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Cont: Trump's Coup - Part 3

The Great Zaganza said:
He absolutely COULD NOT legally make the request he made, which was "to find" just enough votes to make him the winner.
Not to do a recount, not to annull the election, but to change the result until it gives him a majority.
This was an ask to Raffensburger to certify a result both Raffensburger AND Trump knew were incorrect.

This was a clear case of coercion to commit election fraud, and it needs to get litigated in Court.
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In his capacity as a person making a request during that meeting, he is free to ask them to find the votes.
 
Trump popularity past presidency
https://fivethirtyeight.com/feature...the-2024-presidential-election-yes-its-early/

Since he has nothing new to add, just continuing the coup and the 2020 election, the 2024 election is going to be like the 2020, more or less. Take maybe 10% off Biden votes overall, as he has "failed" according to impatient voters. Also take 30% off if there is no voting law.

Biden with a Republican senate and house in 2025 we can handle. Trump in 2025, no. Trump in 2025 is like another 4 years of covid.
 
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Tero said:
Trump popularity past presidency
https://fivethirtyeight.com/feature...the-2024-presidential-election-yes-its-early/

Since he has nothing new to add, just continuing the coup and the 2020 election, the 2024 election is going to be like the 2020, more or less. Take maybe 10% off Biden votes overall, as he has "failed" according to impatient voters. Also take 30% off if there is no voting law.

Biden with a Republican senate and house in 2025 we can handle. Trump in 2025, no. Trump in 2025 is like another 4 years of covid.
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COVID is worse under Biden than Trump.
Biden made a lot of claims about beating COVID that he failed to do.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
He absolutely COULD NOT legally make the request he made, which was "to find" just enough votes to make him the winner.
Not to do a recount, not to annull the election, but to change the result until it gives him a majority.
This was an ask to Raffensburger to certify a result both Raffensburger AND Trump knew were incorrect.

This was a clear case of coercion to commit election fraud, and it needs to get litigated in Court.
Click to expand...
Accompanied by a threat of course.
 
Upchurch said:
Assuming this is all true, this is at least straight-up election fraud, right?
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In a world with facts, sure.

In the world we live in now? No you see it totally isn't because of "made up B.S. reasons trolls will now make us argue about."
 
The Great Zaganza said:
Given the limit of power the President has over States not controlled by his party, I would argue that he did not fail - Red States did.
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Along the lines of “You can lead a horse to water…”

Biden managed to get COVID vaccines universally available for free to all Americans. What was hard to foresee is 60 million or so stubbornly refusing to protect themselves. With predictable results:

51817165227_e1a65e4ff8_z.jpg


Hard to pin that on him, unless one proposes he’s falling short by not taking the draconian step of forced vaccinations. Which itself would elicit howls of protest.
 
US: "Look! We flattened the curve!"
World: "YOU FLATTENED IT ON THE Y AXIS!"
US: "Picky, picky."
 
Fast Eddie B said:
Along the lines of “You can lead a horse to water…”

Biden managed to get COVID vaccines universally available for free to all Americans. What was hard to foresee is 60 million or so stubbornly refusing to protect themselves. With predictable results:

[qimg]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51817165227_e1a65e4ff8_z.jpg[/qimg]

Hard to pin that on him, unless one proposes he’s falling short by not taking the draconian step of forced vaccinations. Which itself would elicit howls of protest.
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Don't say you can do something if you can't.
 
Lurch said:
What happened to Paul1? ;)
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Don't say that! That is The-Poster-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named.*


Lurch said:
Your optimism is admirable. BTC is an android lacking an emotion chip. And its logic routines have got corrupted to be dominated by the sub-routines, now melded, Devil's Advocate and Obstreporous Contrarian.
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Wow, haven't seen a DAOC for while. They can be nasty little critters. Thanks for the heads up.






* You're the first poster here to ask me that. [Sniff].
 
