The supernatural

[turingtest]

Darwin described a theory of evolution by natural selection. He did not describe evolution by God changing His mind and he did not describe a distinct form of evolution purely for humans. In fact he rather avoided stating directly that his theory also encompassed humans as he recognised that would have been troubling to some readers.

Once again, declaring that an ancient text contains passages which can be reinterpreted as vague poetic allusions to modern science is not impressive.

I've taken the liberty of highlighting what you had already emphasized, in the hope that perhaps heydarian will see the problem. He appears to think that the entirety of the theory of evolution is "living things change over time," when it's more accurately a description of the mechanism behind that tritely obvious observation. A holy book that makes humans a goal of change certainly can't be said to anticipate a theory that it actually contradicts in that theory's most basic feature- that the change, for any life, including humans, is not driven by any normative engine.

 

[Tassman]

Hi.The words of the Qur'an are not claims. Rather, reality exists. That supports the fact that science is absolutely correct. How long do you want to not see the truth ?! The Qur'an is all based on existing reality and is true. Unfortunately, the deniers of the Qur'an are drowning in a widespread mistake. I'm sorry.
Did you see the 6 verses in the Qur'an that I mentioned refer to the theory of human evolution? what do you think? The Qur'an stated the theory of human evolution 9 centuries before Darwin. Exactly

The Quran is based upon supposed 'revelation' from on high. It is NOT supported by verifiable evidence. By contrast Evolution by natural selection is one of the best substantiated theories in the history of science, supported by evidence from a wide variety of scientific disciplines. The fact that some religious texts (of whatever religion) don't overtly contradict scientific theory does NOT validate religion.

 

[heydarian saeed]

I've taken the liberty of highlighting what you had already emphasized, in the hope that perhaps heydarian will see the problem. He appears to think that the entirety of the theory of evolution is "living things change over time," when it's more accurately a description of the mechanism behind that tritely obvious observation. A holy book that makes humans a goal of change certainly can't be said to anticipate a theory that it actually contradicts in that theory's most basic feature- that the change, for any life, including humans, is not driven by any normative engine.

Hello and thanks for your comment. look ; In 6 verses of the Qur'an, it is only mentioned that the theory of human evolution can be correct. And God has said 6 times that I destroyed human beings because of their mistakes, just like the previous generations, and you made the new generation more advanced and created the field because of my teachings. I can destroy you again and bring another new generation. Note that first it says in general and does not tell the details. Secondly, it raises the issue of the superiority of the new generation of human beings with science. Which has given man honor and greatness.
In fact, it has stated the theory of human evolution in general. And he said the most important purpose of this statement. That is the superiority of man over other creatures and other generations of man. Which is the subject of education and science. This statement of God in the Qur'an has no contradiction with the theory of human evolution. And supports them.
Thank you

 

[heydarian saeed]

The Quran is based upon supposed 'revelation' from on high. It is NOT supported by verifiable evidence. By contrast Evolution by natural selection is one of the best substantiated theories in the history of science, supported by evidence from a wide variety of scientific disciplines. The fact that some religious texts (of whatever religion) don't overtly contradict scientific theory does NOT validate religion.

Hello and thanks for your comment. Religion and the Qur'an do not seek to confirm science. Basically, the Qur'an and God confirm science. And support. The Qur'an and God do not need to confirm science. Because their surface horizons are not comparable to the material world. I have already proved in my article that science has no properties of matter. And is beyond matter. Science is made by God. And God has brought the universe into existence. And he created man naturally with knowledge. Evidence for the proof of the Qur'an - God - the divine religion can be seen in abundance in nature and matter. And has been proven. But their very existence is not seen because they are not of matter. Only their effect and evidence, which is material, can be seen. Knowledge is from God. And God supports it. And in the Qur'an, 950 verses have said this.
Thank you

 

[Cosmic Yak]

Hello. Because he considers man an evolved animal. And this is wrong.

Man is not evolved. The theory of evolution is wrong.

Darwin's theory is not rejected in the Qur'an. And has not discussed it. And as it turns out, he considers it possible. Although it has defects and is not complete. The most important drawback to Darwin's theory is that: it has neglected human dignity. And he knows man as an animal that has evolved. We do not accept this and reject it.

Man is not evolved, but the theory of evolution is not rejected.
Also, Darwin's theory is not discussed in the Quran. But it is, and it has flaws.

