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Time Travel Delusions and Other Junk Science

TIME measures MOVEMENT, which is EXPRESSED in terms of SECONDS, MINUTES, HOURS, ETC. What do YOU not understand about this?
I don't understand why you keep saying something that's wrong. I don't understand why you're using the Englishman abroad approach of shouting to make the unintelligible clearer. I don't understand why you think you know better than everyone else.
 
That is true. And yet, whether crystal fluctuations or anything else, it is STILL a MEASUREMENT of MOVEMENT. The benchmark is the CONSISTENTLY MOVING FLUCTUATION. Without a relatively consistent movement, there can be no understanding of any expression of time.

You're proving my point and arguing with yourself if you think otherwise. Regardless of what you measure "time" against, it will always require a measurement of movement to express "time" (movement of objects) accurately. That's what "time" is and does: measure movement and express it relative to something else.

Come back after you have tried to read the link above.
 
Nope. That's my point. "Time" doesn't slow. It MEASURES what slows. The earth may be slowing, and that has nothing to do with time. Time is a standard of measure.

Analogy:

Time and Metric System = systems for measuring something
seconds and centimeters = expressions of the measuring system
movement and length = things being measured FOR
object moving and object's length = things being measured

I do not think the earth slowing has anything more to do with "time" slowing than I would think an article of clothing shrinking in the dryer would have something to do with the "metric system" shrinking. That was the point I made in my post! I suggest you re-read it. You obviously didn't get it if you think I would believe something so ridiculous.
 
Nope. That's my point. "Time" doesn't slow. It MEASURES what slows. The earth may be slowing, and that has nothing to do with time. Time is a standard of measure.

Analogy:

Time and Metric System = systems for measuring something
seconds and centimeters = expressions of the measuring system
movement and length = things being measured FOR
object moving and object's length = things being measured

I do not think the earth slowing has anything more to do with "time" slowing than I would think an article of clothing shrinking in the dryer would have something to do with the "metric system" shrinking. That was the point I made in my post! I suggest you re-read it. You obviously didn't get it if you think I would believe something so ridiculous.

Read the link.
 
I was hoping to get some intelligent responses to this post and possibly a guest for my radio show where I discuss such things, but clearly I won't find that here.
 
Yes, they all sound very interesting lively discussions. But can you give me a paper which states ""why does light always appear to move at a constant speed irrespective of direction and this is a major problem"

Because the papers you reference don't seem to be addressing this question at all.

No, they're addressing it. You simply lack the background to understand why a question phrased in terms of "ether drag" is really about the constancy of light speed.

If you need a direct quote, check out Poincare's paper on "The Principles of Mathematical Physics":

The most remarkable example of this new mathematical physics is, beyond question, Maxwell's electromagnetic theory of light.

We know nothing as to what the ether is, how its molecules are disposed, whether they attract or repel each other; but we know that this medium transmits at the same time the optical perturbations and the electrical perturbations; we know that this transmission must take place in conformity with the general principles of mechanics, and that suffices us for the establishment of the equations of the electromagnetic field.

