The conspirators thread, what happened ?

At the highest level, 9-11 was planned by a very small but influentional group with ties to The Project for the New American Century in order to realize U.S. hegemony as outlined in Zbigniew Brzezinski's "The Grand Chessboard: American Primacy and Its Geostrategic Imperatives." Al-Qaeda executed the plan with help from governmental agencies including the CIA and State Department (expediting student visas for the hijackers, stopping investigations by the FBI and DoD into the hijacker's activities before the event).
Why would high level officials put their own lives on the line?

Oh and more free stuff:

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/store.html
https://www.madcowprod.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=SFNT&Store_Code=MP
 
Why would high level officials put their own lives on the line?

Greed. Power. Patriotism.

Leaders of nations have been pursuing hegemony (by which I mean aggression or expansionism by large nations in an effort to achieve world domination) for as long as history has been recorded.
 
Here we go again

My point is that a lot of debunkers accuse CTs of profiting. That is mainly untrue as videos are distributed freely and a lot pump their own money into projects. I was suggesting that that you might want to target these people who really are just making money.

One of the things that absolutely blows my mind about the 9/11 Denial movement is just how incredibly hypocritical so many of them are.

jessicarabbit has just provided us with another sterling example, as I will explain.

In the quote above, she is defending Louder Than Words, makers of "Loose Change," against charges of profiteering on the events of Sept. 11th. Let's consider her other fine arguments:

Back that up with some figures or withdraw it. I want to see balance sheet and P+L
They need money to make films. Show me your figures on PROFIT or withdraw it.
In other words, Louder Than Words are possibly not profiteering because it's possible they don't make very much money. We don't know whether they turn a profit or not, but it's good enough for dear Jessica that we don't have access to their books. They deserve the benefit of the doubt, she says.

This is eye-popping, when you consider that she began this whole mudfight, with the following:

Did you know the phrase lets roll was papented on 20th september 2001?
(It wasn't, it was trademarked, as she later admitted)
By the way, the todd beamer foundation website was purchased on 12th Sept 2001. So grief stricken that the following day they are registering URLs

That's right, folks -- she started this little spat, by attacking the Todd Beamer Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicating to helping children cope with emotional trauma. (They have since changed their name to Heroic Choices.)

Let me spell this out for you, jessicarabbit, and I dearly hope your venom is based on a youthful naivete, rather than actual malice.

It doesn't matter whether Louder Than Words profits, or whether Heroic Choices profits, or which has a higher net income. Heroic Choices is a non-profit. Louder Than Words L.L.C. is a for-profit organization, that has items for sale. Dylan Avery could be losing his shirt for all I know, it makes no difference -- whether the guy is a good or bad businessman does not change his intent, and that intent is to run a business, for profit, based on the events of September 11th.

Heroic Choices is well within its rights to copyright and trademark as it needs to in order to remain effective. They don't want to be ripped off by some yahoo exploiting their intellectual property. Just like the Salvation Army, Easter Seals, or even the Red Cross would be fully justified in suing you if you used their name, symbols, and trademarks to hock your own wares.

Now, having exposed your hypocrisy, let me discuss the matter of profit. Profit is not inherently a bad thing. I am a firm believer in the right of mankind to earn a decent living. But the key word is earn.

Consider two filmmakers. One, the Naudet Brothers. Another, the Louder Than Words crew again. The Naudet Brothers are also profiting from their movie, "9/11 A Documentary," and I don't criticize them in the least. They worked hard to produce their documentary. They were at significant personal risk to film it. They were also in the right place at the right time -- "lucky," I guess some would say -- but bully for them.

In contrast, we have Louder Than Words, who in previous versions of their film ripped off the Naudets. They produce a "documentary" that blatantly steals footage from others without first purchasing the rights. Their movie is so full of holes that they have admitted "errors were left in intentionally." What right do they have to profit?

Well, if Dylan Avery et. al. hadn't ripped off other filmmakers, and they'd presented their work as originally intended -- as a work of fiction -- I'd leave them alone. I might find it in bad taste, perhaps, but I would acknowledge their right to profit from their work. However, they did neither. They seek not only to profit by libeling thousands, accusing them baselessly of complicity in crimes, but also through theft of intellectual property.

As I stated at the outset, the hypocrisy omnipresent in your "movement" is utterly flabbergasting. Thus far, you have taken sides with them, by your pathetic slander of the Todd Beamer Foundation.

Think about your choices, jessicarabbit. If you continue on this road, someday you will be profoundly ashamed of them.
 
One of the things that absolutely blows my mind about the 9/11 Denial movement is just how incredibly hypocritical so many of them are.

jessicarabbit has just provided us with another sterling example, as I will explain.