Did you see the 6 verses in the Qur'an that I mentioned refer to the theory of human evolution? what do you think? The Qur'an stated the theory of human evolution 9 centuries before Darwin. Exactly

Darwin's theory is discussed in the Quran, and it is correct.

Hello and thanks for your comment. look ; In 6 verses of the Qur'an, it is only mentioned that the theory of human evolution can be correct.

The theory of evolution is correct. Man has evolved.

 

[Scorpion]

The God the Quran describes is a sadistic, merciless monster. I knew as soon as I read the following verses that the Quran was evil, made up lies about God to scare silly Arabs into fighting Muhammad's wars for him.

Quran surah's 22.19
22.19 These two antagonists dispute with each other about their Lord: But those who deny (their Lord),- for them will be cut out a garment of Fire: over their heads will be poured out boiling water.
22.20 With it will be scalded what is within their bodies, as well as (their) skins.
22.21 In addition there will be maces of iron (to punish) them.
22.22 Every time they wish to get away therefrom, from anguish, they will be forced back therein, and (it will be said), "Taste ye the Penalty of Burning!"


4.56 Those who reject our Signs, We shall soon cast into the Fire: as often as their skins are roasted through, We shall change them for fresh skins, that they may taste the penalty: for God is Exalted in Power, Wise.


40.70 Those who reject the Book and the (revelations) with which We sent our apostles: but soon shall they know,-
40.71 When the yokes (shall be) round their necks, and the chains; they shall be dragged along-
40.72 In the boiling fetid fluid: then in the Fire shall they be burned;

Heydarian, do you really think God would do such things to people, and for all eternity?

 

[heydarian saeed]

Show me a soul. I want to see it. I don't believe it exists.

Hello. You were not careful. I have said before that the soul is not made of matter. Therefore it cannot be seen. But the material evidence and effects can be easily seen.
However, I also offered a laboratory way. Did you do that to see the soul? You who want to see the soul must do this experiment. Please do it. Try a little ...

 

[heydarian saeed]

No, heydarian sayeed, you can not see a soul. You can see things which change during the development of a fetus. Some people like to imagine some of those changes are caused by the arrival of a soul. Others imagine the soul was already there. Others think the soul arrives at a different time. Others think that's all just pretend and there is no such thing as a soul.

But nobody can see a soul. However much you insist some or other behaviour is the operation of a soul, that remains pure supposition and is not evidence of your claim being true. There is no evidence that souls are real.

Hello. No my dear. The soul cannot be seen as you say. But not because he does nothing and has no evidence. No. The soul is not a matter of matter that can be seen. But its material effects and evidence are visible. I have given this example before. Do you see electricity? No. So how do you know about electricity? Because when we press the power switch, the lamp turns on. That is, we know of its existence from objective evidence and the effect of electricity. Do you accept this example? If you do not agree or have an explanation, let us know so we can hear. Thank you

 

[heydarian saeed]

Sorry but no. You're just declaring that you are correct without evidence yet again.

What if I said that the foetus quickening was actually caused by the entry of our lord Satan into the foetus. Would you accept that? Why not? I mean you can see Satan enter the foetus because the foetus starts moving. All hail Satan!

Hello. These 4 arguments are the logical way. And has been proved by analogy of logic. And there is no problem. And it is accepted by all philosophers. Well, you say your special request. I hear. But the devil has no power. And nothing can come of it. Driven and chained. The only thing it can do is tempt human beings. And we humans pursue his purpose with the temptation of Satan. Therefore, we must avoid the temptations of the devil. Good luck. I am waiting for your special request.

 

[heydarian saeed]

Once again: nothing happens during the development of a human foetus that doesn't happen during the development of the foetus of every other mammal. So if it's evidence of a soul entering a foetus then every mammal has a soul. Every sheep. Every whale. Every rat. Do you really believe that rats have souls, heydarian?

You say that no-one has responded to your "proofs of God" even though several posters have, not to mention many philosophers, and you completely ignore points like this one. This is why no one takes you seriously.

