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Understanding False Flag operations

Let's look at mass shootings as an example of why False Flag theories go right down the toilet.

Theory: Mass Shooting at [insert name of latest US shooting here] was staged to sway public sentiment and enact stricter gun laws.

Real world: Pick a mass shooting in the past 5 years, and then show me the sweeping legislation which followed. What? You can't? Why not?

Problem: in each case, the shooter either passed background checks, or had legal access to the weapon(s) used. In short, they bought the guns legally. This means that the laws on the books only go so far. So nothing gets changed because the Constitution stands in the way of a total ban, and right now an amendment would never be ratified.

Conclusion: False Flag Mass Shootings, if they occur, are a huge waste of time.

The reality is that the US has a mass shooting every three months or so, and one really nasty one every 28 months (it's how we roll). So why stage an attack instead of just waiting for the next one to come along and go from there? Some Congress people and political advocates already do this.

Let's look at a couple of classics, the Reichstag Fire and the Gulf of Tonkin.

The Reichstag Fire, Feb. 27, 1933, where the German Parliament Building burned down, and the Hitler government assumed arson, and used the event to enact the Decree for the Protection of the German People, which curbed civil rights. Arson was suspected and Communists were blamed, but the true cause of the fire remains a mystery, and many assume the Nazis started the fire to blame the communists as a false flag event.

The Gulf of Tonkin, where the USS Maddox exchanged gunfire with North Vietnamese gunboats, would lead to a resolution giving LBJ power to increase troop levels in South Vietnam. The actual event is mostly muddy, the weather was bad, it was night time, and while shots were fired nobody got hit. The problem was that Johnson received the initial report of the event, which was riddled with inaccuracies, and got the ball moving on Capitol Hill before he had all of the facts (not that he wanted them), before the official after-action report could be made.

These two events represented false flag operations to CTers for years, but most historians view them as events where leadership took advantage of the situation for their own agendas. It never mattered to Hitler how the fire started, he already knew who to blame guilty or not. The Maddox had been in the Gulf of Tonkin to support hit and run raids by the South Vietnamese.

Had neither event happened both Hitler and Johnson would have still found a way to justify their next steps. False Flaggers are simpletons, and history is always so much more complex.:thumbsup:
 
Maybe you will recognize it as deception. Lying. Gas lighting. Religion. Indoctrination. Some people believe their authorities' media systems.

I think that when deception succeeds/convinces beyond doubt, it controls how the person(s) think, perceive. I consider that a form of mind control.

None of which can be considered mind control. We are surrounded by bias and persuasive linguistic techniques constantly, but this is not mind control. Understanding persuasive linguistic techniques is not hard, and the average person can identify them when employed-just note most advertising for example.

Do you rush off to buy every thing, or service you see advertised? No.

Propaganda is everywhere, and at all levels, but no individual, or collective is being manipulated via direct mind control. If individuals or groups respond favourably to propaganda, it merely denotes that the piece reflects that individual's or group's belief system.
 
I think that when deception succeeds/convinces beyond doubt, it controls how the person(s) think, perceive. I consider that a form of mind control.

Perhaps the mind control people have got to you, causing you to post this kind of stupid stuff in order to deflect attention away from the important mind control stuff, which is mostly to do with selling products? Hmmmm??
 
This, I think, is the key. The conspiracy theorist must hold the conflicting views that the conspirators are at the same time fiendishly clever and criminally stupid; and that he himself is an intellectual giant, able to spot the patterns in history that almost everyone else misses because they are so well hidden, yet that these patterns are so obvious that only the unending efforts of biased media are able to hide the fact that the vast majority of the population have figured them out. It's a point of view so desperately ridden with fatal internal contradictions that it's almost impossible to put into words, which may be why its proponents find it so difficult to express themselves coherently.

Dave

So much this.
 
Let's look at mass shootings as an example of why False Flag theories go right down the toilet.

Theory: Mass Shooting at [insert name of latest US shooting here] was staged to sway public sentiment and enact stricter gun laws.

Real world: Pick a mass shooting in the past 5 years, and then show me the sweeping legislation which followed. What? You can't? Why not?

Problem: in each case, the shooter either passed background checks, or had legal access to the weapon(s) used. In short, they bought the guns legally. This means that the laws on the books only go so far. So nothing gets changed because the Constitution stands in the way of a total ban, and

right now an amendment would never be ratified.


Just wait a while. See who gets to appoint their people to the Supreme Court, and how congress trends later. Throw in some more mass shootings, FF or not.


Conclusion: False Flag Mass Shootings, if they occur, are a huge waste of time.


