The supernatural

For the article Supernatural

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Hello. I really appreciate your attention and your arguments. If possible, tell me the ways of proving the supernatural by previous friends who have failed. I am eager to read the opinions of others in this field. Thank you.

This forum was originally the forum of the James Randi Educational Foundation (JREF), it was renamed when Randi retired and relinquished it to a member. JREF offered a prize of one million dollars to anyone who could provide scientific proof of the supernatural. Most applicants claimed paranormal abilities such as being able to dowse, communicate with the dead etc. The process was for a test protocol to be developed by the applicant and JREF which both agreed was fair. The test was then run under scientifically controlled conditions.

If you look in this subforum:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=43

you will find many threads, each detailing the progress of an applicant. You will see that few got as far as agreeing a test protocol, and those that did all failed the test. In the latter threads you will see examples of such test protocols.
 
@heydarian saeed: You are still posting bits of the Qu'ran and attempting to find ways to interpret them such that they appear to predict actual, or more recently imaginary, scientific discoveries. It has already been explained to you why this is a pointless exercise, which proves absolutely nothing. Once again: if this is all you've got you've got nothing, and you are wasting your time here.
 
It seems almost an invariable rule that people who interpret their ancient holy books as understanding (and anticipating) modern science are also people whose actual understanding of that science is just as foggy- one misunderstanding is the consequence of the other.
 
I suspect he believes that, if the meanings of a few verses can be twisted so that they appear to predict recent scientific discoveries, that counts as scientific proof that the book was divinely inspired, and hence of God. It's a nonsensical argument, but it gets a few more points for effort than most nonsensical arguments.

Hello. I do not need more or less points. And thank you for your kindness. But be careful, dear friends: it does not say anything new in the Quran! It only talks about what is and what is. And it does not predict! It just tells me and you that these scientific facts exist in the universe. And God created it. And you and I will seek to discover these scientific facts. And to achieve its unique achievements. And profit. Let's create a beautiful world for a safe life. That all should enjoy all these blessings equally. Do you know anything better than this?
I may not be able to express the true meaning of what I am writing to you. And my language has a problem with mutual understanding. I apologize for this, like all of you. The Qur'an and God want good for all human beings. He wants good. Our perception; What Muslims we seem to believe in! And what are the disbelievers and disbelievers who do not accept and think in vain that there are defects and defects in the Qur'an and God and His purpose. God and the Qur'an have different and wide meanings. And he himself says in the book of the Qur'an: Everyone chooses a way to reach God and the Qur'an. And this way is free for everyone. (Surah Muzzammel. Verse 19) Better than this ....
 
This forum was originally the forum of the James Randi Educational Foundation (JREF), it was renamed when Randi retired and relinquished it to a member. JREF offered a prize of one million dollars to anyone who could provide scientific proof of the supernatural. Most applicants claimed paranormal abilities such as being able to dowse, communicate with the dead etc. The process was for a test protocol to be developed by the applicant and JREF which both agreed was fair. The test was then run under scientifically controlled conditions.

If you look in this subforum:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=43

you will find many threads, each detailing the progress of an applicant. You will see that few got as far as agreeing a test protocol, and those that did all failed the test. In the latter threads you will see examples of such test protocols.

You are right. But I do not claim to have supernatural powers. And like you, I'm a normal human being. And I do not have much. And maybe less scientifically than you. I have only proved in my article that there is a supernatural. And its effects can be seen in the laboratory. And in this way, great scientific and technological achievements can be brought to humanity. This.
... Yes, I will definitely see. Thank you.
 
Hello. I do not need more or less points. And thank you for your kindness. But be careful, dear friends: it does not say anything new in the Quran! It only talks about what is and what is. And it does not predict! It just tells me and you that these scientific facts exist in the universe. And God created it. And you and I will seek to discover these scientific facts. And to achieve its unique achievements. And profit. Let's create a beautiful world for a safe life. That all should enjoy all these blessings equally. Do you know anything better than this?

I'd say it's better to find out what the universe is really like, even if the truth is less consoling that I would wish, than to twist the meaning of verses in an ancient book (containing many unpleasant and divisive passages) so that they appear to suggest that some recently discovered scientific facts were known to its authors, even though they very obviously were not.

