The Genesis Seal

[Complexity]

Since your responses are devoid of content, I don't think it matters much whether you respond or not.

 

[stokes234]

1.I think there is some confusion between the message and something quite different to is often attached to a message. You've seen why I gave the Genesis Seal that name. It is partly because it shows a stamp of authority. A more sophisticated variation on this idea is that of an error-correcting check-sum attached to an electronic message just before it is sent. I like to think of the Genesis Seal being a kind of check-sum that can help in testing the integrity of the message itself. That would be why lots of its components look for all the world like preparatory notes for what will appear later as extended narrative passages. The check-sum does not contain new information; only sufficient meta-data about the real message to help, if necessary, to re-construct the authors true purpose.
2. We are dealing here with a religious text that has been an input to many beliefs and philosophies. Suppose, just for example, that the Pythagorean School at Croton had been one of them. Like many other such organisations they were very secretive, requiring initiates to swear solemn oaths of loyalty and secrecy. One of the reasons that secret societies are popular targets for conspiracy theorists is precisely because their sacred texts and beliefs are inaccessible. Indeed, it is very likely that as the older societies died out, so did their inner secrets. Eventually, I shall show that the Genesis Seal maps so closely onto what we do know about such matters that it has to be prime candidate to fill in lots of the gaps in our knowledge.
I shall make my next submission tomorrow.

You haven't actually found a message, then. I don't intend this to be specifically offensive, but I hope you give up on this idea as soon as it becomes clear to you that you have discovered nothing of any tangible benefit to anyone, and are humble enough to admit that you are simply another in a long, long list of people who have succumbed to confirmation bias.

Dawkins writes a good passage in one of his more recent books (either the god delusion or the greatest show on earth, can't remember) that basically explains why it's evolutionarily advantageous for humans to see patterns even where there aren't patterns. Seems to me that that is what is happening to you, and you've become too invested in it to admit it.

 

[yy2bggggs]

Honestly, I'm not really sure what you have in mind.

I have made an observation:

If I eat Cream of Mushroom soup when I have a cold, then it appears I'll get better.​

I have formed a hypothesis:

Cream of Mushroom soup helps me get over colds.​

This implies a null hypothesis such as this:

Eating Cream of Mushroom soup has nothing to do with getting over colds.​

In order for me to see that it actually is the Cream of Mushroom soup affecting my cold, I have to test what happens both when I do eat Cream of Mushroom soup, and when I don't. I have to compare the results of the former to the latter.

If I only test what happens when I eat Cream of Mushroom soup, I might get the false impression that it helps even if it doesn't, because I don't know what the results mean; if I eat Cream of Mushroom soup and am better in two days, does that mean it helped?

Probably not what you expect me to say, but: unbeknown to me, my wife has been putting paracetamol and a cocktail of patent remedies in my mushroom soup, or extra magic-mushrooms from the garden, which made me feel better despite the cold. All I'm suggesting here, a little facetiously, is that there can be explanations that no amount of digging will reveal.

This isn't relevant to what I'm talking about. We need to know what we can establish and how to establish things. If there are things we can never know, then we simply can never know them.

But this doesn't change the fact that without testing the null hypothesis, we have no way of measuring the validity of the hypothesis.

 

[David Swidler]

Sorry, David, but I don't really regard your interests (e.g. study of the torah, kabala) to be of any value. I don't respect superstition in any of its forms, and I think we all would be far better off without any of it.

You're entitled to that position. But since my experience is exactly opposite what you think - I've found my life and community enriched beyond measure by the lifestyle and study - I'm willing to endure the consequent tragedy of being called superstitious by some anonymous dude on the internet.

This is really a derail, since the OP in no way reflects what I study or live.

 

[Kingfisher2926]

Dawkins writes a good passage in one of his more recent books (either the god delusion or the greatest show on earth, can't remember) that basically explains why it's evolutionarily advantageous for humans to see patterns even where there aren't patterns. Seems to me that that is what is happening to you, and you've become too invested in it to admit it.

I actually referred to the same principle in a much earlier post. I noted that there is survival advantage in being able to 'see the lion hidden in the bush'. I went on to what I suggest is a very important rider to the risk of false pattern recognition. It is the fact that sometimes there will be a real lion there.
Its a good job my ancestor on the savannah didn't have to stop to make comparisons with control samples all the time.

