Time To Grow Up.

[RandFan]

The title is a sub-head from Randi's commentary.

Time To Grow Up.

The Christian Science Monitor ran an article on Nov. 30, titled "In Congo, superstitions breed homeless children." It appears that as poverty has been increasingly plaguing this nation, children are being turned out of home after being accused of witchcraft. Javier Aguilar, a UNICEF child protection officer, states that of the 20,000 street children in the city of Kinshasa, 70% of them have been accused of being witches. The article implies that many of these children were living with step-parents or extended family members who no longer wanted to have to support them and so, voila, an easily-explained incident such as a broken glass or a still-born child becomes an excuse to turn them out of home as practitioners of black magic. Any who hide behind the excuse that pseudo-science can be tolerated out of respect to the beliefs and feelings of others, should realize that this type of situation is the ultimate consequence of tolerance of dangerous nonsense. We certainly don't need to force people to be sensible, but neither should we remain quiet when we see truth and logic being assaulted.

But you might protest, this is in Africa, not in America. Yet people in America have gone to jail for being accused of ritualistic abuse or had their lives destroyed. It can and does happen here. I will concede that it is the exception here and not the rule. I think the point is that we can't assume that some religious beliefs are immune to significant irrational behavior. I will also concede that the mere allegation of child abuse in and of itself is a powerful weapon in and of itself.

 

[fuelair]

The title is a sub-head from Randi's commentary.

But you might protest, this is in Africa, not in America. Yet people in America have gone to jail for being accused of ritualistic abuse or had their lives destroyed. It can and does happen here. I will concede that it is the exception here and not the rule. I think the point is that we can't assume that some religious beliefs are immune to significant irrational behavior. I will also concede that the mere allegation of child abuse in and of itself is a powerful weapon in and of itself.

and has been misused often (by the by, no personal ax to grind- I have never done or been accused of same - but I know of far too many cases where people were falsely and incompetantly.

 

[Dancing David]

The other issue is that most likely these children have some sort of diasbility, either mental or physical.

 

[kurious_kathy]

The title is a sub-head from Randi's commentary.

But you might protest, this is in Africa, not in America. Yet people in America have gone to jail for being accused of ritualistic abuse or had their lives destroyed. It can and does happen here. I will concede that it is the exception here and not the rule. I think the point is that we can't assume that some religious beliefs are immune to significant irrational behavior. I will also concede that the mere allegation of child abuse in and of itself is a powerful weapon in and of itself.

I am concerned about this statement you are copying from Randi's commentary. It is said that the rising teenage religion is Wicca which is definitely considered witchcraft, as is satanism. While I have heard and known some that have been turned around from this type of occult activity I do not think parents taking a stand against their childs rebellion should be considered wrong. It really is ugly and a definite spiritual warfare behind the scenes which can cause people to totally fall apart.

Also consider most of the people into these two things, Wicca and Satanism, most of them are on mega drugs which makes them totally out of conrtrol and unable to use any logic or reason when a parent or adult may be trying to help them. If the only way to save them is to use tough love, then so be it. Everyone reaps what they sow, even rebellious teens.

Is it the parents fault? I myself don't think so, although I am concerned because of all the divorce and teens left at home alone without any supervision in our culture. Teens need even more guidance than little ones, but it's tough when they won't listen and rebel.

Also it concerns me even more because these things are also fortold in scripture.

 

[cyborg]

mega drugs which makes them totally out of conrtrol and unable to use any logic or reason when a parent or adult may be trying to help them.

Where can I buy me some of these 'mega drugs'?

 

[kurious_kathy]

Where can I buy me some of these 'mega drugs'?

Now why would you want to contaminate your body like that?

 

[cyborg]

Now why would you want to contaminate your body like that?

Dunno.

Why have you contaminated your mind?

<zing!>

 

[wollery]

Kathy, I don't really expect you to read the following link, but it might help if you actually had a clue about what you were talking about before you opened your vicious bigotted little mouth.


Wicca, the truth.

 

[RandFan]

...unable to use any logic or reason...

What would you know about logic or reason?

 

[SezMe]

Also it concerns me even more because these things are also fortold in scripture.

I'm quite interested in some examples.

 

[Monkey Napoleon]

It is said that the rising teenage religion is Wicca which is definitely considered witchcraft, as is satanism.

If by "definatley" you meant "by complete and utter fabrication of my relgion," then yeah.

Witchcraft is actually quite harmless, seeing as how it was completely made up by religious fanatics to use as an excuse to brutally execute their neighbors in petty disputes. Later, it was picked up by newagers in an attempt to make a living selling crystals and ouija boards.

In case you're wondering: long time lurker, new poster.

 

[skeptifem]

Also consider most of the people into these two things, Wicca and Satanism, most of them are on mega drugs which makes them totally out of conrtrol and unable to use any logic or reason when a parent or adult may be trying to help them. If the only way to save them is to use tough love, then so be it. Everyone reaps what they sow, even rebellious teens.