Apart from which, slavish devotion to this awful book clearly does not result in "a beautiful world for a safe life". Not for educated, independent women like me, anyway.
 
... Conclusions from the above scientific discussion:
What is science and perception? Where did it come from? And what is it made of? Is it from matter or something beyond matter?Here I would like to review some obvious principles regarding the characteristics and properties of matter and nature.
We must first define the material being: From the totality of the sayings of the sages in this regard, several things can be named as the characteristics of matter:
1. Having a special place and occupying space
2. Occupy time and having time
3. Significance is sensible
4. Divisibility
5. Evolution through motion; That is, the material being achieves its perfection through movement; His every action is preceded by matter, power and talent.
6. The influence of material things on each other depends on the realization of a specific material situation between the effective and the affected; Therefore, closeness, dimension and being in a special situation are involved in the impact of physical causes.
Of course, one material thing does not have to have all of the above characteristics; Rather, having some of these characteristics in him is a sign of his materiality. All of the above specifications are acceptable to everyone for being material. Movement is inseparable from nature. Therefore, the principle of motion and objective nature are also accepted by all.Now let us see that human science and perceptions have the above characteristics? As you can see, human knowledge and understanding do not have any of the above characteristics. Therefore, science and perception are separate and abstract from matter. According to philosophers, science originates from the human soul. And the human soul is abstract from matter. And it is not made of material. Another important reason for the abstraction of science is the nature of the discovery and realism of truth. This feature is for science only. And not in matter.All the scientific findings and results of scientists' research on seeing, hearing, etc. are related to what happens in the human nervous system and brain cells at the time of seeing, hearing and the emergence of consciousness. All these things are accepted by Islam. But no one can interpret "the truth of science means the discovery of reality." Because, for example, the image you have of a space several kilometers away with mountains, plains, sea, trees, animals and humans in itYou are not compatible with the findings of scientists. Because scientific research says that the image of this space is very small in certain parts of nerves and cells, but "its magnitude is obtained by adaptation to external reality by man by a kind of analogy." For example, the analogy that the face of his body, which is there through seeing, with the reality of the body that he perceives intuitively, uses the same relation in all visions.
Those who do not believe in this principle in fact not only deny science but also deny matter itself.Science and perception are immutable. Just because we understand changes in matter and nature does not mean that
Our own understanding and knowledge of this subject is changing. Rather, our knowledge is fixed.
Movement is nothing but being and not being. Because everything that moves is and is not in an instant.In "becoming" existence and non-existence are together. Thus, by understanding motion and becoming, the concept of gradual and fluid existence is proved. Dialecticians also accept this principle. And are called the principle of contradiction. And introduce the triangle of thesis, antithesis and synthesis. Islamic philosophy also believes in the principle of contradiction. And in principle, evolution does not occur if there is no conflict in objects....
 
This forum was originally the forum of the James Randi Educational Foundation (JREF), it was renamed when Randi retired and relinquished it to a member. JREF offered a prize of one million dollars to anyone who could provide scientific proof of the supernatural. Most applicants claimed paranormal abilities such as being able to dowse, communicate with the dead etc. The process was for a test protocol to be developed by the applicant and JREF which both agreed was fair. The test was then run under scientifically controlled conditions.

If you look in this subforum:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=43

you will find many threads, each detailing the progress of an applicant. You will see that few got as far as agreeing a test protocol, and those that did all failed the test. In the latter threads you will see examples of such test protocols.

Thanks. I read one of the claimants. My article is different from his.
 