In the quote above, she is defending Louder Than Words, makers of "Loose Change," against charges of profiteering on the events of Sept. 11th. Let's consider her other fine arguments:


In other words, Louder Than Words are possibly not profiteering because it's possible they don't make very much money. We don't know whether they turn a profit or not, but it's good enough for dear Jessica that we don't have access to their books. They deserve the benefit of the doubt, she says.

This is eye-popping, when you consider that she began this whole mudfight, with the following:

(It wasn't, it was trademarked, as she later admitted)


That's right, folks -- she started this little spat, by attacking the Todd Beamer Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicating to helping children cope with emotional trauma. (They have since changed their name to Heroic Choices.)

Let me spell this out for you, jessicarabbit, and I dearly hope your venom is based on a youthful naivete, rather than actual malice.

It doesn't matter whether Louder Than Words profits, or whether Heroic Choices profits, or which has a higher net income. Heroic Choices is a non-profit. Louder Than Words L.L.C. is a for-profit organization, that has items for sale. Dylan Avery could be losing his shirt for all I know, it makes no difference -- whether the guy is a good or bad businessman does not change his intent, and that intent is to run a business, for profit, based on the events of September 11th.

Heroic Choices is well within its rights to copyright and trademark as it needs to in order to remain effective. They don't want to be ripped off by some yahoo exploiting their intellectual property. Just like the Salvation Army, Easter Seals, or even the Red Cross would be fully justified in suing you if you used their name, symbols, and trademarks to hock your own wares.

Now, having exposed your hypocrisy, let me discuss the matter of profit. Profit is not inherently a bad thing. I am a firm believer in the right of mankind to earn a decent living. But the key word is earn.

Consider two filmmakers. One, the Naudet Brothers. Another, the Louder Than Words crew again. The Naudet Brothers are also profiting from their movie, "9/11 A Documentary," and I don't criticize them in the least. They worked hard to produce their documentary. They were at significant personal risk to film it. They were also in the right place at the right time -- "lucky," I guess some would say -- but bully for them.

In contrast, we have Louder Than Words, who in previous versions of their film ripped off the Naudets. They produce a "documentary" that blatantly steals footage from others without first purchasing the rights. Their movie is so full of holes that they have admitted "errors were left in intentionally." What right do they have to profit?

Well, if Dylan Avery et. al. hadn't ripped off other filmmakers, and they'd presented their work as originally intended -- as a work of fiction -- I'd leave them alone. I might find it in bad taste, perhaps, but I would acknowledge their right to profit from their work. However, they did neither. They seek not only to profit by libeling thousands, accusing them baselessly of complicity in crimes, but also through theft of intellectual property.

As I stated at the outset, the hypocrisy omnipresent in your "movement" is utterly flabbergasting. Thus far, you have taken sides with them, by your pathetic slander of the Todd Beamer Foundation.

Think about your choices, jessicarabbit. If you continue on this road, someday you will be profoundly ashamed of them.

As usual you misrepresent me. I am not disparaging heroic choices. The profit element came in when people mentioned that some people just buy up URLs in an attempt to sell the later for profit.

Every statement I have made on this site has been consistently twisted, spun, misrepresented and strawmanned. I can only assume that means you don't like the truth contained within them.
 
As usual you misrepresent me. I am not disparaging heroic choices. The profit element came in when people mentioned that some people just buy up URLs in an attempt to sell the later for profit.
Lady, assuming you are a lady, you called them out by name. I quoted you accurately and in context. You are a liar.
Every statement I have made on this site has been consistently twisted, spun, misrepresented and strawmanned. I can only assume that means you don't like the truth contained within them.
That's two more statements you've made without basis.

If that's the best you can do for defense, then I believe I'm done with you.
 
Lady, assuming you are a lady, you called them out by name. I quoted you accurately and in context. You are a liar.

That's two more statements you've made without basis.

If that's the best you can do for defense, then I believe I'm done with you.

Bye bye then.
 
As usual you misrepresent me. I am not disparaging heroic choices. The profit element came in when people mentioned that some people just buy up URLs in an attempt to sell the later for profit.

Every statement I have made on this site has been consistently twisted, spun, misrepresented and strawmanned. I can only assume that means you don't like the truth contained within them.
What was your intent when you drew attention to the fact that Todd Beamer's widow started a charity called the Todd Beamer Foundation shortly after his death? How has this post:
By the way, the todd beamer foundation website was purchased on 12th Sept 2001. So grief stricken that the following day they are registering URLs
been twisted, spun or misrepresented?
 
Sometime before 9/11....

from george washington's blog said:
Dick Cheney was apparently in charge of the entire U.S. government's counter-terrorism program prior to 9/11, and in charge of ALL 5 of the war games which occurred on 9/11, and Mr. Cheney also coordinated the government's "response" to the attacks. Being in charge of all counter-terrorism in the U.S., Cheney was probably the person who moved up major war games so that they would overlap with games and terror drills already planned for 9/11.