Let us pass to the principle of relativity: this not only is confirmed by daily experience, not only is it a necessary consequence of the hypothesis of central forces, but it is irresistibly imposed upon our good sense, and yet it also is assailed. Consider two electrified bodies; though they seem to us at rest, they are both carried along by the motion of the earth; an electric charge in motion, Rowland has taught us, is equivalent to a current; these two charged bodies are, therefore, equivalent to two parallel currents of the same page 306 sense and these two currents should attract each other. In measuring this attraction, we shall measure the velocity of the earth; not its velocity in relation to the sun or the fixed stars, but its absolute velocity.
I well know what will be said: It is not its absolute velocity that is measured, it is its velocity in relation to the ether. How unsatisfactory that is! Is it not evident that from the principle so understood we could no longer infer anything? It could no longer tell us anything just because it would no longer fear any contradiction. If we succeed in measuring anything, we shall always be free to say that this is not the absolute velocity, and if it is not the velocity in relation to the ether, it might always be the velocity in relation to some new unknown fluid with which we might fill space.
Indeed, experiment has taken upon itself to ruin this interpretation of the principle of relativity; all attempts to measure the velocity of the earth in relation to the ether have led to negative results. This time experimental physics has been more faithful to the principle than mathematical physics; the theorists, to put in accord their other general views, would not have spared it; but experiment has been stubborn in confirming it. The means have been varied; finally Michelson pushed precision to its last limits; nothing came of it. It is precisely to explain this obstinacy that the mathematicians are forced to-day to employ all their ingenuity.
Their task was not easy, and if Lorentz has got through it, it is only by accumulating hypotheses.
The most ingenious idea was that of local time. Imagine two observers who wish to adjust their timepieces by optical signals; they exchange signals, but as they know that the transmission of light is not instantaneous, they are careful to cross them. When station B perceives the signal from station A, its clock should not mark the same hour as that of station A at the moment of sending the signal, but this hour augmented by a constant representing the duration of the transmission. Suppose, for example, that station A sends its signal when its clock marks the hour 0, and that station B perceives it when its clock marks the hour t. The clocks are adjusted if the slowness equal page 307 to t represents the duration of the transmission, and to verify it, station B sends in its turn a signal when its clock marks; then station A should perceive it when its clock marks t. The timepieces are then adjusted.
And in fact they mark the same hour at the same physical instant, but on the one condition, that the two stations are fixed. Otherwise the duration of the transmission will not be the same in the two senses, since the station A, for example, moves forward to meet the optical perturbation emanating from B, whereas the station B flees before the perturbation emanating from A. The watches adjusted in that way will not mark, therefore, the true time; they will mark what may be called the local time, so that one of them will be slow of the other. It matters little, since we have no means of perceiving it. All the phenomena which happen at A, for example, will be late, but all will be equally so, and the observer will not perceive it, since his watch is slow; so, as the principle of relativity requires, he will have no means of knowing whether he is at rest or in absolute motion.
Unhappily, that does not suffice, and complementary hypotheses are necessary; it is necessary to admit that bodies in motion undergo a uniform contraction in the sense of the motion. One of the diameters of the earth, for example, is shrunk by one two-hundred-millionth in consequence of our planet's motion, while the other diameter retains its normal length. Thus the last little differences are compensated. And then, there is still the hypothesis about forces. Forces, whatever be their origin, gravity as well as elasticity, would be reduced in a certain proportion in a world animated by a uniform translation; or, rather, this would happen for the components perpendicular to the translation; the components parallel would not change. Resume, then, our example of two electrified bodies; these bodies repel each other, but at the same time if all is carried along in a uniform translation, they are equivalent to two parallel currents of the same sense which attract each other. This electrodynamic attraction diminishes, therefore, the electrostatic repulsion, and the total repulsion is feebler than if the two bodies were at rest. But since to measure this repulsion we must balance it by another force, and all these other forces are reduced in the same proportion, page 308 we perceive nothing. Thus all seems arranged, but are all the doubts dissipated? What would happen if one could communicate by non-luminous signals whose velocity of propagation differed from that of light? If, after having adjusted the watches by the optical procedure, we wished to verify the adjustment by the aid of these new signals, we should observe discrepancies which would render evident the common translation of the two stations. And are such signals inconceivable, if we admit with Laplace that universal gravitation is transmitted a million times more rapidly than light?
Thus, the principle of relativity has been valiantly defended in these latter times, but the very energy of the defense proves how serious was the attack.


This paper, describing the fundamental importance of the "principle of relativity" and the issue of the velocity of propagation of light, was published in 1904, a year before Einstein issued his theory of relativity.
 
I was hoping to get some intelligent responses to this post and possibly a guest for my radio show where I discuss such things, but clearly I won't find that here.

You forgot to tell us where your show is, so that we can send a transcript of your blog to the local science faculty....
 
I was hoping to get some intelligent responses to this post and possibly a guest for my radio show where I discuss such things, but clearly I won't find that here.

The fact that someone as uninformed as you could have a "radio show" is unfortunate for your audience. I will not be listening!
 
You seem completely ignorant of the topic, and you're making a fool of yourself with the attitude you're presenting. There is a difference between the dimension of time, and the idea of time and the system we use to measure the passing of time.

Try to imagine every moment in the universe happening all at once forever. Time does not do that in the way we [perceive it. You seem to lack the abstract thinking required to imagine time as anything more than a way we me use clocks, but this is your problem, not the scientific community's.

When two identical clocks with super accurate increments are compared after one has been accelerated, there is a clear difference in the rate of the clocks. How do you account for this? How would more or less seconds be created by simply moving a clock fast and in upper orbit? You seem to think time is only the way we measure the passing of time, and you are unable to see time as a force itself.
 
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Nope. That's my point. "Time" doesn't slow. It MEASURES what slows. The earth may be slowing, and that has nothing to do with time. Time is a standard of measure.

Take two identical clocks. Synchronize them. Now (gently) carry one at the top of a mountain and the other to the bottom of a deep mine. After a while, return them both to the starting point. One will read a larger time than the other.

Same setup, but fly them around the earth in opposite directions. After a while, land the planes at the same airport and compare them. One will read a larger time than the other.