... Conclusions from the above scientific discussion:
What is science and perception? Where did it come from? And what is it made of? Is it from matter or something beyond matter?Here I would like to review some obvious principles regarding the characteristics and properties of matter and nature.
We must first define the material being: From the totality of the sayings of the sages in this regard, several things can be named as the characteristics of matter:
1. Having a special place and occupying space
2. Occupy time and having time
3. Significance is sensible
4. Divisibility
5. Evolution through motion; That is, the material being achieves its perfection through movement; His every action is preceded by matter, power and talent.
6. The influence of material things on each other depends on the realization of a specific material situation between the effective and the affected; Therefore, closeness, dimension and being in a special situation are involved in the impact of physical causes.
Of course, one material thing does not have to have all of the above characteristics; Rather, having some of these characteristics in him is a sign of his materiality. All of the above specifications are acceptable to everyone for being material. Movement is inseparable from nature. Therefore, the principle of motion and objective nature are also accepted by all.Now let us see that human science and perceptions have the above characteristics? As you can see, human knowledge and understanding do not have any of the above characteristics. Therefore, science and perception are separate and abstract from matter. According to philosophers, science originates from the human soul. And the human soul is abstract from matter. And it is not made of material. Another important reason for the abstraction of science is the nature of the discovery and realism of truth. This feature is for science only. And not in matter.All the scientific findings and results of scientists' research on seeing, hearing, etc. are related to what happens in the human nervous system and brain cells at the time of seeing, hearing and the emergence of consciousness. All these things are accepted by Islam. But no one can interpret "the truth of science means the discovery of reality." Because, for example, the image you have of a space several kilometers away with mountains, plains, sea, trees, animals and humans in itYou are not compatible with the findings of scientists. Because scientific research says that the image of this space is very small in certain parts of nerves and cells, but "its magnitude is obtained by adaptation to external reality by man by a kind of analogy." For example, the analogy that the face of his body, which is there through seeing, with the reality of the body that he perceives intuitively, uses the same relation in all visions.
Those who do not believe in this principle in fact not only deny science but also deny matter itself.Science and perception are immutable. Just because we understand changes in matter and nature does not mean that
Our own understanding and knowledge of this subject is changing. Rather, our knowledge is fixed.
Movement is nothing but being and not being. Because everything that moves is and is not in an instant.In "becoming" existence and non-existence are together. Thus, by understanding motion and becoming, the concept of gradual and fluid existence is proved. Dialecticians also accept this principle. And are called the principle of contradiction. And introduce the triangle of thesis, antithesis and synthesis. Islamic philosophy also believes in the principle of contradiction. And in principle, evolution does not occur if there is no conflict in objects....

Yikes- existential mad libs. I really doubt that a better understanding of English would result in any better sense.
 
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It's different to virtually all of them in that it not only contains no evidence of the supernatural, it offers no hope of ever providing any.


I would say that that makes it similar to the others rather than different.
 
Anyway, heydarian saeed, can you explain how your prediction that the Earth is expanding agrees with scientific findings?

pay attention; That is, we have expanded and how well we are expanding the earth. This does not mean that the earth is flat and does not contradict its sphericity. In this verse, he does not mention the shape of the earth at all. He only says that we have spread the earth because it is ready for my life and yours - for my and your residence and urban development - for my and your agriculture and ... and how well we are spreading the earth for you human beings ...
 
I would say that that makes it similar to the others rather than different.

Claims that were testable, and in some cases got as far as being tested, are very different to the ones the OP is making. Those tests could indeed have established the existence of the supernatural, had it existed. That is not even a theoretical possibility for the approach the OP is taking.
 
Heydarian, why are you ignoring me? You asked me for Quran quotes, I gave them to you, and you just asked me for the quotes again. Address my argument please.
 
This isn't a response to the post you quoted. The post you quoted was my stating that your explanation for the Quranic passages "describing a round earth" was wrong.

But let's look at the point you are making here. Are you claiming that the Quran does not teach that apostates should be killed?

Is that your claim? That the Quran absolutely does not say to kill apostates?

It isn't the actions of some Muslims that I am talking about, it's the actual language of the book itself.



Kill the unbelievers.


Disbelievers are wrong doers simply for not believing.



Don't be friends with a non believer because they want to drag you to non belief. If they convert to Islam then that's fine but if they don't or if they go back to non belief kill them. All of them.


The greatest evil possible? No, not murder or rape or genocide. Rejection of Islam.



Non Muslims are evil.

This is not even a majority of the horrible intolerance and viciousness in the Quran. It's a handful of the literally hundreds of passages that preach supremacism and cruelty.

Only for Muslims. Doesn't matter how good a person you are if you are not a muslim you will burn in hell for eternity, to say nothing of the many, many places that book says that we as non believers should be degraded, treated harshly and killed.


Not what your holy book says. Your holy book says that if you aren't a Muslim you burn in hell. Doesn't matter how good you are.