Hello. Yes, the soul is in all living things. But the soul has different levels and degrees. I have already said in my article. Note: The plant spirit only grows and multiplies. In addition to growth and reproduction, the animal soul has five senses. In addition to the characteristics of the plant and animal souls, the human soul has perception and knowledge. And recognizes truth and falsehood. You and other friends have unfortunately forgotten what I said in my article or you are deliberately forgetting yourself. This is not a good approach. I'm sorry.
It does not matter that, as you say, no one takes me seriously. Unfortunately, it is intentional. Not anything else. I have tried so far that everything I have said is either for scientific reasons or logic and philosophy. And all this is well documented and acceptable to all thinkers. You are deliberately taking shape. This is not a good approach. I am not like you and other friends. Be reasonable. Leaving that aside, did you read the 6 verses on the theory of human evolution that I found for you to see? Thank you

 

[heydarian saeed]

It's possible he does. While Christians generally don't believe animals have souls I gather that's not the case for Muslims.

Not that it makes any material difference. Since it's just a make-believe concept, every bacterium might as well have one. Every tree. Every cloud. The more the merrier.

... Only living things have souls. Is the cloud alive?! Of course, I also say this important point. The universe and matter and everything in this world is conscious. And understands. Understanding this may be very insane and brutal. But it is. Nature has consciousness.

 

[heydarian saeed]

Man is not evolved. The theory of evolution is wrong.



Man is not evolved, but the theory of evolution is not rejected.
Also, Darwin's theory is not discussed in the Quran. But it is, and it has flaws.




Darwin's theory is discussed in the Quran, and it is correct.



The theory of evolution is correct. Man has evolved.

Hello. I noticed your astonishment and confusion. In 6 verses, the Qur'an mentions the theory of evolution. In some verses to the generation before Adam who became extinct. And in fact, God has destroyed them because of their mistakes. And some verses refer to the next generation of human beings. That the present generation of man may become extinct in the future. In fact, we should be destroyed because of our mistakes. The Qur'an has said the same thing. Not anything else. The current human generation that started with Adam. It is different from other human generations. And I said. For the teaching of science to man by God. It has made him superior to other creatures and generations. Until he gave her the position of his successor. That is, God has said that man is my successor in the universe. Well, do you know better than this great position that God has given to man?

 

[IanS]

Hello. No my dear. The soul cannot be seen as you say. But not because he does nothing and has no evidence. No. The soul is not a matter of matter that can be seen. But its material effects and evidence are visible. I have given this example before. Do you see electricity? No. So how do you know about electricity? Because when we press the power switch, the lamp turns on. That is, we know of its existence from objective evidence and the effect of electricity. Do you accept this example? If you do not agree or have an explanation, let us know so we can hear. Thank you

The reason we know about electricity is because it was discovered by early scientists, and it has been explained by later scientists and used to provide all sorts of uses in the lives of everyone ... science can show you the evidence for all of that, and the only people who believe that electricty does not exist are barking mad idiots.

None of that is the case for your claim of a "soul" ... no science has ever observed that, there is zero evidence for any such thing, and out of all of the hundreds of millions of published science research papers, you will not find any that claim to have discovered any "soul".

You believe in such things, but you also believe in all manner of other very silly things from holy books. Like many religious people nowadays, who should all know better because of modern edcuation, you are really not interested in telling the truth about anything ... you are happy to dishonestly lie your way through life from your holy books.

 

[heydarian saeed]

Heydarian, do you really think God would do such things to people, and for all eternity?

Hi. of course not. God is not terrible sadism. God did not create man for hell. Rather, he has made man his successor in the universe. And always friendly to humans. What is the citation of your light sentences? What is your proof for this? Please provide a valid document. Never talk on speculation. Not good for your character. I consider you my master.
Talk documentary. My words are often based on verses from the Qur'an or science or logic and philosophy. And it is fully documented.
God is just a judge in the parallel world of the Resurrection. And his evidence is only our own deeds. Whoever has done evil has made hell for himself. God did not create hell. We have made ourselves hell because of sin, blasphemy, corruption, crime, ugliness, and so on. And if we are good, we have made heaven. And there only everyone sees the result of their own action. The verses of the Qur'an are to frighten man, not the ignorant Arabs of Muhammad's time. But all human beings. To be good. And let's not be bad. Hell and heaven are made by man, not by God. God always loves human beings.
Please look realistically at the Quran and God. Do not look at suspicion, enmity and resentment. Be reasonable. Everything depends on human actions. God is just a judge. He created the universe for man. So that man may act like God. The Qur'an says these horrible torments so that man will be vigilant and will not create torment and hell for himself. But to build a paradise for himself. It is also eternal hell if man builds for himself. And it is an eternal paradise if man builds for himself. God is perfectly rational.
Everything depends on us. God is the only creator of man and the universe. And is a judge.
I have repeated this word and answer many times. But you still say your guess. Please understand and do not repeat. you're welcome.
Thank you

