The 9/11 Conspiracy Facts

99.9% wouldn't. But still, a few addressed it. The paper below has been up on the ImplosionWorld website for some time.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=r...B-mGLS4OM6lRft0_A&sig2=A5QZE4U1LBymdi8tlhaslg

Thanks, I was thinking of that paper but couldn't remember where I'd seen it.

My point to Rev was that if CD experts agree with the OT, there's not going to be any expectation for them to "come forward" about it...because it's the norm. Kind of like straight kids don't usually need to sit down with their parents and say "mom, dad....I'm heterosexual".
 
Bachmann and Schneider did say "upmost probability". The fact is that very few explosives experts have given their opinion either way. It's wrong to claim that only 3 believe in demolition because they haven't all been asked.

Hugo Bachmann and Jörg Schneider, both of the Swiss Federal Institute of Technology, believe that building 7 was intentionally demolished based on video footage. Whether they say upmost probability or looks like it, doesn't make it so.
Chemistry has proven here that WTC's 1 & 2 were not controlled demolition. But, we'll wait and see what the report says about WTC 7.
 
Pedantic interjection - it's 'utmost', not 'upmost'.

'Upmost' isn't even a word!
 
Thanks, I was thinking of that paper but couldn't remember where I'd seen it.

My point to Rev was that if CD experts agree with the OT, there's not going to be any expectation for them to "come forward" about it...because it's the norm. Kind of like straight kids don't usually need to sit down with their parents and say "mom, dad....I'm heterosexual".

Great analogy.
:)
 
Save an old guy the trouble and please post with the links.

Brackets and bolding mine:

"In my opinion the building WTC 7 [610 feet tall, 47 stories, and not hit by an airplane] was, with great probability, professionally demolished," says Hugo Bachmann, Emeritus ETH [Swiss Federal Institute of Technology] - Professor of Structural Analysis and Construction. And also Jörg Schneider, likewise emeritus ETH - Professor of Structural Analysis and Construction, interprets the few available video recordings as evidence that "the building WTC 7 was with great probability demolished."
http://patriotsquestion911.com/professors.html

As nicepants noted on another forum, by using the phrase (idiom? Inside joke) "with great probability" they leave the door wide open to other possibilities.

Thanks, I was thinking of that paper but couldn't remember where I'd seen it.

My point to Rev was that if CD experts agree with the OT, there's not going to be any expectation for them to "come forward" about it...because it's the norm. Kind of like straight kids don't usually need to sit down with their parents and say "mom, dad....I'm heterosexual".

:D I found myself in that situation years ago when my dad overheard me telling a friend on the phone how the previous night I'd stumbled (figuratively) into a lesbian bar and what a great time I had.

Next thing I knew I found myself having that very same conversation with my parents.
 
Thanks, I was thinking of that paper but couldn't remember where I'd seen it.

My point to Rev was that if CD experts agree with the OT, there's not going to be any expectation for them to "come forward" about it...

Agree completely. His question is beyond obtuse.
 
mjd1982, are you ever going to present some "conspiracy facts"? or is conjecture, speculation, misinterpretation of documents that have nothing to do with 9/11, etc etc all you have?

Do you know what facts are? Do you know what evidence is? Don't even bother answering, it's obvious to all here that you do not.
So for the moment, you are deeming that the PNAC doc is not a fact. This is fine, it is what is to be expected of your ilk.

Further, you are implying that inference is inadmissible to debate. Since this is not something that any serious adult would ever state, we can all conclude that you, and anyone who agrees with you, is not a serious adult.
 
Of course he's not going to present facts. He's had ample opportunity to do so, but has failed.

When given numbers (on military spending, for example), he dismisses them as irrelevant. The facts are inconvenient to his speculation.
As above, for the 1st line.

For the 2nd, if you wish to debate why such are relevant, which has been illustrated conclusively why not by me, then you can go ahead.

If you cant you will obviously state ~"You're wrong", which is a tendency shared by all of your colleagues in your pathetic attempts at challenge.
 
You really, really need to work on your reading comprehension. You're confusing the concepts "judgemental" and "offensive". Of course the term "rag heads" is offensive. Your "Chinese motorcycle" comment is judgemental, but possibly less offensive to the people you've insulted because it's got less history to it; not being Chinese, I can't be certain of that.