 

[Donn]

Its a good job my ancestor on the savannah didn't have to stop to make comparisons with control samples all the time.

Cheap shot. You are not facing a lion, but you are facing a kind of wasting disease that will eat your time and reason.

Your lack of respect for your own ideas is sad. There are many very good suggestions in this thread that could help you assess your situation, yet you spurn them all with empty excuses.

I fear it may be too late for our antiidiotics to work, your disease may be immune.

 

[Kingfisher2926]

In order for me to see that it actually is the Cream of Mushroom soup affecting my cold, I have to test what happens both when I do eat Cream of Mushroom soup, and when I don't. I have to compare the results of the former to the latter.

If I only test what happens when I eat Cream of Mushroom soup, I might get the false impression that it helps even if it doesn't, because I don't know what the results mean; if I eat Cream of Mushroom soup and am better in two days, does that mean it helped?

I do appreciate your kind efforts. I sort of assumed this follow-up without thinking I had to say it explicitly. Must be my age.
However, there could be a quite different scenario that is a better analogue to the Genesis Seal. Consider a supermarket that has its goods set out in logical order so that, say, all the fresh vegetables are near each other. All supermarkets do this to be overtly helpful to their customers. Who would keep going back to a supermarket that wasn't organised like that? Anyway, I compare this standard situation to the perfectly natural suggestion that any 8x8 block of Hebrew text will reveal some degree of emergent order.
Now consider the extra sneaky tricks that all supermarkets employ to hook their customers. I mean things like putting certain goods at eye-level to be easily noticed, or putting sweets at the checkout for screaming kids to pester their parents into buying. Now this is the sort of second-order structure that I suggest the Genesis Seal is pioneering. The key question is this: Is there an analytical technique that can show this to be likely to be the result of deliberate design. In any case, how necessary can that be when the supermarkets have been rumbled through empirical observation alone?

 

[yy2bggggs]

However, there could be a quite different scenario that is a better analogue to the Genesis Seal. ...

Why is this different? You have a null hypothesis. Test it.

Without testing it, how can you be sure there's even something special there?

The key question is this: Is there an analytical technique that can show this to be likely to be the result of deliberate design.

This is exactly what my example addresses. You cannot tell anything at all without testing the null hypothesis, because you have no idea what your results even mean without doing it.

 

[JimBenArm]

I think you're way too emotionally invested in the Genesis Seal, but you're committing the same error over and over. I'm going to attempt to explain this error using something that is completely unrelated.

Let's suppose I have a cold one year, and I eat some Cream of Mushroom soup. I notice, after I eat the Cream of Mushroom soup, that I get better. So I form the belief that Cream of Mushroom soup is good for colds.

The next year, when I catch a cold, I eat some Cream of Mushroom soup. And sure enough, I get better. Let's suppose this goes on for a decade... every year, I catch a cold. Every year, I eat Cream of Mushroom soup. And every year after eating the Cream of Mushroom soup, I get better. I now have a lot of data points; and by now, I'm completely sold on the fact that Cream of Mushroom soup is good for colds.

However, there's a huge problem with my approach. Can you spot it?

You're not eating corn dogs?

 

[stokes234]

I actually referred to the same principle in a much earlier post. I noted that there is survival advantage in being able to 'see the lion hidden in the bush'. I went on to what I suggest is a very important rider to the risk of false pattern recognition. It is the fact that sometimes there will be a real lion there.
Its a good job my ancestor on the savannah didn't have to stop to make comparisons with control samples all the time.

Think of it this way. How many people have fallen for confirmation bias? Millions, tens of millions, hundreds of millions. How many have successfully cracked ancient codes that have revealed an entire new slant on history? Perhaps a few clever historians have worked out something that nobody else would have seen in historical texts, but nothing really the same. Let's call it a 1 in a hundred million chance (being generous) that you have actually cracked a code here, rather than done what half of the human race has done and seen a pattern where there isn't one due to confirmation bias.

If your ancestor had spent several years looking at a bush that had a 1:100000000 chance of having a lion behind it, would he even have found time to reproduce to become your ancestor?

 

[Kingfisher2926]

Why is this different? You have a null hypothesis. Test it.