Disagree...turning the big ship takes a while especially in America's stormy gun culture..



In Australia mass shootings (FF or not) apparently resulted in mass gun confiscation.
.


....history is always so much more complex.:thumbsup:


Definitely more complex. More complex than pointing to absence of legislation. That is too simple an answer where longer term trends toward gun bans will apply eventually, FF or not.

.
 
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IMO those examples are tantamount to mind control.

Isnt indoctrination considered mind control in some dictionaries?

Suicide jihadi is close enough for me.
 
In Australia mass shootings (FF or not) apparently resulted in mass gun confiscation.

A cursory examination of the internet says that in Australia a single mass shooting led to tightening of gun laws forcing more control over who could hold weapons and of what type. Gun types newly listed as prohibited were bought from citizens by the government, funded by a rise in taxes.

There was no mass confiscation of guns, though I imagine the odd criminal found to have one that he or she shouldn't have may have had this occur to them.
 
Disagree...turning the big ship takes a while especially in America's stormy gun culture..

In Australia mass shootings (FF or not) apparently resulted in mass gun confiscation.
.

Not sure what you're arguing here. Mass shootings in the US seem to happen with such painful regularity that adding one more bogus one seems futile. Like Axxman300 said, if you want to campaign against gun laws based on one mass shooting, don't fake one, just wait for the next one. They come along like buses. So are you arguing instead that all the mass shootings, or at least all the spectacular ones, are false? Seems like that presents a problem with the motives of the fakers. Why do they want guns restricted, if not to prevent such killings? But what kind of motivation is that for anyone who would be prepared to cause the killings in the first place?
 
by threadworm

A cursory examination of the internet says that in Australia a single mass shooting led to tightening of gun laws


The same internet says there were 6 other mass shootings there in the 5 years preceding......they did not influence the legislation?
 
IMO those examples are tantamount to mind control.

Assuming you're referring to the Reichstag and gulf of Tonkin, in what way are they more like 'mind control' than any other example of an incident used as a pretext for action?
 
Not sure what you're arguing here. Mass shootings in the US seem to happen with such painful regularity that adding one more bogus one seems futile. Like Axxman300 said, if you want to campaign against gun laws based on one mass shooting, don't fake one, just wait for the next one. They come along like buses. So are you arguing instead that all the mass shootings, or at least all the spectacular ones, are false?


No, I dont know that any are false. I'm saying that because america has a strong gun culture/history, it would take longer to achieve gun bans due to mass shootings.


Seems like that presents a problem with the motives of the fakers. Why do they want guns restricted, if not to prevent such killings? But what kind of motivation is that for anyone who would be prepared to cause the killings in the first place?


Why indeed? Could it have something to do with the reason the second amendment is in the Bill of Rights?

Some second amendment advocates will say things like: "You dont hear much about the second amendment until the first amendment is threatened."

(or something like that)
.
 
by Bubba View Post

IMO those examples are tantamount to mind control.


Assuming you're referring to the Reichstag and gulf of Tonkin, in what way are they more like 'mind control' than any other example of an incident used as a pretext for action?

No

I was referring to the examples I listed. Suicide bombing being a good example.




"define mind control" search results include:



Mind control (also known as brainwashing, reeducation, brainsweeping, coercive persuasion, thought control, or thought reform) is a controversial theory that human subjects can be indoctrinated in a way that causes "an impairment of autonomy, an inability to think independently, and a disruption of beliefs and ...
 
The same internet says there were 6 other mass shootings there in the 5 years preceding......they did not influence the legislation?

It is widely regarded as the principal catalyst and the legislation did not lead, as you claimed, to mass confiscation.
 
As you wish.

Makes a good example of FFA, nonetheless.
No. An essential part of a false flag attack is that you also blame the other side for the action. Not just that you disguise as someone else.

True- the Irgun murderers did it and were clearly known to have done it. Never did get what they deserved for their terrorism!!!!!
Being a terrorist can be useful on your resume if you want to make it into politics. Begin was behind the King David Hotel bombing, Shamir behind the murders of Lord Moyne and Count Bernadotte.
 
Disagree...turning the big ship takes a while especially in America's stormy gun culture..

I see what you mean. We've thrown a multitude of two-foot waves at the supertanker and it hasn't done anything yet, but just keep on directing them straight at the bow and sooner or later it'll reverse course.

Great planners, these NWO types.

Dave
 
Let's look at a couple of classics, the Reichstag Fire and the Gulf of Tonkin.