 

[MarkCorrigan]

Hello. These 4 arguments are the logical way. And has been proved by analogy of logic. And there is no problem. And it is accepted by all philosophers. Well, you say your special request. I hear. But the devil has no power. And nothing can come of it. Driven and chained. The only thing it can do is tempt human beings. And we humans pursue his purpose with the temptation of Satan. Therefore, we must avoid the temptations of the devil. Good luck. I am waiting for your special request.

You missed the point again. I wonder if it is deliberate.

You have said that you can see the soul enter the foetus because the foetus moves, correct?

I don't agree. I think that the foetus begins moving because that's when Satan imbues it with a portion of his power. So which of us is right?

 

[MarkCorrigan]

Also those 4 arguments are absolutely not logical. They are ALL logical fallacies, specifically special pleading.

 

[heydarian saeed]

Heydarian, do you really think God would do such things to people, and for all eternity?

... I would very much like you, dear Master, to discuss the chakra and the connection with the soul. I'm eager to hear.

 

[MarkCorrigan]

Chakras aren't real. Souls aren't real. None of this is real. You're arguing about fictional concepts.

 

[heydarian saeed]

The reason we know about electricity is because it was discovered by early scientists, and it has been explained by later scientists and used to provide all sorts of uses in the lives of everyone ... science can show you the evidence for all of that, and the only people who believe that electricty does not exist are barking mad idiots.

None of that is the case for your claim of a "soul" ... no science has ever observed that, there is zero evidence for any such thing, and out of all of the hundreds of millions of published science research papers, you will not find any that claim to have discovered any "soul".

You believe in such things, but you also believe in all manner of other very silly things from holy books. Like many religious people nowadays, who should all know better because of modern edcuation, you are really not interested in telling the truth about anything ... you are happy to dishonestly lie your way through life from your holy books.

... You did not answer me. You just mixed up the irrelevant answer! My question was that it is not visible. But we find out about it from the evidence and its effects. The electricity discoverer has never seen electricity. He has only seen and understood his evidence. Well, dear friend, so is the soul. How difficult is it to understand this example and this truth ?! We accept the Qur'an. And we also accept all the different sciences. And we praise scientists. The Qur'an There is no contradiction to do with science. And they do not differ. How much distance do you put between the Quran and science ?! I do not know if you are doing this on purpose or not. Quran and science are together. The Qur'an supports science. We do not think old and ancient. We are like you. We see and love the science of the day. Why do you differentiate between us and science and you?
Be realistic. Think freely. Do not be prejudiced. Muslims - Quran - Religion - God are associated with science. And support.

 

[IanS]

... You did not answer me. You just mixed up the irrelevant answer! My question was that it is not visible. But we find out about it from the evidence and its effects. The electricity discoverer has never seen electricity. He has only seen and understood his evidence. Well, dear friend, so is the soul. How difficult is it to understand this example and this truth ?! We accept the Qur'an. And we also accept all the different sciences. And we praise scientists. The Qur'an There is no contradiction to do with science. And they do not differ. How much distance do you put between the Quran and science ?! I do not know if you are doing this on purpose or not. Quran and science are together. The Qur'an supports science. We do not think old and ancient. We are like you. We see and love the science of the day. Why do you differentiate between us and science and you?
Be realistic. Think freely. Do not be prejudiced. Muslims - Quran - Religion - God are associated with science. And support.

No! It's is you who is "mixed up" and not able to answer ... what I said to you is that electricity was discoevered and explained, developed and used by science ... there are literaly tens of thousands of papers on that in the science reserach journals ... but there is nothing like that for any "Soul" ... there is NO evidence or claim of any souls in any genuine science papers ...

... that is a 100% total difference between electricity vs a soul ... and electricity was your own example ! ... why is there no claim or evidence of any soul ever by any genuine scientist publishing in any genuine research journal???...

... for electricty you have perhaps 10,000 such papers and not a single disagreement from any scientists ... but for a "soul" you have not even one such paper and no genuine scientist claiming any evidence for any "soul" ... the two things could not possibly be more different!