In addition, a former Los Angeles police department investigator, whose newsletter is read by 45 members of congress, both the house and senate intelligence committees, and professors at more than 40 universities around the world, claims that Cheney was in charge of the entire military and the secret service during the 9/11 attacks, that the secret service has its own communications system which is parallel to and can even cut into normal military communication channels.
 
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WTC7 housed several government agencies, such as secret service, CIA, IRS, SEC. I could list so many possibilities for the reason it was deliberately brought down with explosives. SEC office held approx. 4000 documents of scandals, illegalities, bankrupties, by major companies at wall street. SEC was conducting 45 different investigations into several major companies and it's officials at the time of the wtc7 collapse. Everything had been destroyed.
 
I could list so many possibilities for the reason it was deliberately brought down with explosives.
Why don't you start by explaining, in as much detail as possible, one possibility?

294, geggy! Get your acceptance speech ready!
 
What was your intent when you drew attention to the fact that Todd Beamer's widow started a charity called the Todd Beamer Foundation shortly after his death? How has this post:been twisted, spun or misrepresented?
By the way, it's important to point out again that Ms. rabbit, in her haste to make accusations against a victim of 9/11, go her facts wrong:
Arkan Wolfshade:
1) It was not registered on Sept. 12

Domain Name: TODDBEAMER.COM
Registrar: ENOM, INC.
Whois Server: whois.enom.com
Referral URL: http://www.enom.com
Name Server: DNS3.NAME-SERVICES.COM
Name Server: DNS2.NAME-SERVICES.COM
Name Server: DNS1.NAME-SERVICES.COM
Name Server: DNS5.NAME-SERVICES.COM
Name Server: DNS4.NAME-SERVICES.COM
Status: REGISTRAR-LOCK
EPP Status: clientDeleteProhibited
EPP Status: clientUpdateProhibited
EPP Status: clientTransferProhibited
Updated Date: 14-Aug-2006
Creation Date: 16-Sep-2001
Expiration Date: 16-Sep-2007

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2054023&postcount=61
 
Why don't you start by explaining, in as much detail as possible, one possibility?

Meh I'm not going to start arguing with you about the collapsing of wtc7. We'll just end up going into circles.

By the way how is the notion of wtc7 coming down with explosives absurd? Nothing has been made official so anything we say about the reason for it falling down would be hypothetical. So you have your hypothesis of why it fell and I have mine. Lets leave it at that.
 
jessicarabbit:
1: What are your academic credentials?
2: Where are the forensics lab affidavits regarding that video you mentioned on the other thread?
3: What makes you sure that the explosion in that video is a demolitions charge?
4: Where are the unedited version of the video you mentioned on the other thread, preferably with in picture source TC?
5: Why are you lowing the bar when it comes to demands of quality when it comes to yourself?
6: What evidence do you have of steel being stolen from GZ?
7: Did you report the mentioned theft to the proper places?
 
Every statement I have made on this site has been consistently twisted, spun, misrepresented and strawmanned. I can only assume that means you don't like the truth contained within them.

"Strawmanned"?

Taking a noun and verbifying it like that is just intolerable. People with learning are upsetified.
 
Greed. Power. Patriotism.

Leaders of nations have been pursuing hegemony (by which I mean aggression or expansionism by large nations in an effort to achieve world domination) for as long as history has been recorded.
Dude, get real. No one is going to put their lives on the line to pursue US hegemony. Because a) it was generally already achieved after the cold war and b) most people are cowards. It is an awful motive.
WTC7 housed several government agencies, such as secret service, CIA, IRS, SEC. I could list so many possibilities for the reason it was deliberately brought down with explosives.
Go ahead. Did the CIA want to destroy their own offices? That does not make sense. Or were the 9/11 attacks a plot by wallstreet business men? lol
SEC office held approx. 4000 documents of scandals, illegalities, bankrupties, by major companies at wall street. SEC was conducting 45 different investigations into several major companies and it's officials at the time of the wtc7 collapse. Everything had been destroyed.
Get your facts straight. The EOCC lost documents from 45 investigations, the SEC lost files on 300 investigations. And not everyone is so sure that everything had been destroyed:
SEC & EEOC:
Attack Delays Investigations


By Margaret Cronin Fisk
National Law Journal
September 17, 2001

Additional details emerged Friday about the effect of the collapse of 7 World Trade Center on investigations being conducted by the New York offices of the Securities and Exchange Commission and the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, both of which were housed in the building.

The SEC has not quantified the number of active cases in which substantial files were destroyed. Reuters news service and the Los Angeles Times published reports estimating them at 3,000 to 4,000. They include the agency's major inquiry into the manner in which investment banks divvied up hot shares of initial public offerings during the high-tech boom.

