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Trump's Second Term

angrysoba said:
Right. No fan of doxxing personally. That said, there would be situations where this could be in the public interest.
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"this" being what, exactly? Revealing their names? Sure, sometimes.
angrysoba said:
While we are on the subject of ◊◊◊◊◊◊ behaviour, if Musk recognizes that publishing people’s names and suggesting those people deserve some kind of retribution is bad
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You've got to be a lot more specific than this. I don't think that anyone deserves doxxing. I don't think anyone deserves to have angry people showing up at their house. Some people deserve to be prosecuted for crimes. So people deserve having their reputations trashed. Some people deserve to be fired from their jobs. What kind of retribution exactly are you talking about here?
 
Ziggurat said:
Not according to FBI agents who sued to stop the President from knowing who did what.
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The circumstances of Does v. U.S. Dept. of Justice (U.S. Dist. D.C. 25-cv-00325) do not apply here. The public has a general right under OPM regulations to be informed, upon request, of a federal employee's name, job title, duty station, and (in some cases) qualifications. What the public may discover by other lawful means about the identity of federal employees is still governed by privacy law, but there is no general government interest in concealing the identities of its employees. There are only special interests such as in the case of covert agents or law enforcement officers.

The case in Does is based mostly upon employment related claims and has to do with the obligation of agencies to disclose or withhold more detailed information having to do with individuals' employment and daily duties. The legal theory depends very much on the notion that the request for detailed information is being made not in general, but by an officer of the United States bound by the Constitution, for purposes the Constitution forbids. The behavior the suit seeks to enjoin is official behavior, not general journalistic interest.
 
The Führer, who is absolutely not a dictator, just revoked Biden's security clearance and stopped his daily security briefings.

You know, totally normal democratic behaviour.
 
The POSOTUS' most recent announcement is that he is going to fire the board of directors of the John F. Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts and install himself as director. I guess that means the end of the annual visits by groups like the Alvin Ailey American Dance Theater and other non-white companies or companies that include LG performers.
 
Safe-Keeper said:
The Führer, who is absolutely not a dictator, just revoked Biden's security clearance and stopped his daily security briefings.

You know, totally normal democratic behaviour.
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This one isn't as bad as it sounds. Yes, it's petty and vindictive. But former Presidents have no statutory right to receive briefings or access to classified materials. Presidents do not have security clearances, nor do former Presidents. The option of the sitting President to share classified information with former Presidents is a fairly recent invention, and it's merely a courtesy.
 
Ziggurat said:
Sure. Because cutting the budget is what did them in.
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I wasn't referring to cutting the budget. I was, and am, referring to all the insane things Trump and his appointed cronies like Musk have done and said since his inauguration.

Trump is the most incompetent and unfit POTUS we've ever had and the people he's surrounded himself with and appointed/nominated to positions of great power are just as incompetent and unfit.
 
JayUtah said:
This one isn't as bad as it sounds. Yes, it's petty and vindictive. But former Presidents have no statutory right to receive briefings or access to classified materials. Presidents do not have security clearances, nor do former Presidents. The option of the sitting President to share classified information with former Presidents is a fairly recent invention, and it's merely a courtesy.
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Yeah, at first I thought it was secret service protection, which would be a huge deal. But security clearance? Nah.
 
JayUtah said:
Biden indeed did not extend the courtesy of briefings to Trump because he had credible evidence that Trump was a security risk. That fear turned out to be quite evidently true. In contrast, Trump seems to be simply vindictive.
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It doesn't matter. The courtesy briefings are extended to former Presidents so they can be informed to advise the President if they might seeks out counsel. It is my understanding that Trump not once consulted with Obama or even Bush between 2017 and 2021. He is so arrogant and petty it is unlikely he would call on Biden.
 
Stacyhs said:
I wasn't referring to cutting the budget. I was, and am, referring to all the insane things Trump and his appointed cronies like Musk have done and said since his inauguration.

Trump is the most incompetent and unfit POTUS we've ever had and the people he's surrounded himself with and appointed/nominated to positions of great power are just as incompetent and unfit.
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when it comes to cutting the budget, he has no coherent economic policy or plan. and it seems when the media asks him what musk is doing or even looking for, he has no idea and avoids the questions. so he set musk loose with no goals or oversight, and musk brought in a bunch of unqualified crypto guys from his own companies to do what he says.

trump is a joke of a leader, and the hopes that he'll accidentally do something right if you want it hard enough is comical. these guys are thieves and liars.
 
