The supernatural

[Scorpion]

Hi. of course not. God is not terrible sadism. God did not create man for hell. Rather, he has made man his successor in the universe. And always friendly to humans. What is the citation of your light sentences? What is your proof for this? Please provide a valid document. Never talk on speculation. Not good for your character. I consider you my master.
Talk documentary. My words are often based on verses from the Qur'an or science or logic and philosophy. And it is fully documented.
God is just a judge in the parallel world of the Resurrection. And his evidence is only our own deeds. Whoever has done evil has made hell for himself. God did not create hell. We have made ourselves hell because of sin, blasphemy, corruption, crime, ugliness, and so on. And if we are good, we have made heaven. And there only everyone sees the result of their own action. The verses of the Qur'an are to frighten man, not the ignorant Arabs of Muhammad's time. But all human beings. To be good. And let's not be bad. Hell and heaven are made by man, not by God. God always loves human beings.
Please look realistically at the Quran and God. Do not look at suspicion, enmity and resentment. Be reasonable. Everything depends on human actions. God is just a judge. He created the universe for man. So that man may act like God. The Qur'an says these horrible torments so that man will be vigilant and will not create torment and hell for himself. But to build a paradise for himself. It is also eternal hell if man builds for himself. And it is an eternal paradise if man builds for himself. God is perfectly rational.
Everything depends on us. God is the only creator of man and the universe. And is a judge.
I have repeated this word and answer many times. But you still say your guess. Please understand and do not repeat. you're welcome.
Thank you

So you deny the verses I quoted about hellfire in the Quran, even though they are clear to read. How do you manage to ignore these along with other verses that state hellfire is for eternity?

 

[Darat]

I think the world has already done that test. Because the only time any theist such as heydarian has declared that a line the Koran is really describing Black Holes, or Relativity, or anything scientific at all, is always long AFTER science has described each of those things!

So theists like heydarian know zero about what any such verse means, and they say nothing about it for 1400 years ... But then when science discovers something, they look for a verse that contains some obscure irrelevant nonsense and say "ah ha ... these words sound a bit like & must be describing Relativity, or the Big Bang, or atomic structure or ..." .... they only ever know about it AFTER science has already told them about it! So, IOW … they always fail that test!



Edit to add - see this for a bit of amusement ...

https://www.newstatesman.com/uncategorized/2008/08/quran-muslim-scientific

Yeah if only god had thought to tag onto the end of "the" 10 commandments, "Oh and E=mc²" don't worry about that one it will make sense in the future"!

 

[Cosmic Yak]

No! It's is you who is "mixed up" and not able to answer ... what I said to you is that electricity was discoevered and explained, developed and used by science ... there are literaly tens of thousands of papers on that in the science reserach journals ... but there is nothing like that for any "Soul" ... there is NO evidence or claim of any souls in any genuine science papers ...

... that is a 100% total difference between electricity vs a soul ... and electricity was your own example ! ... why is there no claim or evidence of any soul ever by any genuine scientist publishing in any genuine research journal???...

... for electricty you have perhaps 10,000 such papers and not a single disagreement from any scientists ... but for a "soul" you have not even one such paper and no genuine scientist claiming any evidence for any "soul" ... the two things could not possibly be more different!

Also, heydarian is confusing 'seeing' with 'measuring' or 'testing for'.

 

[Jack by the hedge]

Hello. No my dear. The soul cannot be seen as you say. But not because he does nothing and has no evidence. No. The soul is not a matter of matter that can be seen. But its material effects and evidence are visible. I have given this example before. Do you see electricity? No. So how do you know about electricity? Because when we press the power switch, the lamp turns on. That is, we know of its existence from objective evidence and the effect of electricity. Do you accept this example? If you do not agree or have an explanation, let us know so we can hear. Thank you

We can detect and measure and generate electric fields and currents in various ways, we can even sense it ourselves in some circumstances such as when a passing thundercloud makes our hair stand on end (I've experienced that and it's rather unnerving as you might imagine). We have a very thorough theory of what electricity is and how it works.

We have none of that for the soul. Just some people claiming such-and-such a thing is caused by souls in an inexplicable way, with no explanation for how an immaterial thing might interact with the material world.

They are not remotely comparable concepts.

 

[Jack by the hedge]

... Only living things have souls. Is the cloud alive?! Of course, I also say this important point. The universe and matter and everything in this world is conscious. And understands. Understanding this may be very insane and brutal. But it is. Nature has consciousness.

That's very poetic, but very vague and lacking any shred of evidence.