The Reichstag Fire, Feb. 27, 1933, where the German Parliament Building burned down, and the Hitler government assumed arson, and used the event to enact the Decree for the Protection of the German People, which curbed civil rights. Arson was suspected and Communists were blamed, but the true cause of the fire remains a mystery, and many assume the Nazis started the fire to blame the communists as a false flag event.
It's highly implausible that Van der Lubbe started it on his own, the arson investigations at the time ruled this out, and it's highly implausible he got support from the mainstream German Communist Party as they could foresee what would happen. Besides the Nazis as the arsonists, another theory that has gained traction is that the arsonists were from the conservative allies of Hitler, who wanted to deflect from a brewing scandal involving misuse of agricultural subsidies in which president Hindenburg was implicated.

The Gulf of Tonkin, where the USS Maddox exchanged gunfire with North Vietnamese gunboats, would lead to a resolution giving LBJ power to increase troop levels in South Vietnam. The actual event is mostly muddy, the weather was bad, it was night time, and while shots were fired nobody got hit. The problem was that Johnson received the initial report of the event, which was riddled with inaccuracies, and got the ball moving on Capitol Hill before he had all of the facts (not that he wanted them), before the official after-action report could be made.
There were actually two Tonkin incidents a few days apart. The first involved North-Vietnamese fisher boats, the second North-Vietnamese gun boats. The initial reports were about the first, but when Johnson got the ball rolling the second, actual military incident had already happened.

These two events represented false flag operations to CTers for years, but most historians view them as events where leadership took advantage of the situation for their own agendas. It never mattered to Hitler how the fire started, he already knew who to blame guilty or not. The Maddox had been in the Gulf of Tonkin to support hit and run raids by the South Vietnamese.

Had neither event happened both Hitler and Johnson would have still found a way to justify their next steps. False Flaggers are simpletons, and history is always so much more complex.:thumbsup:
Fully agree.
 
It is widely regarded as the principal catalyst


Absent the 6 prior mass shootings in 5yrs, would the final one have so catalyzed the legislation?

Straw that broke the camel's back?



and the legislation did not lead, as you claimed, to mass confiscation.


Right.

Did it lead to law abiding gun owners losing or 'selling' their guns?


Gun types newly listed as prohibited were bought from citizens by the government,


Were citizens required to accept money? Could (previously) law abiding citizens opt out?

Did the bad guys go along with it?
.
 
In Australia mass shootings (FF or not) apparently resulted in mass gun confiscation.

I need to preface this by stating that I love Australia. Never been there, but I love just about everything they have and do down there. Bee Gees, AC/DC, Russel Crowe,and I can go on for days about all of the cool animals, especially their snake population.

Plus, they have some hot, uppity women.

So yes, I love Australia.

That said, Australia does not compare well with the United States on any level. The US is wide open while Australia is insular. Australia picks and chooses who can move there to live, and for how long. It used to be four years maximum and then you were put on a plane back to your country or origin. The resulting condition of this is that Australians, for the most part, tend to be on the same page for important issues, stemming from solid integration, and quality education that the US seems to have given up on decades ago.

The other factor that must be accounted for is the population difference. Australia's population is just over 22,751,014 (July 2015 est.)*, so call it 28 million. The population of the United States is 321,368,864 (July 2015 est.)*, or 321 million.

This means that it's much easier to get things done in Australia than it is in the US. There are more people living in my state of California (38.8 million) than in Australia, and our state is a mess.

The other issue with numbers is that when the Australians looked at banning guns they weren't looking at over 300,000,000 of them, which is the estimated number in private ownership in the US, 20-30 million of those are assault riffles.

There aren't enough cops, Federal Law Enforcement, or even soldiers and Marines to take them all if it came to it...and it will never happen that way precisely because the citizenry has the government outgunned.

Simple math explains why the concept of mass shootings as false flag operations is just flat-out stupid. Our gun problem will change when minds are changed, and they can change here when given time.

*source: CIA World Factbook*
 
Originally Posted by Redwood
The Orlando Murders also made his employer, G4S Security, look very bad. If there's any company that's part of the "New World Order", it's G4S. So apparently the NWO faked Orlando to make itself look bad! But I'm sure that conspiracists can explain that, too.

Are you sure you're sure?

As if evil wouldn't sacrifice its own.

Even the good guys do that when necessary to defeat evil.


Thank for illustrating the epistemological pathology of conspiracism. Tell us what you think. Was it that the NWO just couldn't find any "patsy" except for Omar Mateen, so had to "sacrifice its own"? (This is assuming you believe the murders really happened, which most conspiracists seem to deny.)
 

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