The EEOC said documents from about 45 active cases were missing and could not be easily retrieved from any backup system. One of these cases was a sexual harassment charge filed on Sept. 10 against Morgan Stanley, one of the prime corporate victims of the World Trade Center disaster.

A statement from the commission said that "we are confident that we will not lose any significant investigation or case as a result of the loss of our building in New York. No one whom we have sued or whose conduct we have been investigating should doubt our resolve to continue our pursuit of justice in every such matters."

But the short-term problems will be immense, said Gregory Joseph of New York's Law Offices of Gregory Joseph.

"Court papers can largely be reconstituted, but work product has to be reconstructed," he said. "This will cause delays in court and will require significant reduplication of effort." Some data, he added, "won't be recreatable."

"Ongoing investigations at the New York SEC will be dramatically affected because so much of their work is paper-intensive," said Max Berger of New York's Bernstein Litowitz Berger & Grossmann. "This is a disaster for these cases."

"The SEC will have some difficulty, but the bounce-back will come relatively easily," predicts Harvey Goldschmid, Dwight professor of law at Columbia University and former general counsel of the SEC. "It will throw things off for a period of time, but most of what's important can be regained. They will have to reconstruct these documents. But most of this was backed up or in Washington. They've lost some transcripts but even they're available."

EEOC Records Destroyed

The EEOC's New York office, which was housed in 7 World Trade Center, sustained no loss of life. But all the agency's records were destroyed.

Many of the files are backed up in the computer system, but a substantial number of documents are simply gone, said Spencer Lewis, the EEOC district director. Depositions and notes were not scanned into computers and are lost. With depositions and interviews, the agency will be contacting court reporters "and hoping that they've got them so we can reconstruct files," Lewis said. This covers about 45 active cases, including a recent action against Morgan Stanley.

But employment litigators believe the effect here, too, will be transitory.

"The EEOC is decimated as far as office space goes," but any problems are "only short-term," said Michael Weber of the New York office of Littler Mendelson. "They will get back to business." The agencies will be seeking documents from the private law firms and defendants, Weber notes. "My sense is that we will cooperate," he noted. "Our goal is not to take advantage of this catastrophe."

"A lot of their records they'll have online, so they'll just reprint them out," adds Harkins. "The EEOC is in a better position than the SEC, because the SEC has a lot more confidential files."
http://www.nylawyer.com/login.php?source=/news/01/09/091701e
""Clearly what happened was a severe blow," Wayne Carlin, the SEC’s Northeast regional director, told the Washington Post. "It will slow us down, and we will need some amount of time to recover."

The office, which enforces SEC regulations, lost files on about 300 pending investigations, including a major inquiry into the manner in which investment banks divvied up hot shares of initial public offerings during the high-tech boom.

Mr. Carlin said there were no plans to drop any pending matters. "We lost a lot of stuff, though some of it is reconstructible," he said. "Anybody who is under our investigation would be making a mistake if they thought they were in the clear."

The SEC will probably be able to get new copies of documents from the parties that turned them over initially, Mr. Carlin said.

Barry Barbash, a partner with the New York and Washington, D.C. offices of Shearman & Sterling and former director of the division of investment management at the SEC, said that most of the securities firms have back-up systems.

"It’s really the [SEC’s] internally generated notes and correspondence that will prove most problematic," Mr. Barbash said. "

http://www.nylawyer.com/login.php?source=/news/01/09/091401b
The consensus seems to be that although the investigations were hindered, the cases were not all lost.

Oh and by the way, have you contacted the SEC with your irrefutable evidence about the big 9/11 conspiracy? I'm sure they would be interested to hear their building was destroyed not by Al Qaeda but by the companies they were investigating. They would make one heck of an ally for you guys, no?
 
Dick Cheney was apparently in charge of the entire U.S. government's counter-terrorism program prior to 9/11, and in charge of ALL 5 of the war games which occurred on 9/11, and Mr. Cheney also coordinated the government's "response" to the attacks. Being in charge of all counter-terrorism in the U.S., Cheney was probably the person who moved up major war games so that they would overlap with games and terror drills already planned for 9/11.

In addition, a former Los Angeles police department investigator, whose newsletter is read by 45 members of congress, both the house and senate intelligence committees, and professors at more than 40 universities around the world, claims that Cheney was in charge of the entire military and the secret service during the 9/11 attacks, that the secret service has its own communications system which is parallel to and can even cut into normal military communication channels.
Cheney in charge of the ENTIRE U.S. government's counter-terrorism program, five wargames (I'd like to see how this figure was reached), the ENTIRE military AND the secret service.

No wonder that poor bloke is a walking corpse.

Give credible sources or shut the hell up, please.
 

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