely.

I've been wondering the same thing. This situation makes me feel that Ms. Ikonen has hijacked skepticism and, with the help of Mr. Wagg, twisted it into an unrecognizable shadow of it's former self. Put simply, I feel betrayed and I don't think I'm alone in this feeling.