Evidence for this please. I don't believe in heaven or hell. I think they are entirely fictional, but I'm willing to be convinced if you have some evidence for them.



A lot of people do it because they follow whatever "holy" book they were brought up to believe. Much of the Middle Eastern conflict has been fuelled by the fact that the Quran repeatedly describes the Jews as evil.

That sounds nice, but your book commands you to kill non believers. How can you say that you want to create a paradise on this world when your own book that is supposed to be the direct word of god commands you to kill people like me?
In case you have forgotten these are the most recent posts of mine that you ignored or attempted to handwave away.
 
Well, folks, I think we're dealing with a mystic here. You may as well speak to a tree. When the mysticaloid breeze blows, the tree appears to move and make sounds. The swaying of the branches can be quite pleasing, and the sound of the air in the leaves can soothe us gently.

Briefly, in childhood; but we grow up. The mystic, I think, is one who does not grow up, and remains always enchanted by empty air.




I expected the software to turn enchanted into enchained. But alas, robots still rely on us to find words. They shouldn't do that.
 
11. Land reduction:
The earth is constantly shrinking. Gas, heat, and energy are constantly released from the Earth's atmosphere and into space, and its volume and size are gradually reduced. It is estimated that at the beginning of its existence, the Earth had a volume approximately 2,000 times larger than its current volume. As it decreases continuously from the sun, it also decreases continuously from the earth so that the balance between gravity and repulsion between the sun and the earth remains constant.40,000 tons of space debris enters our planet every year. However, the earth becomes 50,000 tons lighter during this time. Why does the earth lose weight every year? Has the earth taken on a stubborn diet to lose weight, or has human sabotage on the earth reduced its weight? In the following, we will examine the reasons for the annual lightening of the earth.With a simple calculation we can calculate the reasons for the weight loss of the earth. Note that in this calculation, the rate of population growth and the launch of rockets and satellites into space has no effect on the total weight of the Earth. Because humans are part of the weight of the earth. On the other hand, rockets and satellites that are launched from Earth to space, return to Earth and have little effect on calculating the total weight of the Earth.In the following, you will first see the reasons for weight gain and then the weight loss of the earth.
Earth 40,000 tons of waste enters the earth annually.
Waste forms the surface material of the earth.
NASA has announced that the weight of the Earth increases by 160 tons every year due to global warming. In fact, as the earth warms, it absorbs more energy. Note that if energy is added to a system, the mass of matter in that system increases.So far, 40,000 tons of space waste and 160 tons due to global warming, which adds a total of 40,160 tons to the weight of the earth annually.
Lose weight!
The Earth's core is constantly losing energy. In fact, the Earth's core is similar to a massive nuclear reactor that uses different fuels. Loss of energy means loss of earth mass. 16 tons of earth mass is lost every year, which is insignificant compared to the masses that the earth acquires every year.Every year, 95,000 tons of hydrogen and 1,600 tons of helium are released from the earth's surface. These two materials are very light and therefore gravity can not hold them. So these materials fly into space. Thus, the earth loses 96,600 tons of weight every year.
With a simple calculation, you can see that the earth gains 40,000 tons of weight annually and loses 96,000 tons. Therefore, it loses about 50,000 tons of weight annually. In fact, the weight of the earth decreases by 0.00000000000000001% every year compared to the previous year.
Weight loss that we do not understand and scientists have recently realized, only with advanced research tools, while the Qur'an reports more than 14 centuries ago !!!
The book of the Qur'an in the seventh century AD revealed this scientific phenomenon and stated it in two verses.
In Surah Ra'd. Verse 41
Translation: Have they not seen that we [always] come and reduce from around this earth, and it is God who rules. And there is no deterrent to his judgment, and he audits quickly.
In Surah Anbiya ', verse 44
Translation: Rather, We provided them and their fathers with prosperity for a long time. Do they not see that we come and reduce the earth from its surroundings? Will they still win?
The final conclusion of the above scientific discussion: ....

Both surah' Rad ( 13.41) and Al Anbiya ( 21.44) are referring to the reduction of control of other religions on the land. Not to a reduction in the size of the earth. See the footnotes in the Yusuf Ali and Pickthall translations
 
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