Trump is a FASCIST!

[angrysoba]

I have noticed that people are going mental on Facebook saying that Trump is a Fascist, or even the next Hitler. Of course many of them are also saying that those who don't remember history are doomed to repeat it, but it seems to me that only those who don't remember history can think Trump is Hitler.

Now, I think he's a demagogue who makes crass comments about Mexicans and Muslims, but that he's not a fascist. In fact, I think that's ridiculous. If Trump devises a 25-point plan for a racially pure Amerikan Reich and forms a paramilitary organization who beat up political opponents then I will change my mind. But not until then.

What do you fine people think?

I shall start a poll to definitively decide this urgent matter.

 

[angrysoba]

Be warned that we can all see your votes if we choose to!

And that means you could end up on Trump's list!

 

[thaiboxerken]

It's not hard to believe he would marry big corporations with government to benefit corporate interests.

 

[Liamo]

Demagogue, yes. Fascist, no.

I don't think he is that patriotic, nor that he wants to impose his way of thinking. On the contrary, he will adjust his position in the way that suits his interests ($ & fame) most closely.

 

[Manopolus]

He's basically just a typical used car salesman, personality wise. Who knows what he'd actually do in office. I'd believe him about as far as I would any used car guy (good and bad policy claims).

 

[Puppycow]

Before I vote can we have a definition of fascist please?

Here are some words I think apply to him: nationalist, even jingoistic, populist, authoritarian most likely. Looking at other world leaders, Hitler is not the first one that comes to my mind, but I think he could be similar to Putin. Is Putin a fascist?

 

[angrysoba]

Before I vote can we have a definition of fascist please?

Here are some words I think apply to him: nationalist, even jingoistic, populist, authoritarian most likely. Looking at other world leaders, Hitler is not the first one that comes to my mind, but I think he could be similar to Putin. Is Putin a fascist?

I think I would rather leave that open to your interpretation. I've spelt out my own idea of what would make him a fascist. He doesn't meet that criteria.

 

[erwinl]

He's no Hitler.

I would think him more of a Mussolini.
Fascism and ridiculousness as they say.

 

[angrysoba]

It's not hard to believe he would marry big corporations with government to benefit corporate interests.

Fair enough, but I tend to think this kind of thing is a deepity. It relies on identifying someone as Fascist in a fairly trivial sense (corporate interests) and thereby associating him with the far more unpleasant or even profoundly disgusting aspects of Fascism such as genocide, ethnic cleansing and political violence.

 

[TubbaBlubba]

There are more than a few parallels between Trump and Hitler, going beyond demagougery. One in particular is his status as an "outsider" who is perfectly happy to bring down his own party if he doesn't get what he wants. Another one is hiding his true intentions behind bluster and tantrums, and his infinitely flexible relationship wirh honesty.

But I would say that what I can make of Trump's ideology and demagougery puts him in a more general class of autocratic personalities. Hitler was kind of special in that he essentially believed that power and the force of will was all that was necessary for a strong Germany. Most autocrats seem to have slightly more polished ideals and some sense of an essential quality they possess that will make them great leaders (e.g. Khomeini believed that his position as a great Islamic Judge entitled him to dictatorship). In this vein, my take is that Trump believes that he has the quality of being a Great Negotiator, and that this, not his policies, experience or anything else, means that he is entitled to the presidency.

 

[angrysoba]

There are more than a few parallels between Trump and Hitler, going beyond demagougery. One in particular is his status as an "outsider" who is perfectly happy to bring down his own party if he doesn't get what he wants. Another one is hiding his true intentions behind bluster and tantrums, and his infinitely flexible relationship wirh honesty.

Was Hitler really "hiding his true intentions"? I think that most people knew most of what he wanted because his party had proposed the 25-point plan. I think that is at least one of the major differences between him and Trump. Trump tends to bluster because he doesn't actually have many policies - not because he has some devilish plans that he needs to keep secret. As for bringing down his own party - did Hitler do that? Does this make Hitler similar to Jeremy Corbyn? And his outsider status...really? Was Hitler an outsider from politics or from the NSDAP? I think that if we start using these things as a yardstick then we will end up concluding that Bernie Sanders is kinda sorta like Hitler.

