• Security incident: ISF was recently accessed by intruders. Please change your password, and change it anywhere else you used it. Read more

Ed The Fascism Checklist, Trump 2025

To not derail another thread.

The MAGA movement is clearly not fascist.

It is just hyper nationalist. And hyper Christian, with the clear and stated intent to turn a specific brand of Christiantiy into a state religion.
And banning 'decadent' art
And banning books
And focused on 'Family values' (That most of the proponents openly flaunt themselves)
And led by a single man, whose many incompetent errors are ignored or blamed on flunkies, while claiming to follow democracy.
And it has a clear cult of personality, putting Dear Leader's face and name on everything
And it has a focus on supposed masculinity, where that is expressed with being violent and in control.
And it has started a pointless, costly war that have no clear winner and or strategy
And has camps where 'criminals' can be dragged off to without any form of trial or even indication where they went
And these camps are fed by armed men, who hide their identities and who answer to no government agency.
And it is openly selling off the better parts of the country to their financial backers from various industries.
And it is involved in re-writing history to be heroic and 'winning', while erasing from history any figure going against the narrative.
And the leader is openly calling for fixed elections, because his opponents must have cheated to be winning.
And it is using vulnerable communities as scapegoats to distract the population from it's many failures.
And it is removing all non-loyal parts of the government and other parts of the state that should in theory check the government.


But they don't *call* themselves fascist, it's just pure coincidence Mussolini and Hitler and Franco (and Stalin) did all these things as well.
And pointing that out is really hurtful and might cause people to not be nice and obedient, so we should stop doing that.
But they did not really do all of those things. Mussolini and Hitler were openly hostile to the church and accepted them out of necessity. Franco was really a monarchist but he made common cause with the phalangists which were catholic fascists. And of course, a lot on that list is also true of various marxist and other non-fascist totalitarians. Which, really are all the same anyway so meh.

That being said, while Trump is too stupid and ignorant to be a fascist, there are certainly legit fascists among MAGA and what amounts to Catholic integralists(falangist by another name INHO), and his governance has been functionally indistinguishable from fascism. But at this point, it pointless and useless to keep pointing and yelling fascist.

But it doesn't really matter because the problem is fascist has been nothing but a slur since the end of WWII. Calling Trump a fascist also has a proven track record of accomplishing ◊◊◊◊ all.

Why is it so important that we label Trump a fascist?
 
Because history tells a lot about fascism, its beginnings, next steps, end, etc.
Otherwise we are moving in uncharted waters,
The same lesson it talks about all authoritarians.

Separate thought, it seems to me the most fascisty thing he's done is actually the golden share in US steel. It's still in private ownership and management but the state gets to stop or direct any major decisions. Want to close that factory, no, want to make that kind of steel, no, or yes. But that is something pretty different between fascism and other authoritarian ideologies.
 
Not all Authoritarians are Fascist, but all Fascists are Authoritarian. The numbered Trump actions posted so far are more a definition of Authoritarianism and not Fascism uniquely. Trump is clearly an Authoritarian and mostly a Fascist.

To be pedantic about it, any adequate definition of a the characteristics of a Fascist state must characterize Italy, Romania, Hungry, Austria, Spain and Greece in the run-up to and during World War II. These are the self-identified Fascist states. I would also include Nazi Germany, though is controversial among political scientists. A relevant definition would characterize post-World War II Fascist regimes that are widely recognized as Fascist: Franco’s Spain, Pinochet’s Chile, the military Juntas in Argentina and Brazil, Slobodan Milosevic’s Serbia, Guatemala, Honduras, Park’s South Korea, and Taiwan under the Kuomintang.

Fascist regimes had all or most of the following factors in common to greater or lesser degrees. A regime that maximizes all these factors would be completely Fascist. Other regimes can be partially Fascist.

1. Authoritarian. The state holds absolute power and demands ultimate loyalty. Dissent is treason. The state stokes fear and a sense of crisis to justify an obsession with security, crime, and punishment and an abandonment of human and civil rights. The military commands the lion’s share of the budget and the public’s adoration. Fascism often comes to power in a democratic system, but the Fascist contempt for democratic liberty soon corrupts the process and ends in dictatorship. [Trump is pushing for it, ICE is demanding it, and Hegseth is stocking the military with Trump loyalists, but we have not yet arrived at absolute power. See if Trump tries to overturn or reject the midterm results.]

2. Ultra-nationalist unity. Populists, trans-class revolutionary movement of a purifying national rebirth to overcome perceived degeneration/humiliation/victimhood, and political paralysis. Patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, and flags are ubiquitous. All self-identified Fascist states blended religion, specifically Christianity, with this nationalistic identity, but Christianity and perhaps religion itself does not seem to be Fascism’s aim. A transcendent, cleansing rebirth as a united national community is the aim. [What do you think "Make America Great Again" means?]

3. State-integrated economy. Nationalistic militants work in an uneasy collaboration with traditional corporate power elites. Labor unions are suppressed. Rampant cronyism and corruption is the natural end state. [We got there even before Trump. With Trump, he puts industry leaders in charge of government regulation of that industry. His regime is openly and extensively corrupt.]

4. Chauvinistic. Identifies an enemy as the source of the nation’s problems and focuses the national will on elimination of that scapegoat. Creates a social mythology that venerates one element of society while vilifying and dehumanizing another. Historically, the targets were racial, ethnic or religious minorities, liberals, communists, socialists, conservatives, and intellectuals. [Can you say immigrants, transsexuals, Muslims, intellectuals elites, "communists," and blacks?]

5. Elitist. Rejects equality as a goal, expresses contempt for the weak (but argues that anyone can be strong through will), and extols the manly virtues over feminine weakness. The nation is seen as chosen and deserving to dominate. Militarism and imperialism follow. [Attacks on DEI, contempt for the disabled, images of Trump as a mighty warrior, and open self-justifying imperialism.]

6. Irrational. Creates an emotional cult of will, vigor, unity, and purity. Action is taken for the sake of action. Sheer will can produce truth and the desired result. Intellectuals, the arts, and critical media are scorned as degenerates who bring the nation down by questioning nationalist myth. Lies, propaganda, newspeak, and violence are held to be a beautiful means to a glorious end. [Trump lies, takes action without thought of consequences, and endorses violence against his enemies. Consider the reflecting pool debacle as a metaphor. Incompetence is often confused with irrational, but one can be both incompetent and irrational, Trump being Exhibit A.]
 
1. Authoritarian. The state holds absolute power and demands ultimate loyalty. Dissent is treason. The state stokes fear and a sense of crisis to justify an obsession with security, crime, and punishment and an abandonment of human and civil rights. The military commands the lion’s share of the budget and the public’s adoration. Fascism often comes to power in a democratic system, but the Fascist contempt for democratic liberty soon corrupts the process and ends in dictatorship. [Trump is pushing for it, ICE is demanding it, and Hegseth is stocking the military with Trump loyalists, but we have not yet arrived at absolute power. See if Trump tries to overturn or reject the midterm results.]

this seems to be the only disqualifying point on your list. however you left out his first unsuccessful attempt to overturn the election in 2020
 

ISF - Join now!

Every member here is approved by hand. No bots, no spam, just people who care about evidence and honest debate.

Membership is free!

Create your free account

Back
Top Bottom