The people who let Putin get away with persecuting Navalny

[shemp]

The people who let Putin get away with persecuting Navalny

By Garry Kasparov

(CNN) The Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny was sentenced in Moscow on Tuesday to two and a half years of prison. His supposed crime was a probation violation committed while he was in a coma in Berlin after being poisoned by the same state security forces that have locked him up again.

It's pointless to talk about the details of the case. Not when Vladimir Putin is the only real judge, jury and, from time to time, executioner (which he denies). The dictator Putin has up till now avoided imprisoning Navalny for very long, although he has targeted Navalny's family, as any mafia boss would.

The point of this unprecedented crackdown is to reassure Putin's investors at home and abroad that everything is fine, that he is willing to crush the entire country under his KGB boot in order to keep the oil, gas and cash flowing. He's not afraid of scaring off his cronies and foreign partners or outraging his adversaries, because they have always come running back to him after each invasion, each assassination, each rigged election.

Now with Navalny, the free world's political and business leaders have another chance to show newfound resolve — or continued cowardice. The initial condemnations of Navalny's sentencing from the United States, Canada and many European nations would be heartening if they did not sound nearly identical to those issued when he was poisoned last August. (There was, unsurprisingly, a sharp contrast between the rapid condemnation issued by President Joe Biden's Secretary of State Anthony Blinken and the Trump State Department's belated and feeble acknowledgment.)

Putin has spent hundreds of billions of dollars to beef up internal security forces during his 20 years in power, and most of that money came from rich western nations, especially before Putin's invasion of Ukraine in 2014 finally led to scattered sanctions — too little, too late. Such deals with the devil inevitably backfire. As I warned in 2007, with every act of appeasement Putin has gone from a local problem to a regional menace to a global threat.

Germany thinks it can criticize Russia on human rights while going ahead with the Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline that will fill Putin's pockets with cash and his military's guns with bullets. Those bullets are used against Europeans in Ukraine and, God forbid, against Russians in the streets. Europe thinks it can separate business and politics, but to Putin it's all the same: business.

Like Trump, Putin is all about the money. But unlike Trump, Putin isn't an incompetent boob. He gets away with this because the West is more than willing to do business with him.

 

[lambent]

Question (translated from Arabic):

Moscow’s rhetoric on protests in the West, in part, on Capitol Hill, and the Western response to unauthorized actions in Moscow are very different. Don’t you think that the Russian position is too diplomatic, thereby giving the West more opportunity to interfere in Russia’s domestic affairs? Shouldn’t Moscow start referring to those that were arrested for the riots on the Capitol as political prisoners?



Sergey Lavrov:

I’d say that the West presents very specific, one-sided coverage of not only the events linked with Alexei Navalny but also everything that is taking place in Russia. The hysteria caused by his trial is out of proportion. The public is not told that the regulations for holding demonstrations, rallies and protests are much tougher in the West than in Russia. The police in the West have the right to curb any assembly that is not authorised or notified of in advance, or, if a notification was submitted, violate the procedures for holding it as agreed with the authorities. If demonstrators in Germany, France, the US or other Western countries take to the streets and prevent the normal functioning of transport, they can face several years in prison, huge fines and other penalties. The police are much tougher with them than our law-enforcement bodies as regards participating in illegal actions.

Coverage of these actions in Russia and actions by opposition leaders in the West is also based on double standards. When they show events in Russia, the focus is on the police response to the behaviour of the demonstrators. The latter’s actions are not shown at all, although looking at the footage on the internet, it is easy to see how aggressive those who took part in illegal actions were in Moscow and other Russian cities in the past few days. When the Western media cover similar events at home, they usually show outrageous behaviour by demonstrators like broken shop windows and cars on fire, but not the cruelty of the police. This applies to the footage of a police car driving over the bodies of demonstrators lying on the asphalt. As a rule, such footage is kept behind the scenes and can only be found on social media.

To have this discussion (if the West is interested) along the lines of common sense and facts (the West is reluctant to discuss facts), we have prepared a video - https://www.facebook.com/MIDRussia/posts/3141325619300191 - on how illegal actions are held and suppressed in the West and how our police reacted to the excesses of demonstrators during the recent events. Yesterday, we handed over this video to Foreign Minister of Sweden Ann Linde who is also the OSCE Chairperson-in-Office. Today, I sent the same video to Josep Borrell, High Representative of the EU for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy. We want him to see the objective picture based on specific facts from both sides rather than groundless accusations as he prepares for his visit to Moscow on Friday. Unfortunately, our Western colleagues have become used to such accusations, whether it’s the Skripal case or the so-called Navalny “poisoning” or the events related to his arrest and yesterday’s court verdict.

I understand those who think that Russia could be more aggressive in reacting to the openly high-handed, unseemly rhetoric from Western leaders. In our diplomatic and political culture, we are not used to resorting to thuggish rhetoric. We are polite people and are used to achieving our goals in a civil and civilised manner. As we say: “God is not in power but in truth.” We also have a good proverb that should be remembered: “Honey is sweet, but the bee stings.” Those who take our polite manners for a sign of weakness are making a big mistake.




From Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov’s remarks and answers to media questions at a joint news conference following talks with Jordanian Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign Affairs and Expatriates Ayman Safadi, Moscow, February 3, 2021 - https://www.mid.ru/en/foreign_policy/news/-/asset_publisher/cKNonkJE02Bw/content/id/4551164




And some more information:

Press release on Russian-German contacts on the “Alexey Navalny case” - https://www.mid.ru/en/foreign_policy/news/-/asset_publisher/cKNonkJE02Bw/content/id/4546417

 

[Airfix]

What (aside from sanctions and protests) can we do to stop Putin ?
It's not like we can assassinate him, or invade....

 

[caveman1917]

Interesting how Western liberals always take up the cause of the most dubious far-right figures in politics as long as they're from some country the West doesn't like. I, for one, don't care one bit when the local marginal wanna-be fascist leader gets arrested again. What did he do this time? Called for the extermination of the "Caucasian cockroaches"[*] again?

* The Caucasus is a region in Russia inhabited by non-ethnic Russians and thereby a favourite target for the likes of Navalny.

 

[Childlike Empress]

Interesting how Western liberals always take up the cause of the most dubious far-right figures in politics as long as they're from some country the West doesn't like. I, for one, don't care one bit when the local marginal wanna-be fascist leader gets arrested again. What did he do this time? Called for the extermination of the "Caucasian cockroaches"[*] again?

* The Caucasus is a region in Russia inhabited by non-ethnic Russians and thereby a favourite target for the likes of Navalny.

I refuse to call these people "liberals". They are NPCs (automatons) parroting state propaganda. In other times, other tales, maybe less "liberal", equally as moronic as the "Navalny was poisoned with the most severe nerve agent ever developed, was allowed to fly to Germany, recovered, produced a film with Hollywood money about nonsense that is literally ten years old, and decided to fly back to Russia just the moment the Russian authorities lost their tolerance about Assange-level "crimes" - not reporting back on a bail - and announced that he is wanted now" tale would have been parroted by them, and they would feel great and righteous about it like they do now.

 

[catsmate]

Interesting how Western liberals always take up the cause of the most dubious far-right figures in politics as long as they're from some country the West doesn't like. I, for one, don't care one bit when the local marginal wanna-be fascist leader gets arrested again. What did he do this time? Called for the extermination of the "Caucasian cockroaches"[*] again?

Fascinating how self-described "leftists" parrot the propagandist lies of Putin.

<>They are NPCs (automatons) parroting state propaganda. <>.

The irony, it burns.....

 

[Airfix]

Fascinating how self-described "leftists" parrot the propagandist lies of Putin.


The irony, it burns.....

Putin's a murderer, but he's a murderer with nuclear weapons.
There are laws against bumping off foreign leaders.

The only options are sanctions and condemnation.
Beyond that, what can we do ?

 

[caveman1917]

Fascinating how self-described "leftists" parrot the propagandist lies of Putin.

Yes we already know from the Ukraine thread you really like neo-nazis.

Here is your favourite fascist homeboy supporting anti-immigrant riots:

Opposition leader Alexei Navalny played up his populist nationalism as he championed the rioters’ for confronting “hordes of legal and illegal immigrants” on his blog. “If there is no fair way to resolve conflicts and problems, then people will create it themselves, with primitive and desperate measures,” he wrote. Echoing the sentiment that Russians are victims of bestial migrant violence, he wrote, “From [the city’s bazaars] they crawl out to the surrounding neighborhoods. They’re not going to die of hunger when they can’t find work, not when they can snatch a purse in the subway or take somebody’s money at knife-point in an elevator.”

Here he is in a video comparing people from the Caucasus to cockroaches:


You might want to compare his propaganda films on the subject and its visualization of Caucasian non-ethnic Russians as cockroaches to standard nazi propaganda tactics.

Oh yeah, he's of course also one of the organizers of the annual "Russian March" - the biggest far-right event in Russia.

 

[caveman1917]

Putin's a murderer, but he's a murderer with nuclear weapons.
There are laws against bumping off foreign leaders.

The only options are sanctions and condemnation.
Beyond that, what can we do ?

In the spirit of Navalny's politics (which is, after all, what he keeps getting arrested for) perhaps organize some pogroms of immigrants or lynchings of black people? Sure, you may not be able to help him personally, but at least it would show that his voice and struggle is being heard in the West.

 

[Airfix]

I do not know enough about Nalvany to have an opinion of him.

If he's a racist I'll condemn him.

BUT, I remember what happened to Alexander Litvinenko and Anna Politkovskaya.
I remember what happened to Boris Nemtsov.
I remember what has happened to so many of Putin's rivals and too many have died or been poisoned for that to be a coincidence.

Ukrainian Neo Nazis, they do exist and I condemn them.

But I also condemn Putin.