In any case, you're avoiding the point. You have used a racist insult to make a point, while berating others for using racist insults to make a point. Everything you say to attempt to excuse yourself simply makes your own hypocrisy more evident.

Dave
Oh boy...

Normally I tell people to read my posts before they respond to them. In your case, read your own posts before you post them. You state that I have said something that is an "insult", yet you cannot be "certain" that it was "offensive".

Of course, anyone who would even dream of comparing "rag heads" with a comment on "chinese motorcycles", is someone who has no inclination to serious dialogue, nor indeed much respect for his own comments. I note quite interestingly that I am alone in denouncing DR's unquestionable, disgusting bigotry.

What an honest bunch of fellas you guys appear to be.
 
mjd1982,

Ok, for the sake of understanding your position, let me see if I have your theory correct.

ok

The NWO folks write up documents explaining what they want to do and make them public.

Who the f*** are the NWO?

(Would it make more sense to keep it a secret so no one would be able to figure out their plans and make the connections *IF* what you think the documents are saying were true?)

Woah woah woah.

This is a policy document from a think tank. These get made public. It is of little use if such a document does not get published.

2ndly, for you to make the assertion that if my points are true, then they wouldnt have published it, is, I'm afraid. as absurd as it sounds. To state that they wouldnt have said what they said, therefore they didnt say it, is pretty ludicrous, I'm afraid.

Moreover, as I have said many times here, 911 was as bungled and blatant an inside job as could conceivably be achieved. The public statement that a new PH would be propitous to policy, 12 mths b4hand, is a prime example of such.

After they set the plan,

which isnt proved by the document...

they stage 9/11 to fit with the document, that what they wanted would be too slow a process unless a '9/11 event' were to take place. (Speaking on how you're reading it, obviously))
And they go to war with Iraq more for the RAD document than the PNAC, but the PNAC stuff comes later.
Am I about right in all that?

Not quite.

The PNAC doc illustrates that a 911 style event would be propitious to policy, their openly stated centre point of policy- agressive military radicalisation aimed at entrenching US hegemony throughout the 21st century, involving control of strategic resources, militarisaton of space etc.

Now, since there are plenty of people who wish to inflct a new PH on the US, there was no shortage of suitors. 1st, 2nd and 3rd on the list was AQ. Thus, when Bush comes to power, having been warned of the "urgent and deadly threat" he will face from AQ throughout the next 4 yrs by Clarke and Berger, upon getting handed a doc from Clarke entitled "How to eliminate the threat of AQ", he demotes him, ensuring that the Principals never have to hear from him for the next 4 mths. This is because an AQ attack has been deemed propitious to policy. He also gets reports, 1 in every 4 PDB's, warning him of the threat that OBL is posing to the US. 40 times (every time) he does nothing, since he knows that an AQ attack is propitious to policy. Moreover, he gets offers from the Taliban for the disposal of OBL, but he refuses, for the reasons mentioned above. And moreover, the warnings came in thick and fast to the inte community, on an "unprecedented level", according to Tenet, but nothing was executed by the WH, since such an attack was deemed propitous to policy. And I could go on.

But I have another question. Now, do you think it is possible that you are reading into the documents what you want to see rather than what is really there?
If you already have made up your mind, then could it be possible that you want to read the document a certain way so it will fit with what you already believe?

A simple answer would be no.

A longer answer would be that if this is something you actually believe, you can debate it with me, maybe with refernece to #493, and the notion of in this context faster=easier, as I have stated before.

Or finally, the answer that I have no need nor inclination to need to read such into the document, since the idea that the US government is not complict in killing 3000 people is not an unpalatable truth for me. I would be quite happy for this not to be the case. However, that such could be the case is an unpalatable truth; so if you are going to argue based on that propensity, you will have to realise that the boot is very much on the other foot.
 
You mean the unconfirmed middle man that was only reported in the far less than credible sources? Nope, not evidence.

Ok good. So you state that the testimony of the middle man tasked with dealing with the disposal of OBL between the US and the Taliban, is "not evidence" when investigating the dealings with the disposal of OBL between the US and the Taliban.

You clesrly have zero inclination for honest debate, as we have already ascertained.
 
