UK TV debate
- Thread starter Undesired Walrus
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skeptichaggis
Muse
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Dissolution above is quite correct Scotland already has plenty of halfwits just look at those well dressed stalwarts of lunacy the orange men. We don't need to import insanity when we have old firm football matches-one side singing in praise of dead terrorists who didn't seem to understand if you don't eat ,well you die even if you are a elected MP, and the other side find it funny too sing songs about a famine that killed millions and fractured Irish society. So no thank you ukip we already have our own nut jobs. I agree that the ukip mep for Scotland is embarrising I guess if you blame immigrants for everything long and loud enough then some bigots will crawl out from under the rocks and work out how to vote. Scotland still has far far less time for ukip than down south though.
skeptichaggis
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Um(on reflection) I think dissolution was actually alluding to the SNP who are one of the most progressive political party's in britain-and a party who wishes to increase immigration not curb it. The SNP also wants rid of the nuclear arsenal in Scotland , I don't understand why some people view a desire to rule oneself as nationalism in the sense of ukip or BNP.
This makes two assumptions:
1) The SNP wish for self rule is more genuine than UKIP's (ironic, re: the views on EU)
2) UKIP is the same as the BNP
UKIP is a xenophobic ethnic nationalist party. The SNP are left social democrats, like Labour used to be, and they have a "national democratic" policy on constitutional matters. They're seeking a polity, not an ethnicity.
It is by no means ironic that such a party should favour membership of the EU.
ddt
Mafia Penguin
Yes, UK-wide 24 MEPs out of 73 is one in three; in Scotland, it's one in six. But that's only half as bad, a far cry from "almost completely rejected" as skeptichaggis wrote. If there were such a country, I'd instantly exchange my Godforsaken Wilders-loving country for it.
ETA:
(Welcome to the forum, BTW, skeptichaggis. And please attend some more care to the formatting of your posts, they're quite enjoyable reads).
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ddt
Mafia Penguin
commandlinegamer
Philosopher
Was mildy amused by the post-debate polling: each one claimed a different "winner".
ddt
Mafia Penguin
Thank you. I thought as much. A far cry from the truth. It would be nice if there would be live fact checking during political debates, plus live image manipulation which lengthens the nose with each lie.
skeptichaggis
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DDT is absolutely right the ukip claims of tolerance and inclusiveness sound hollow. Always just underneath is the reality causal racism that should have ended long ago mixed with a complete failure to except that the world has changed and we now live in a global village where there will be a trend towards more population movement not more. I mean really have you heard the lunacy ukip candidates spout one said the flooding in parts of england is because of the gays and I know at least one flirts with holocaust denial,and every week another one says something racist and then whines it was taken out of context. Ukip and BNP both claim they are not racist in the same way David icke claims he is sane-even they don't believe it
p0lka
Illuminator
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About a third as bad as the UK overall, where about 27% voted UKIP as opposed to 10.5% in Scotland. If we look at elected UKIP MEPs, the small sample effect must be considered. If a half of one percent had voted otherwise in Scotland, there would have been 0 UKIP MEPs here; infinitely better than the situation elsewhere in the UK.
p0lka
Illuminator
end result media wise; take an average.
end result real life; no one can make their bloody mind up.
coalition here we come.
ddt
Mafia Penguin
Okay, that's fair.
Ifs don't count. BTW, it's 0.796% when I calculate the numbers on the wiki page.
Francesca R
Girl
I thought this before. I wish she didn't lead a far left party that only represents Scotland. Although the SNP is correct on immigration and everybody else bar the Lib Dems is wrong.
Far left? You jest! But this is interesting on immigration.
angrysoba
Philosophile
Yes, so did I. Before it was cool to say so. Although probably not as early as those who followed Scottish politics.
Francesca R
Girl
I didn't know it was cool to say so actually. And I can't claim a massive jump on that anyway, but I said the below on 13th of last month.
Interestingly, in my view Clegg was the same Clegg as in 2010. Back then he whipped up a storm in the TV debates. This time nothing like it. But the reason for the difference is people hate him now for being in a coalition with the Tories.
I think the SNP have learned well from that hence no Lab-SNP coalition. This is the electorate in denial in my view. It really ought to get used to coalitions which are way better than a two party state in many ways.
Interestingly, in my view Clegg was the same Clegg as in 2010. Back then he whipped up a storm in the TV debates. This time nothing like it. But the reason for the difference is people hate him now for being in a coalition with the Tories.
I think the SNP have learned well from that hence no Lab-SNP coalition. This is the electorate in denial in my view. It really ought to get used to coalitions which are way better than a two party state in many ways.
I hope you've been following the "Zinoviev Letter" scandal in which the Torygraph has sought to embroil Nicola Sturgeon following her impressive Leaders' Debate performance.
The Establishment is getting worried.
The idea that multi party democracies should be replaced by coalitions is I hope a slip of your pen, and not a considered view.
angrysoba
Philosophile
I'm just kidding. I mean that since this debate has happened, a lot of politicians are saying things like "Didn't Sturgeon do well?" when that should not be much of a surprise to those who have seen her in debates.
I think Clegg's problem is that the Lib Dems are seen as having gone back on their word having entered the coalition, particularly over things such as university fees. It's a difficult pitch for them to try to take the credit for anything good that has happened and yet simultaneously to shrug off any association with things that are worse now. The Tories are able to own it by saying that yes there were cuts but they were necessary and have worked (whether that's true or not), but Clegg wants to say that cuts, austerity and fees were not their idea but the economic recovery was. They also seem to be arguing that their economic aspirations can be achieved by neither cuts nor taxation.