 

[caveman1917]

I refuse to call these people "liberals". They are NPCs (automatons) parroting state propaganda. In other times, other tales, maybe less "liberal", equally as moronic as the "Navalny was poisoned with the most severe nerve agent ever developed, was allowed to fly to Germany, recovered, produced a film with Hollywood money about nonsense that is literally ten years old, and decided to fly back to Russia just the moment the Russian authorities lost their tolerance about Assange-level "crimes" - not reporting back on a bail - and announced that he is wanted now" tale would have been parroted by them, and they would feel great and righteous about it like they do now.

You're right that calling them "liberals" is wrong. After all, Navalny was thrown out of the Russian liberal party Yabloko for his nationalist views, after which he founded a coalition with the "Movement Against Illegal Immigration." Although I'm sure that there are also some well-meaning Western liberals who are simply completely ignorant of Navalny and his politics and see him as some sort of oppressed anti-government hero, but there are also many like catsmate who are plain neo-nazi sympathizers trying to drum up support for the Russian far-right by deliberately misleading Western liberals to support them.

 

[caveman1917]

I do not know enough about Nalvany to have an opinion of him.

If he's a racist I'll condemn him.

BUT, I remember what happened to Alexander Litvinenko and Anna Politkovskaya.
I remember what happened to Boris Nemtsov.
I remember what has happened to so many of Putin's rivals and too many have died or been poisoned for that to be a coincidence.

Ukrainian Neo Nazis, they do exist and I condemn them.

But I also condemn Putin.

One can condemn Putin without taking up the cause of Navalny. Just like one can condemn the US government without taking up the cause of Atomwaffen Division.

 

[timhau]

Obviously, because Navalny is no saint, everyone is better off with Vladimir the Underpants Poisoner and his systemic corruption.

 

[caveman1917]

Obviously, because Navalny is no saint, everyone is better off with Vladimir the Underpants Poisoner and his systemic corruption.

Fascinating how you seem to be under the impression that when the far-right claims to "fight against corruption" they would, when in power, actually decrease corruption. Yet even a cursory look at such cases disagrees, whenever they get into power they are even worse on the corruption front. So given this historical track record of fascists "fighting corruption" what makes you think it would be any different this time? And of course then we're not even considering the impact it would have on marginalized groups in society, his propaganda videos against immigrants and non-ethnic Russians do seem to be quite explicit with the fly-swatters and guns and such.

 

[Childlike Empress]

BUT

BUT you remember what you have been told about these other incidents, just like what you have been told about the heroic "opponent" of Putin Navalny - who is indeed not a pleasant character and his politics are far from "liberal" as caveman1917 pointed out.

What if those other stories have been as truthful as the latest one?

Without going into details, Litvinenko was a lackey of one of the most sinister Russian oligarchs, Boris Beresovsky, who was kicked out of Russia by Putin and was hellbent on revenge until his apparent suicide a few years ago (which - BB's "suicide" - is for some reason never woven into these tales).

Politkovskaya was researching the Chechen wars when she was murdered, and her murderers were Chechen hardcore criminals who are now in prison for it. They haven't revealed who contracted them. The idea that it was "Putin" is absurd as he has far better means if he wanted to (and no good reputation among Chechen hardcore criminals to say the least).

Nemtsov was a has-been in politics for his role in the looting of Russia in the 90s and was as much of a political threat to Putin as Navalny is today. Zero. His killers were also Chechen hardcore criminals who are now in prison and haven't revealed who contracted them.

Then there's the Skripal story which is almost as idiotic as this current Navalny thing.

Maybe take a look for yourself before you support people in circumstances you know nothing about, and have no stake in, just because you've heard it on the tellie. It's probably "as false as always", not "as true as always".

 

[MisAndreG]

US liberals have a bad tendency to support bad guys if those bad guys are enemies of our enemies and say the right things for our cameras.

 

[Airfix]

Childlike Empress, as I'm not Russian, I don't have to take a side and vote.
I can stand back, look at all of them and stare in absolute disgust at the lot of their politicians including Putin.

 

[Orphia Nay]

I'm trying to read this thread to get some facts on the issue, but all I see is personal opinion, arguments and partisanship.

Childlike Empress, as I'm not Russian, I don't have to take a side and vote.
I can stand back, look at all of them and stare in absolute disgust at the lot of their politicians including Putin.

It's so much easier to "be in disgust" at politicians than it is to defend their actions occasionally.

Internet war is the big fear, not new cold wars.

If we weren't so critical of "the other side" there'd be less fear of war.

When highly-edited YouTubes about politics and corruption go round, they inflame violence.

Internet war causes war.

 

[caveman1917]

US liberals have a bad tendency to support bad guys if those bad guys are enemies of our enemies and say the right things for our cameras.

It's a long-standing strategy throughout the cold war to support nationalist factions in the USSR (a multicultural country) to promote inter-ethnic tension to cause the breakup of the USSR. It's probably just the same thing now, supporting Navalny in the hope of inflaming inter-ethnic conflict in Russia to cause a further breakup.

 

[Lukraak_Sisser]

Or, just putting it out there, it might be possible that the fact that Navalny isn't voicing the nicest of opinions does not mean he should be poisoned, arrested in a show trial while the doctor that treated him had a convenient heart attack.

I disagree with Trump and his populist ilk in Europe, but that does not mean I feel they should be killed. The same for Navalny.