But I would say that what I can make of Trump's ideology and demagougery puts him in a more general class of autocratic personalities. Hitler was kind of special in that he essentially believed that power and the force of will was all that was necessary for a strong Germany. Most autocrats seem to have slightly more polished ideals and some sense of an essential quality they possess that will make them great leaders (e.g. Khomeini believed that his position as a great Islamic Judge entitled him to dictatorship). In this vein, my take is that Trump believes that he has the quality of being a Great Negotiator, and that this, not his policies, experience or anything else, means that he is entitled to the presidency.

Yes, possibly. I think Trump believes his CEO skills as head of the Trump brand makes him a good candidate for president. I expect that he has plenty of personal charm and charisma among those he meets with on a day-to-day basis. This is, of course, a characteristic of a lot of dictators, but then again it is also a characteristic of a lot of people who are successful in many fields.

 

[twinstead]

I would call Trump a demagogue, not a fascist, but who knows? It's not like Hitler came right out from the beginning stating his final goals, at least to the masses. I'm not sure how many of them even took the time to learn them, a lot like the current Tea Party.

The beginning of his political career has some similarities with what Trump is doing.

 

[mbp]

It's not like Hitler came right out from the beginning stating his final goals, at least to the masses.

Mein Kampf was published in 1925.

 

[angrysoba]

I would call Trump a demagogue, not a fascist, but who knows? It's not like Hitler came right out from the beginning stating his final goals, at least to the masses. I'm not sure how many of them even took the time to learn them, a lot like the current Tea Party.

The beginning of his political career has some similarities with what Trump is doing.

Hitler was an anti-Semite from the beginning of his political career and had drawn up the Nazi platform as early as 1920. It appears that he never seriously diverged from this view, and like the poster above says he published Meine Kampf early in his career having written it in jail following his attempted putsch. There's really nothing like that in Trump's political career.

 

[Puppycow]

If he does become president I just hope the American system of checks and balances is robust enough to keep him in check and make sure he leaves office without doing too much permanent damage.

But I really do worry about the possible consequences if he tries to follow through on the Mexican wall thing, his international trade moves (I'm an American but I happen to be an expatriate living in Japan and I think a trade war would be really bad for both countries). I'm also wary about what kind of military situations he might get into.

But, back then the question at hand, no not a fascist, but I think his ideas about trade are very misguided if he really believes them.

 

[newyorkguy]

Trump doesn't seem to have a fixed political philosophy, nor do I believe he knows much about government in general. If you asked Trump to define fascism I don't think he'd be able to do it. I think Trump has very little real grasp of what are the core values of democracy versus an authoritarian state.

I don't think he is consciously a fascist but he has very strong fascist tendencies, if you accept this definition of fascism:

Very harsh control or authority link

I think Trump clearly has fascist tendencies. He wouldn't agree but only because he probably doesn't understand what fascism really is.

 

[Norman Alexander]

You need an option for "Narcissistic spoiled-rotten rich twat with no empathy, no plan and no skills suitable for public office anywhere".

Shorter version: "Skill-free Scrooge McDuck with a personality bypass".

Hitler worked on improving his public speaking. The Donald appears to be trying to make his worse. Otherwise, the noise they produce is much the same.

 

[Upchurch]

Was Hitler really "hiding his true intentions"? I think that most people knew most of what he wanted because his party had proposed the 25-point plan. I think that is at least one of the major differences between him and Trump. Trump tends to bluster because he doesn't actually have many policies - not because he has some devilish plans that he needs to keep secret.

I think the biggest difference is that he doesn't have any plans beyond "President Trump".

Seriously, look at the issues page on his campaign website. There is exactly one actionable item: build a wall. That's it. Everything else is going to be fixed because he's Donald Trump. No, really. Go look at his site.

Eight years ago, people made fun of Obama supporters because the entirety of his platform was "Hope" and "Change". It wasn't true. He had something like 45 pages of downloadable PDF on policy positions. Trump, however, is actually running on that platform, reworded as "Make America Great Again". He has said almost nothing about what he would actually do.


And, I feel I'm being very generous with "build a wall" being a policy position.

 

[Upchurch]

Shorter version: "Skill-free Scrooge McDuck with a personality bypass".

As long as you're okay with cartoon characters, I'd go with alternate-1985 Biff Tannen. There is a kid out there with a Delorean with some explaining to do.

 

[TubbaBlubba]

As long as you're okay with cartoon characters, I'd go with alternate-1985 Biff Tannen. There is a kid out there with a Delorean with some explaining to do.

Well, the makers actually admitted Biff Tannen was a fictional version of Donald Trump.