 

[Jack by the hedge]

Hello and thanks for your comment. look ; In 6 verses of the Qur'an, it is only mentioned that the theory of human evolution can be correct. And God has said 6 times that I destroyed human beings because of their mistakes, just like the previous generations, and you made the new generation more advanced and created the field because of my teachings. I can destroy you again and bring another new generation. Note that first it says in general and does not tell the details. Secondly, it raises the issue of the superiority of the new generation of human beings with science. Which has given man honor and greatness.
In fact, it has stated the theory of human evolution in general. And he said the most important purpose of this statement. That is the superiority of man over other creatures and other generations of man. Which is the subject of education and science. This statement of God in the Qur'an has no contradiction with the theory of human evolution. And supports them.
Thank you

As I already said, the theory of evolution by natural selection applies to all living things including humans and it is a logical consequence of the inheritance of characteristics and the chances of surviving to reproduce in one's environment.

It is not a theory of God deciding to destroy part of His creation and remake it in a modified form. Whether or not you believe that to be something which really happened (as I do not) it is certainly not a description of the theory of evolution.

 

[Little 10 Toes]

Hello and thanks for your comment. Religion and the Qur'an do not seek to confirm science. Basically, the Qur'an and God confirm science. And support. The Qur'an and God do not need to confirm science. Because their surface horizons are not comparable to the material world. I have already proved in my article that science has no properties of matter. And is beyond matter. Science is made by God. And God has brought the universe into existence. And he created man naturally with knowledge. Evidence for the proof of the Qur'an - God - the divine religion can be seen in abundance in nature and matter. And has been proven. But their very existence is not seen because they are not of matter. Only their effect and evidence, which is material, can be seen. Knowledge is from God. And God supports it. And in the Qur'an, 950 verses have said this.
Thank you

No. The quran does not support science. Where is the muddy pool that the sun goes into? Where are the demons that the stars are missiles?

 

[Carrot Flower King]

Hello. I noticed your astonishment and confusion. In 6 verses, the Qur'an mentions the theory of evolution. In some verses to the generation before Adam who became extinct. And in fact, God has destroyed them because of their mistakes. And some verses refer to the next generation of human beings. That the present generation of man may become extinct in the future. In fact, we should be destroyed because of our mistakes. The Qur'an has said the same thing. Not anything else. The current human generation that started with Adam. It is different from other human generations. And I said. For the teaching of science to man by God. It has made him superior to other creatures and generations. Until he gave her the position of his successor. That is, God has said that man is my successor in the universe. Well, do you know better than this great position that God has given to man?

So, not a thing about evolution at all and especially not evolution by means of natural selection, just more goddidit...Especailly because evolutionary theory makes no value judgements about the supposed superiority of humans.

 

[Darat]

Off topic posts about Scorpion's spiritualism moved to here: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=277159&page=74 Please keep to the topic of this thread

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: Darat

 

[Planigale]

The Quran is based upon supposed 'revelation' from on high. It is NOT supported by verifiable evidence. By contrast Evolution by natural selection is one of the best substantiated theories in the history of science, supported by evidence from a wide variety of scientific disciplines. The fact that some religious texts (of whatever religion) don't overtly contradict scientific theory does NOT validate religion.

The interesting thing about Darwin's theory of evolution was that it did not make sense given the contemporaneous theories of inheritance. Mendel was not known about. Really it was not until modern understanding of DNA came about that evolution was explicable. One of the strengths of any theory is the predictions it makes. The theory of evolution predicted the nature of inheritance. It is the coherence from population to biochemical level which is its strength.

 

[Tassman]

Hello and thanks for your comment. Religion and the Qur'an do not seek to confirm science. Basically, the Qur'an and God confirm science. And support. The Qur'an and God do not need to confirm science. Because their surface horizons are not comparable to the material world. I have already proved in my article that science has no properties of matter. And is beyond matter. Science is made by God. And God has brought the universe into existence. And he created man naturally with knowledge. Evidence for the proof of the Qur'an - God - the divine religion can be seen in abundance in nature and matter. And has been proven. But their very existence is not seen because they are not of matter. Only their effect and evidence, which is material, can be seen. Knowledge is from God. And God supports it. And in the Qur'an, 950 verses have said this.
Thank you

Science is NOT made by God. The difference between Darwin's theory of evolution and unevidenced religious 'god-did-it' revelation is observation - the basis of ALL scientific theory. Darwin proposed that evolution occurs because of 'natural selection' - i.e. organisms which are better adapted to their environment tend to survive and reproduce more than those less well adapted.

 

[Tassman]

The interesting thing about Darwin's theory of evolution was that it did not make sense given the contemporaneous theories of inheritance. Mendel was not known about. Really it was not until modern understanding of DNA came about that evolution was explicable. One of the strengths of any theory is the predictions it makes. The theory of evolution predicted the nature of inheritance. It is the coherence from population to biochemical level which is its strength.

Darwin was "known about" by Mendel - but not the the other way round - and Mendel was influenced by him in his valuable contribution to the theory of evolution.