Oath Keeper leader and 10 others charged with seditious conspiracy:
Leader of Oath Keepers and 10 Other Individuals Indicted in Federal Court for Seditious Conspiracy and Other Offenses Related to U.S. Capitol Breach
Eight Others Facing Charges in Two Related Cases
A federal grand jury in the District of Columbia returned an indictment yesterday, which was unsealed today, charging 11 defendants with seditious conspiracy and other charges for crimes related to the breach of the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, which disrupted a joint session of the U.S. Congress that was in the process of ascertaining and counting the electoral votes related to the presidential election.

According to court documents, Elmer Stewart Rhodes III, 56, of Granbury, Texas, who is the founder and leader of the Oath Keepers; and Edward Vallejo, 63, of Phoenix, Arizona, are being charged for the first time in connection with events leading up to and including Jan. 6. Rhodes was arrested this morning in Little Elm, Texas, and Vallejo was arrested this morning in Phoenix.

In addition to Rhodes and Vallejo, those named in the indictment include nine previously charged defendants: Thomas Caldwell, 67, of Berryville, Virginia; Joseph Hackett, 51, of Sarasota, Florida; Kenneth Harrelson, 41, of Titusville, Florida; Joshua James, 34, of Arab, Alabama; Kelly Meggs, 52, of Dunnellon, Florida; Roberto Minuta, 37, of Prosper, Texas; David Moerschel, 44, of Punta Gorda, Florida; Brian Ulrich, 44, of Guyton, Georgia and Jessica Watkins, 39, of Woodstock, Ohio. In addition to the earlier charges filed against them, they now face additional counts for seditious conspiracy and other offenses.
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https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/lead...dicted-federal-court-seditious-conspiracy-and
 
johnny karate said:
Me: I'm driving to the store.

*another driver runs red light and t-bones my car*

Bob: Don't say you can do something if you can't.
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Exactly. if you say you are going to do it, then you are either factoring risk or you don't understand the risks out there, and that is on you.
 
BobTheCoward said:
Exactly. if you say you are going to do it, then you are either factoring risk or you don't understand the risks out there, and that is on you.
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Yes, because that's exactly how humans communicate and understand language. No one can every say anything with any degree of certainty because of the mathematical possibility that something unforeseen will render their statement untrue.

Another brilliant observation. :thumbsup:
 
Now that 11 people have been charged with seditious conspiracy (and possibly more will be), when does it pass from just plain 'conspiracy' to 'grand conspiracy'? There is no legal definition (or any definition I can find) for 'grand conspiracy'.

Ziggurat said:
I doubt it. There was no grand conspiracy here.
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Ziggurat said:
You can call it whatever you want, it remains true. Insulting me won't change that. More investigation won't find what they've been unable to find any trace of so far.

And really, what do you expect? You expect a grand conspiracy spearheaded by the likes of that idiot with a buffalo hat and face paint? That's how you topple the US federal government? Please. They might find a few loons in a basement who "conspired", but there isn't going to be anything else, no matter how long you look.
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Ziggurat said:
What part of "grand" did you not understand? You can charge people for criminal conspiracy even if the conspiracy is small and pathetic. Which those were.
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Stacyhs said:
Now that 11 people have been charged with seditious conspiracy (and possibly more will be), when does it pass from just plain 'conspiracy' to 'grand conspiracy'? There is no legal definition (or any definition I can find) for 'grand conspiracy'.
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Spoiler: It never will. Right wing terrorist sympathizers will continue to play down the events of January 6th like the obedient Fox News drones that they are.
 
Upchurch said:
Apparently, the Justice Department doesn't work on Thermal's time schedule.
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Seditious conspiracy to delay/prevent the certification is better than nothing, I suppose. An interesting addendum is that they are charged with continuing to "plot to oppose by force the lawful transfer of power after Jan 6".

Eta: and damn straight they don't work on my timetable. Thermal gets **** done without a year to shuffle paper in circles.
 
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