Without testing it, how can you be sure there's even something special there?

This is exactly what my example addresses. You cannot tell anything at all without testing the null hypothesis, because you have no idea what your results even mean without doing it.

Think of it this way. How many people have fallen for confirmation bias? Millions, tens of millions, hundreds of millions. How many have successfully cracked ancient codes that have revealed an entire new slant on history? Perhaps a few clever historians have worked out something that nobody else would have seen in historical texts, but nothing really the same. Let's call it a 1 in a hundred million chance (being generous) that you have actually cracked a code here, rather than done what half of the human race has done and seen a pattern where there isn't one due to confirmation bias.

If your ancestor had spent several years looking at a bush that had a 1:100000000 chance of having a lion behind it, would he even have found time to reproduce to become your ancestor?

OK, look, I shall perform a basic test on some control samples. But I may also call on your good offices to help me through the process. But first, I am about to make my next contributory post with more empirical details of the Genesis Seal. As soon as I've done that, I shall start thinking about the kind of test(s) I can hope to master. Then I'll come back and ask your opinions.

 

[Kingfisher2926]

I am painfully aware that I am not presenting Genesis Seal material to the forum in the articulate order that I would prefer. Nor have I yet demonstrated much in the way of evidence that the Genesis Seal has been a significant influence in human history. I shall remedy the latter issue as soon as possible; but first I want to introduce an aspect of the Genesis Seal in which the text flows outwards from the centre, always following the same path as the inward spirals of the G1 and G2 squares. This new concept has been an omission on my part on which I have recently been pressed by more than one poster.

Figure 10 illustrates the G3 Square, in which the expanding text is identical to that of G2, even down to the migrated letter ayin, now at the heart of the square, in its prefix position.



In this illustration, I have highlighted some of the zones that are notable for preserving the same localised emphasis as in other views. For want of a better description, I refer to this effect as the Principle of Reserved Locations, as it is an important trait of the Genesis Seal that adds to the evidence for the existence of skilful second-order design. First, however, I should like to begin by drawing attention to the unlikely distribution of the nine copies of the letter vav in this text. Recall that in the G1 Square, these letters were all confined to the lower half, and fairly disorganised except for five of them that conformed to a distinctive, symmetrical ‘Y’ shape, coincident with the vertical diagonal. Then, in the G2 Square, while still within the lower half, eight of the nine had become aligned into a very distinctive, meandering sequence. It was at that stage I commended the idea that in the context of the Genesis Seal, the letter vav has been conscripted to represent water, and that the water in G2 is a depiction of a meandering river. There were plenty of additional allusions to other rivers to endorse that interpretation. However, now, in the G3 Square, all the water has become segregated between the highest and lowest parts. There is a broad, horizontal swathe equal to 60% of this square that is quite devoid of water. So, in the same spirit as with earlier stages, I commend this unlikely outcome as equivalent to the biblical passage: And God said, “Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.” And God made the firmament. And divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. (Gen. 1:6-7).
I will add to this observed improbability the fact that in the new G3 Square, all six letters that confer a qatan value of ‘3’ are confined to the ‘dry’, horizontal rows, with exactly one of them in each row. Though there is, in fact, just one row that contains both a ‘3’ value and a letter vav (value = 6). All the ‘3’s are highlighted later, in Figure 11.