Ziggurat said:
"this" being what, exactly? Revealing their names? Sure, sometimes.

You've got to be a lot more specific than this. I don't think that anyone deserves doxxing. I don't think anyone deserves to have angry people showing up at their house. Some people deserve to be prosecuted for crimes. So people deserve having their reputations trashed. Some people deserve to be fired from their jobs.
What kind of retribution exactly are you talking about here?
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Things like this...

Brody says Musk's tweets led to panic, fear and depression​

"Musk's personal endorsement of the false accusation against Ben Brody reverberated across the internet, transforming the accusation from anonymous rumor to gospel truth for many individuals, and causing others to use Musk's endorsement to justify their desire to harass Ben Brody and his family," the lawsuit says.

"Ben spent the following days and weeks in a cycle of panic, fear, denial, disorientation, and depression," it says.

Brody also had trouble sleeping, panic attacks, headaches and fatigue that interfered with his daily life, the suit says.

"Ben was put through intense terror because of Musk's recklessness, and now Ben finds himself depressed, freaked out, and mentally distraught right at the crucial personal moment when he exits college and enters his career path," the complaint adds.
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Or this...

The harassment intensified when Musk and others amplified “defamatory” claims that he condones pedophilia, Roth said.

The Twitter Files, shared by Musk in December 2022, was a series of internal records showing how the company initially stopped the story – which the Post said was based on a copy of Hunter Biden’s laptop hard drive from Donald Trump’s then personal attorney, Rudy Giuliani – from being shared, citing the company’s internal policy on “hacked materials” and concerns from Biden’s campaign, among other factors.

Roth said the release of the Twitter Files, which included his name along with those of other decision makers at the company, had “very real consequences” for his safety. “This lie led directly to a wave of homophobic and antisemitic attacks against me … of which Twitter has removed vanishingly little. And following the Daily Mail’s decision to publish where I live. I had to leave my home and sell it.”
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www.theguardian.com

Ex-Twitter exec details ‘homophobic and antisemitic’ abuse over handling of Hunter Biden story

Yoel Roth testifies before congressional committee that Elon Musk’s release of company’s internal records led to harassment
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

Once Elon became truly famous, and his personal wealth achieved escape velocity, I was among the first friends he called to discuss his growing security concerns. I put him in touch with Gavin de Becker, who provided his first bodyguards, and recommended other changes to his life. We also went shooting on at least two occasions with Scott Reitz, the finest firearms instructor I’ve ever met. It is an ugly irony that Elon’s repeated targeting of me on Twitter/X has increased my own security concerns. He understands this, of course, but does not seem to care...
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...Everyone close to Elon must recognize how unethical he has become, and yet they remain silent. Their complicity is understandable, but it is depressing all the same. These otherwise serious and compassionate people know that when Elon attacks private citizens on Twitter/X—falsely accusing them of crimes or corruption, celebrating their misfortunes—he is often causing tangible harm in their lives. It’s probably still true to say that social media “isn’t real life,” until thousands of lunatics learn your home address.
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samharris.substack.com

The Trouble with Elon

I didn’t set out to become an enemy of the world’s richest man, but I seem to have managed it all the same.
samharris.substack.com samharris.substack.com

In these cases, we have someone falsely accused by Elon Musk of being a false-flag rioter - just an ordinary college student, not a public figure, or someone handed great power, suddenly become the target of deranged lunatics. We have Elon Musk casually assert that someone who worked for him at Twitter is a supporter of pedophilia, which is probably one of the most incendiary charges you can make against someone in public (and we all know it isn't the first time). And we have accounts of people who used to be friends of his who he turned on when they contradicted him. Clearly, from these accounts, he knows full well, what kind of misery he is unleashing on people he targets on Twitter.

That is the equivalent of Swatting. In fact, I would say it's even worse, because there is still an assumption that the police are not some utterly unpredictable mob with no operating procedures. The Twitter mob, on the other hand, who knows?
 
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