LOL! You dont know what you are talking about.

I ask you- go over to the satannet forums, the people there are so anti drugs its to the point where they abandon all logic when it comes to legalizing drugs. There are few teenagers to speak of there either, most get banned rather quickly. The satanic bible specifically says that breaking the law is a stupid thing to do.

Wiccans/satanists butt heads anyway, and are completely different religions and the worldview each one expresses is almost the exact opposite of the other.

 

[Monkey Napoleon]

There are few teenagers to speak of there either, most get banned rather quickly. The satanic bible specifically says that breaking the law is a stupid thing to do.

I was going to mention that as well. Teenagers drawn to satanism are, I think, for the most part just doing it to be rebellious. Oddly enough, I wonder if there is any correlation between christian indoctrination and teenage "satanism?"

As far as Mr. La Vey's particular brand of organized "satanism" that I believe you are referencing, light reading of the satanic bible led me to believe that the religion mostly centers around egotism and carnal pleasure with no actual worshipping or praying to any devils.

 

[skeptifem]

^you are correct. I think of satanism as self worship.

They have their own woo but at least they dont pretend they are doing it for someone elses good, and keep it their own business. I also like the fact that the church of satan rejects its tax exempt status and doesnt try to recruit anyone. there was a list of goals on their website that were pretty neat as well.

Out of all the religions i have encountered, satanism is the most respectable. The number of misconceptions about them is astonishing, considering how cheap and short their bible is. Its actually has some good jokes written into it as well.

 

[Mojo]

The only Wiccan I know is in her fifties.

She does take drugs though: beer and the occasional cigar.

 

[cyborg]

I still want to know what 'mega drugs' I am missing out on people! I will join a religion if necessary.

 

[YouBelieveWHAT?]

It's quite amusing to read KK mentioning logic & reason.

I'm sure that many of us here will remember a former poster named OneinChrist (or 1inch as he became known) who told us in no uncertain terms that logic and reason were tools of the Devil!

Does this mean that KK's real colours are showing?

Do we have the Antichrist here, posting for our edification?

Very clever tactics, too - making sure that everybody is sick of religion by constantly throwing it in our faces - you've got to admire the technique, huh?

So - should we now be writing, "All hail, KK, lead us to the dark side!"?

YBW

 

[Dancing David]

I am concerned about this statement you are copying from Randi's commentary. It is said that the rising teenage religion is Wicca which is definitely considered witchcraft, as is satanism. While I have heard and known some that have been turned around from this type of occult activity I do not think parents taking a stand against their childs rebellion should be considered wrong. It really is ugly and a definite spiritual warfare behind the scenes which can cause people to totally fall apart.

Also consider most of the people into these two things, Wicca and Satanism, most of them are on mega drugs which makes them totally out of conrtrol and unable to use any logic or reason when a parent or adult may be trying to help them. If the only way to save them is to use tough love, then so be it. Everyone reaps what they sow, even rebellious teens.

Is it the parents fault? I myself don't think so, although I am concerned because of all the divorce and teens left at home alone without any supervision in our culture. Teens need even more guidance than little ones, but it's tough when they won't listen and rebel.

Also it concerns me even more because these things are also fortold in scripture.

Thanks alot Kathy, I have spent many years trying overcome my prejudice against Christians and you just sum up very mistaken backwards conception of bigotry in one neat package.

You want to talk about ritual abuse, look in YOUR backyard Kathy! Who puts baies in ovens to drive out demons , Christians. Who verbaly abuses and physicaly assaults thier children in the name of religion, Christians. Whp emotionaly scars thier children in the name of bettering them, Christians.

In the USA most ritual abuse is by Christians, but you wouldn't call it that, you would call it saving grace.

I have tried to avoid baiting you in the past and showed you tolerance, you are a gravely misinformed bigot. Where do you get your information Kathy? From self referencing Christian who just quote themselves and thier companions? You are very hard not to ridicule.

 

[Dancing David]

Now why would you want to contaminate your body like that?

Why would you pollute your mind with such patent garbage Kathy. All the bigotry and hatred in NOT the teachings or Jesus, all the prejudice and intolerance is NOT the teaching of jesus. But if you want to follow Peter and Saul, who were not Jesus, and a corrupt church that has a tow thousand year history of corrupting the words and teachings of jesus , go ahead.

Just one question kathy, where did jesus say the garbage you are spouting today?

 

[Dancing David]

If by "definatley" you meant "by complete and utter fabrication of my relgion," then yeah.

Witchcraft is actually quite harmless, seeing as how it was completely made up by religious fanatics to use as an excuse to brutally execute their neighbors in petty disputes. Later, it was picked up by newagers in an attempt to make a living selling crystals and ouija boards.

In case you're wondering: long time lurker, new poster.

Welocome to the forum!

Silly Solstice!