 

[heydarian saeed]

Hello to all the loved ones of the association and the group. I want to clear up a misunderstanding :
In the Holy Quran, more is said about divine mercy. Of course, while pointing out that the Qur'anic concepts should not be studied and understood by counting only the verses and their frequency. In terms of the number of words, more than 560 times it speaks only of "mercy and forgiveness", while about 400 cases are about torment. Although the number is not a condition.Many try to point to the torments by quoting the verses of divine mercy and blessings, which make the body and soul happy both in this world and in the Hereafter, to say: The God to whom Islam and the Qur'an have called is cruel. , Is angry, tormenting - psychological sadism, etc. Obviously, this kind of misunderstanding of God, especially for Servants
who constantly make small and big mistakes, causes dissatisfaction, despair and distance, and of course leads to disbelief and denial. However, God, the Wise and the Guiding, has not only informed man of his good and bad consequences, but has repeatedly reminded him of God's love, forgiveness, forgiveness, mercy, forgiveness and grace, and has stated that even many. He also forgives sins without repentance, but he never forgives polytheism and despair of God's mercy...

 

[heydarian saeed]

... Note that the basis of creation is "love" and human nature is based on "love and hate". And in the law of love, love, affection, forgiveness, forgiveness, kindness and mercy, ignoring mistakes and accepting the lover, overtake and prevail. But it should be noted that if there is no account and book, chaos will take over the world. Because the law is observed when its observance and non-observance have consequences. If there is no calculation, there is no reason to follow the law. The emphasis on resurrection, heaven and hell is due to the warning of the future and the book of human beings in the hereafter, which causes man to come out of negligence and take his steps calculated, because every action has its own consequences and these consequences affect man and some of it. And it is impossible to get rid of it. If there is no fear of hell, rebellion will sweep the world and become official lawlessness. In any case, the two important principles of theology and belief in the resurrection have always been emphasized in the Qur'an because of their effects on human life. And the complexities used in the creation of man make the philosophy of these emphases clearer. Obviously, no sane person would accept this. Therefore, there must be a resurrection and a reckoning. And the emphasis is more on hell because criminals will not be afraid unless there is a fear of punishment. At the same time, attention to heaven and its blessings is no less. The Qur'an says that there can be no God but no resurrection, that is, if there is no resurrection, creation is useless. This in itself is an argument. The Qur'an wanted to argue about this: (23/115) Translated by Yusuf Ali:
Did ye then think that We had created you in Joke and vain
, and that ye would not be brought back to Us (for account?) ...

 

[heydarian saeed]

... In fact, the Qur'an says: Or you must say that there is no god, so creation is false and useless. Wisdom in creation should not be pursued and it will not prevent creation from being in vain. Or if there is a God who created the world, there must be a resurrection, the resurrection is the complement of creation, the complement of a part of creation, without which, incomplete creation is useless. There is a series of other arguments in the Qur'an that use the same existing and evident system as the reason for the resurrection. The same verses that tell the story of the creation of the fetus. For example: 22/5 and 23/14-16 which refers to the resurrection of the dead in the resurrection and reckoning. But the next point; What are these social rules for? Do you imprison good people ?! Are you torturing these people ?! Or are you executing ?! Or do you imprison criminals, murderers, corrupt people and the like? Please reply. Everyone knows the answers to these questions. Well, a healthy society should have such laws. And rightly so. How can you not want God to have such laws for the human society he created? Are we rational? Let's think better. Therefore, good people are rewarded. And go to heaven. And bad people taste the punishment of their ugly deeds. Isn't that logical? If not, it is madness and anomaly.
I feel good about being in your group. And I'm happy. I wish you health and success.

 

[heydarian saeed]

I am worried for you. The impact of comets on Earth is a huge threat. And not too far. According to NASA studies, in 2022-2032-2028-2029-2036-2068 the comet Apophis may hit the Earth. And 2068 is more likely. And it will have very dangerous consequences. Millions are killed. Millions will be deaf. Millions will go crazy. And many cities will be destroyed. Please think well.
Building a special spacecraft is great for scientific research and exploration. And it is admirable. And we are all waiting for the success of such projects. But it is useless to escape from the earth because of space threats. There is no escape route. The god of the earth is one with the god of the star Alpha Centauri. The Qur'an mentions the impact of a comet on Earth. He also said the way of salvation.
And even the time was told by Muhammad by the command of God. Event Month - Tells the day of the event and the time of the event. No one knows the year of the event except God. But we can find astronomy with physics. Which I mentioned above. My suggestion is that; Apply rescue measures in the month, day and hour that are known.
And have emergency preparedness and crisis measures in this particular month, day and hour. However, NASA also seeks to stop the asteroid or divert it from Earth orbit. I just thoroughly studied the way to save man scientifically. I saw that it is exactly scientific. And science confirms that. In fact, it can only prevent serious side effects on human health.
Would you like me to tell you? If you do not make fun of the Quran and Islam. And you will not joke. Would you like me to say?
This is an important issue. That the world is worried about. What do you think?