Those experiments have been done. The results are perfectly in accord with Einstein's mathematics. To quote the man himself:

Albert Einstein said:
Events which are simultaneous with reference to the embankment are not simultaneous with respect to the train, and vice versa (relativity of simultaneity). Every reference-body (co-ordinate system) has its own particular time; unless we are told the reference-body to which the statement of time refers, there is no meaning in a statement of the time of an event.

Now before the advent of the theory of relativity it had always tacitly been assumed in physics that the statement of time had an absolute significance, i.e. that it is independent of the state of motion of the body of reference. But we have just seen that this assumption is incompatible with the most natural definition of simultaneity; if we discard this assumption, then the conflict between the law of the propagation of light in vacuo and the principle of relativity (developed in Section VII) disappears.
 
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You are arguing with yourself once again. Regardless of what you measure an object against and express as "time", it is still the MEASURING system that expresses the MOVEMENT of an object RELATIVE to the movement of the STANDARD used to measure it.
In this case, "leap second" becomes the constant unit of measure by which we measure other things that move in order to gain an understanding of the speed of movement. This STILL does not create a "dimension". It merely measures and expresses movement and speed of movement.
 
Do you honestly think that repeating yourself will win people over, Angie?
 
"Every reference-body (co-ordinate system) has its own particular time; unless we are told the reference-body to which the statement of time refers, there is no meaning in a statement of the time of an event."

And that is EXACTLY what I said! Without something to measure time (movement) against, TIME has no meaning, because it is merely an EXPRESSION of the speed of movement of something relative to something else! The statement above is saying EXACTLY what I am saying: that TIME doesn't exist outside of an EXPRESSION comparing movement and/or speed of movement to something else!

"Now before the advent of the theory of relativity it had always tacitly been assumed in physics that the statement of time had an absolute significance, i.e. that it is independent of the state of motion of the body of reference."

(As in a dimension with coordinates that could be measured!)

"But we have just seen that this assumption is incompatible with the most natural definition of simultaneity; if we discard this assumption, then the conflict between the law of the propagation of light in vacuo and the principle of relativity (developed in Section VII) disappears."

Yep. In other words, if you stop believing that time is a dimension with coordinates, and begin to understand that time is an expression of one set of coordinates as compared to another, you realize that time is indeed, a measuring system that measures everything in comparison to everything else, and that is precisely what I am saying. I couldn't have found a better way of explaining it! Thanks!
 
So, you're telling me that an atomic clock is not based on a 24-hour earth day? I'm LOL'ing. How, exactly, do you suppose the clock tells you what "time" it is! What do you imagine that it is based on? Some magical dimension that just happens to have 24 hours in a cycle?

Look here to see the photo of an aluminum ion clock. Notice there are no numbers or hands http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/02/100204204321.htm

Another interesting article
Pair of Aluminum Atomic Clocks Reveal Einstein's Relativity at a Personal Scale
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/09/100923142436.htm
 
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Apparently, AngieMax is an active crackpot. Here are two revealing sources: LINK and LINK For example: "My latest blog post on busting the myths about Einstein's "Theory of Relativity" and how it confuses people."
 
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First, you should know that many scientists question the validity of Einstein's theory.

Nonsense.

It is, after all, a theory, and while certain aspects of it may turn out to be true, we do not currently have a way to test it with any degree of accuracy.

Nonsense. The predictions of relativistic quantum field theory are the best-tested predictions in the history of humanity.

Articles published in serious scientific journals discussing the experiments done on "clocks" (which are designed to measure and keep pace with the earth as it rotates on its axis in a 24-hour period)

Nonsense, as you've now admitted.

a clock is nothing more than a man-made machine designed to MEASURE the movement of the earth.

Silly nonsense, as you've now admitted.

Notice in both ridiculous statements, the assumption is made that because time APPEARS to move slower (only because watches move slower at higher elevations, which is an equipment malfunction and has nothing to do with time itself)

Amazing how those "equipment malfunctions" always seem to happen in just exactly the right amounts and in just exactly the right direction to agree with Einstein, isn't it? Remarkable how the GPS system "malfunctions" perfectly so as to correct for the errors of the misguided engineers that designed it taking time dilation into account, how clocks know whether to malfunction and run faster or slower depending on whether the plane their in is flying east or west, etc.

Enough - I'm done.
 
You are arguing with yourself once again. Regardless of what you measure an object against and express as "time", it is still the MEASURING system that expresses the MOVEMENT of an object RELATIVE to the movement of the STANDARD used to measure it.
In this case, "leap second" becomes the constant unit of measure by which we measure other things that move in order to gain an understanding of the speed of movement. This STILL does not create a "dimension". It merely measures and expresses movement and speed of movement.

Angie, why doesn't everything happen at once instead of happening linearly?
What happens when the moment we experience becomes the past and the moment we look forward to becomes the present?
 

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