Moving quickly on to the promised examples of the Principle of Reserved Locations., one of them occurs in the top half, on the right. So, in the exact location where we once saw the ‘Garden eastward in Eden’, we now have the letters of ha’rechem (the womb) in the corner positions of the same 3x3 zone that had contained the expression ‘for a root’. It is worth noting also that the word eretz (the earth) of the source text is still present in its original position, though in reverse order naturally.
It is by no means trivial that the letters of l’rechem (for a womb) once came together in precisely the same configuration in a 3x3 zone of the G2 Square. And that was also where three copies of the letter vav in G1 had previously occupied the upper ‘V’ portion of the prominent ‘Y’ shape.
Next, the 3x3 zone in the extreme right corner of G3 has two identical emergent words as its diagonals. These spell he (she), which has some significance in relation to the G4 Square, which is yet to come. Right now, these words may serve as place-holders, though I shall re-examine this part of the G3 Square later in this post, from another angle. Bearing in mind that this 3x3 zone had been the upper end of an Ark-like box shape in G1, I now want to point out an equivalent construct elsewhere in this G3 view.
High up and to the left (see Figure 10) there is a 3x3 cluster that contains the letters of ha’aron (the Ark) in a cyclic formation. If this part of the G3 Square is compared to the same part of G2, it can be seen that the same four elements had been occupied by the Ineffable Name (YHWH). Yet, in this G3 Square, it can be seen that the same name YHWH occurs in linear, emergent form higher up. This may be considered equivalent to the presence in G1 of the four-letter word for ‘tablets’ that was seen descending into the darkness within that first Ark.
To complete the identity of the new, upper Ark, we look to the 3x3 zone in the extreme top corner in Figure 10. Here, there is an emergent word ha’har (the mountain) occupying its horizontal diagonal, while the vertical m’ha’har (from the mountain) fills the vertical diagonal, before spilling out below.
Crossing through ‘from the mountain’ and also through the name of YHWH, there is another emergent word ohel (a tent), of which only the first and lest letters are highlighted with sage-green octagonal borders. Then in the left-hand end of the G3 square’s horizontal diagonal there is a b’ohel (in a tent). Undoubtedly, the Holy of holies of the Tabernacle that was in the desert can be described as a tent within a tent.
To complete my analysis of the G3 Square, I now need to switch to the view in Figure 11, in which all the letters have been converted to equivalent qatan values.



In this illustration, I start be pointing to the 1-6-6-6 group of digits in the upper corner – the upper end of the new Ark. I would not insist that the order of these cyclic digits is in any way important except that, among other possibilities, they include 616 and 666 sequences. These two numbers are known to be alternative for the so-called ‘number of the beast’ found at Revelation 13:18 in the Christian New Testament. In the context of the Genesis Seal, it matters more that the same four digits had occupied the corners of a now familiar central 3x3 cluster in the numerical G1 Square.
On the other hand, the present view of G3 reveals a horizontal 616 sequence that crosses through the same 3x3 zone that had contained a vertical 666 in G1.
It is also possible, from Figure 11, to make a more direct comparison between the new, upper Ark and the location that was one end of the Ark seen in G1. In the rightmost 3x3 corner zone, we noted above how two copies of the word he (she) occupy its diagonals. Referring to the same part of the new numeric view, we see that the same letters confer two copies of 511. This number has two important attributes, of which I shall address only one here. So, look now at the lower end of the upper Ark, to the position in which Figure 10 revealed the cyclic word for ‘the Ark’. This 3x3 zone also contains a 511, but crossing through a 512. The chief relationship between these two decimal numbers is that they have very distinctive forms in binary arithmetic. The first is 111111111₂, and the other is 1000000000₂. Taken together with the two copies of 511 in the lower Ark, it seems likely that this number in an inherent property in the essence of all biblical Arks. Note: This catch-all does not include the Ark of the biblical flood, which is an entirely different word in Hebrew.

Already, in this post, I have had occasion to refer to another 3x3 zone overlapping the centre of all square views of the Genesis Seal. In G1, three of its four corner elements held copies of the letter vav, in a prominent ‘V’ formation. In the G1 numerical view, these converted to three ‘6’ digits, augmented by a ‘1’ in the upper, fourth corner, again implying a relationship between 616 and 666. In the G2 Square, the same four elements were occupied by the letters of l’rechem (for a womb). Alternatively, the same letters can be understood to confer the two words: rechem (a womb) and lechem (bread) sharing two letters in common. In a particularly persistent example of the Principle of Reserved Locations, the same 3x3 group in the G3 Square (Figure 11) contains diagonals consisting of a horizontal 273 and a vertical 274. The significance of the first is that 273 is the gematria of the word arba (four) that now completely occupies the included 2x2 central cluster. The larger number is 2x137, where 137 is both the gematria of the word Kabbalah, and the stated ages of three biblical patriarchs at the time each of them died. And these are the only uses of the number 137, anywhere in the Judeo-Christian Bible.