 

[IanS]

Hello to all the loved ones of the association and the group. I want to clear up a misunderstanding :
In the Holy Quran, more is said about divine mercy. Of course, while pointing out that the Qur'anic concepts should not be studied and understood by counting only the verses and their frequency. In terms of the number of words, more than 560 times it speaks only of "mercy and forgiveness", while about 400 cases are about torment. Although the number is not a condition.Many try to point to the torments by quoting the verses of divine mercy and blessings, which make the body and soul happy both in this world and in the Hereafter, to say: The God to whom Islam and the Qur'an have called is cruel. , Is angry, tormenting - psychological sadism, etc. Obviously, this kind of misunderstanding of God, especially for Servants
who constantly make small and big mistakes, causes dissatisfaction, despair and distance, and of course leads to disbelief and denial. However, God, the Wise and the Guiding, has not only informed man of his good and bad consequences, but has repeatedly reminded him of God's love, forgiveness, forgiveness, mercy, forgiveness and grace, and has stated that even many. He also forgives sins without repentance, but he never forgives polytheism and despair of God's mercy...

Your God does not exist!

There is zero evidence of any such God ever existing.

All the things that were claimed thousands of years ago for God, have all now been thoroughly understood through science ... and the true explanations do not involve any God or any miracles at all.

You believe the God exists because want to believe it and you simply do not know any better in terms of honest objective education.

At one time, 1500 to 2000 years ago when the Bible and the Koran were first written, everyone believed in all sorts of Gods. But people at that time were educationally very ignorant and backward (it was not their fault ; for 99% of the people there simply was no proper means of education at that time).

But now, in the 21st century, most people around the world have access to proper schools and proper eduction from the age of about 5 to about 16 (and beyond that at colleges and universities). The result of that is that religious belief has steadily declined everywhere over the decades from about the time of Darwin, i.e. for the last 160 years or so. So that now, in the most developed countries with the highest levels of education, the number of atheists/non-believers has grown towards about half the population in various countries ...

... that shows that better education inevitably leads to a decline in religious belief. It shows particularly strongly amongst the most highly educated people in science, where it becomes obvious that science has explained the correct answers for almost everything that was once believed to be the work of invisible gods … the answers are all natural processes of physics, chemistry and biology ; there are no gods and no miracles in any of the scientific results.

Your God does not exist. And there are no miracles.

 

[Scorpion]

Qur'an mentions the impact of a comet on Earth.

Do tell us the surah and verse numbers where the Quran mentions this.

 

[Scorpion]

Hello my dear.Thank you for your countless thanks. The chakras are scientific. And they are quite understandable. In the Qur'an and Islam, great importance has been given to the chakras. We do daily exercises to strengthen the chakras and open the pores of the body for energy. This argument is confirmed by Islam and the Qur'an. And we support it.

Where in the Quran are the chakras mentioned?

 

[Jack by the hedge]

I am worried for you. The impact of comets on Earth is a huge threat. And not too far. According to NASA studies, in 2022-2032-2028-2029-2036-2068 the comet Apophis may hit the Earth. And 2068 is more likely. And it will have very dangerous consequences. Millions are killed. Millions will be deaf. Millions will go crazy. And many cities will be destroyed. Please think well.
Building a special spacecraft is great for scientific research and exploration. And it is admirable. And we are all waiting for the success of such projects. But it is useless to escape from the earth because of space threats. There is no escape route. The god of the earth is one with the god of the star Alpha Centauri. The Qur'an mentions the impact of a comet on Earth. He also said the way of salvation.
And even the time was told by Muhammad by the command of God. Event Month - Tells the day of the event and the time of the event. No one knows the year of the event except God. But we can find astronomy with physics. Which I mentioned above. My suggestion is that; Apply rescue measures in the month, day and hour that are known.
And have emergency preparedness and crisis measures in this particular month, day and hour. However, NASA also seeks to stop the asteroid or divert it from Earth orbit. I just thoroughly studied the way to save man scientifically. I saw that it is exactly scientific. And science confirms that. In fact, it can only prevent serious side effects on human health.
Would you like me to tell you? If you do not make fun of the Quran and Islam. And you will not joke. Would you like me to say?
This is an important issue. That the world is worried about. What do you think?

It's not clear what point you wish to make. If scientists detect a future threat to the planet from a comet and begin work to consider what measures we can take against it, that's clearly serious but at least science will have given us a chance.

I can't see how it matters if some people insist their God knows whether we are in danger or not from a comet they think He created. If He will not tell us whether He has put us in danger of destruction, and nor will He rescue us if He did then He may as well not exist. It seems to make no difference to what happens. I assume He does not exist.