Talk about a liar. This statement:goes completely against what you claim. This statement shows that any link you claim between the RAD and Iraq is completely false and you know this. Yet you continue to repeat the blatantly false claim.
Hilarious. The statement is that the importance of Iraq transcends the issue of Saddam. Hence US interests there are not limited to the threat posed to the US, or to US interests, by Saddam. Hence when he is gone, US interests still persist. This will explain a lot of contemporary events for you.

When I pointed out that others had respond, your answer was:Which is of course, a lie. Again. These are just 2 examples of your dishonesty and extreme hypocrisy. The responses to #95 start at #96 and continue sporadically throughout the rest of the thread. So it's not the "secret" that you claim which is another dishonest statement that you have posted. And now you don't even have the courage to respond "sensibly" to my WTC7 argument. Instead, you rely on infantile digs and insults in order to regain control of the "debate."

You getting a tad hysterical now; dont worry- you are not alone in being miles out of your depth here. When I state that no one has responded to the post, it should be implied, to serious people, that this means sensible responses. Of course, someone could reply to the post "blablabla"- this would not constitute, to serious people, a response. Hence my point, about the lack of responses, and about your lack of seriousness in response.
 
Wow. You are waaaaay far gone.

A power disruption of the sort alleged by Scott Forbes is completely impossible for quite a few reasons. YOU CAN'T JUST SHUT DOWN THE POWER IN HIGH-RISE OFFICE TOWERS IN NYC. PERIOD. It's a practical impossibility.

Well no, since as Rodriguez says, it happened every year.

Abd before you get hysterical about Rodriguez, he could have stated that such never happened, if he really wanted to lie to exacerbate the story. He went against it, and so what he says has credence.

First, under no circumstances would it ever be necessary. Second, the tenants would sue the **** out of the building owner if it ever did happen. If Forbes' fairy tale were true, the uproar would have been huge.

as above

People in New York, and particularly people in finance, work long hours and frequently on weekends. Given the dozens of tenants and thousands of workers who would have been directly impacted by such a "power down", it's inconceivable that nobody else would have mentioned it.

The reason why Forbes didnt die on 911 was because he had to stay working on Monday on a project which would have otherwise have been finished on the weekend, hence he had a day off.

The reasons why few people have been inclined to talk about it, have been related in my prior post to you. Slanderous attacks are one such facet. I will tell you again- I have met the man, spent 1/2 hour chatting to him, he is incredibly self effacing, modest and quiet- hence why he hasnt been going round making a huge deal about it. The notion that he is lying, is inconceivable, in addition due to the fact that he would have been fired by his firm if he had been lying, You should maybe consider that.

His claim is completely and utterly absurd, as is any argument defending it. Particularly an argument that points to intimidation and fear of retribution to explain the resounding silence from the many others who must have known about the power down. This seems to be a truther catchall. Any lack of witnesses and/or witnesses that refute your drivel can be explained away as compliance through either intimidation, greed or just good 'ole fashioned callousness. Of course the real beauty of such an argument, for you, is that it ends the debate. Obtuse as it is, the only real proof against it is just a wee bit of common sense.

No, I'm afraid that such an argument is a perfectly accurate statement of what the status quo would be following such an instance. And we have many examples- Rodriguez (which I am going to come onto next) has many witnesses who corroborate his testimony, but surely he should have hundreds- people are disinclined to come forward for the reasons I have mentioned. Ditto Ben Fountain. Ditto Craig Bartmer. Ditto Indira Singh. Ditto Kevin Mcpadden. etc etc. Either all these people are all liars (i.e. everyone who disagrees with you), or people are worried that if they intimate that the US government killed 3000 of its own people, they might get into problems. I think the choice is a simple one, for honest people.
 
I decided to take your advice and re-read the article. It turns out that the liar with zero regard for the truth is you.
So Bush didn't give it any credence either. There's more.

Remember, Cheney's Dec. 9, 2001 comments were based on: Either way, the real reason for Cheney's Atta-Iraq connection was to show Iraq's link to terrorism, not 9/11.
Next time, pay attention to the time line. The Iraq-terrorism link was always a minor reason for the invasion. The WMD's issue was the main reason which had nothing to do with the WOT. The 9/11 link had started to be pushed after the fact that no WMD's were found in Iraq.
Cheney came out and said that Iraq was linked to 911. Hence he made the link between Iraq and 911. End of story.
 

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