To round out this post, I shall just point to one more special confluence of numbers in Figure 11, which should be compared with Figure 10. Near the top of Figure 11 is seen a vertical 611 that is crossed over by a horizontal 616 (this is the second case of a 616 in this square in noteworthy 3x3 groups). The smaller number is the gematria of Torah, while the other is the gematria of the definitive Ha Torah (The Torah). First, notice that the sum of the two related numbers is 1227, or the qatan sequence bequeathed by the word arba (four) that now occupies the very centre of this square. Equally important is the way in which one end of each number is locked into the Name YHWH (see Figure 10).

I have two especially important observations to make here. One is an appeal not to become hung up on the infamous number 666. In the Genesis Seal it has a completely different meaning to anything I have encountered elsewhere. The second is that all the features of the Genesis Seal described in this post are, of course, additional to those described in all previous, contributory posts.

 

[Kingfisher2926]

Testing the Genesis Seal

Right, here is what I plan to do. To save time - perhaps months - the first stage will not be as ambitious as my X-years work on Genesis 1:1-2. Instead, I shall start with what is the natural beginning in a project of this sort. I shall look only for the kind of superficial qualities of some sample texts, to see whether any of them exhibit the sort of 'clues' that made me want to look deeper in the case of the Genesis Seal. Regardless, of that stage, I shall look deeper anyway.
First, I shall select a few (say four) verses of the Torah that are widely separated. I suggest that verses of 28 letters will be an optimum size, without overtaxing my patience or stamina. If you prefer, I can provide a list of all Torah verses that consist of 28 letters and let you guys choose my sample for me. But I want to include any that may have immediate, superficial merit in case that is a hint from the author to dig deeper.
Next, I intend to skip the literary dimension and go straight to the numeric. The literary angle can be disproportionately time consuming (for me, anyway); yet there seems to be enough interesting numerical content in the Genesis Seal for that to be a worthwhile benchmark. In any case, if I post the formatted numerical data to this thread, I hope there will be some willing members who are able to help with the critical examination of the data, perhaps more than could undertake to analyse a Hebrew wordsearch square.

Any initial thoughts on my plan, so far?

 

[slingblade]

Any initial thoughts on my plan, so far?

Yeah.

What's this thing supposed to be for? Why do we need it, why do we need to see it, what does it do for people, what's the point, what's the purpose?

 

[Kingfisher2926]

Yeah.

What's this thing supposed to be for? Why do we need it, why do we need to see it, what does it do for people, what's the point, what's the purpose?

My friend, you can't have it both ways. The results of suitable tests may answer your questions, according to a number of erudite posters on this thread. If it goes one way, I disappear without trace; but if it goes the other way, it could change the world. I believe that might be an adequate purpose.

 

[slingblade]

My friend, you can't have it both ways.

Can't have what both ways?


Also, you and I don't know one another; we're not friends, and you seem far too woo for me to allow into my circle of friends. I'm picky.

The results of suitable tests may answer your questions

You don't have any idea what this genesis seal is for, or what it does, or its purpose?

according to a number of erudite posters on this thread. If it goes one way, I disappear without trace; but if it goes the other way, it could change the world. I believe that might be an adequate purpose.

Change the world in what way, specifically?

 

[JimBenArm]

Adaquate Porpoise? I thought it was a Genesis Sealion.

Now all we need is a St. Worts Whale and we'll have the complete collector's edition.

 

[Donn]

I think if KF starts to question his seal that can only be a good thing. It's the E in JREF.

Good on you KF. Take the advice given here and *really* try to *break* your findings. The harder you punch, and the longer they stand, the more worthy the victory.

 

[Marduk]

Any initial thoughts on my plan, so far?

yes, it has no control
if we say select 4 verses from your list and you then find the same with them as you did with your original text you will simply proclaim it supernatural, I expect you would even end up saying something like "at first there were no hits, but when I changed the arrangement (14 times), it suddenly went all supernatural again"

what you need is to include texts from other religions as well as secular texts and see if it works there as well, if so it would prove to be normal

I'm also not happy letting someone who is already suffering from confirmation bias do the testing, you can be included sure, but you need at least three testers, one who has no religious belief as a control, one like you who is a monotheist and one from a different religious background
and they are not to test the texts by their own choosing, the texts should be allocated at random

at the end of the day, this will simply prove what we know already and what you are unable to accept because of your emotional investment

 

[dafydd]

Change the world in what way, specifically?

In an unnoticeable way.