Terri Schiavo

[Prospero]

I'm personally disgusted with Jeb for clearly exceeding the role of his position. He pushed and passed a bill that allowed him personally to on behalf of his own beliefs in a single situation that was extremely time-sensitive. To me, that just seems like a huge abuse of power. I've been following this story for years and was relieved when they finally removed the feeding tube. Having met the husband, I can tell you that he's now an emotional wreck and that it would have been easier for him to give up years ago. It's sad how devoted he still is to his wife's wishes and how confused he is as to why her parents are prolonging what he believes is her suffering.

 

[Brown]

A recent version of the story includes some disturbing religious remarks.

"It's restored my belief in God," said Schiavo's father, Bob Schindler.
...
Suzanne Carr, the woman's sister, called lawmakers' action "a miracle, an absolute miracle."
...
"I hope, I really do hope we've done the right thing," said Senate President Jim King, a Republican. "I keep on thinking 'What if Terri didn't really want this done at all?' May God have mercy on all of us."

 

[peptoabysmal]

Imagine for a minute that the tube re-insertion was ordered by Howard Dean. Would you have just as strong an objection?

I haven't been able to find anywhere that there were any witnesses or legal documents to support Terry's husband's contention that it was Terry's wish to die under these circumstances. I am starting to side with Terry's parents on this issue. What is the harm in letting Terry live a bit longer, other than her hubby won't get his check as soon?

 

[Denise]

So now the Florida legislature has (probably unconstitutionally) authorized Jeb Bush to override the decision of the courts ( ) and have doctors reinsert the feeding tube.

Thirteen years like this already! And all the doctors who testified in court agreed that she is living in a persistent vegetative state with no chance of recovery.

That is not true. Some doctors have testified in court that she is not in a PVS.

 

[Brian]

Will you still be glad the tube was reinserted if Terri Schiavo is even more dependent on life-maintaining measures than she was before it was removed?

I should have tried to be more clear. I'm glad they put the tube back in so that they have time to find out who's lying.
I don't know who to believe.
They need to get an unbiased, profesional opinion from a few specialists who have no stake in it whatsoever, about what condition the woman is in. And then apply the law to her situation.

 

[Tmy]

Its silly that its illegal to have doctor assisted sucide but its ok to let her starve to death???? Think of all the wasted resources going into keeping her alive.

 

[Hexxenhammer]

A recent version of the story includes some disturbing religious remarks.

I just heard these quotes on NPR. Ugh. It would be a miracle if an angel came down and cured her, a govenor passing a law is not a miracle.

 

[Hexxenhammer]

Imagine for a minute that the tube re-insertion was ordered by Howard Dean. Would you have just as strong an objection?

I haven't been able to find anywhere that there were any witnesses or legal documents to support Terry's husband's contention that it was Terry's wish to die under these circumstances. I am starting to side with Terry's parents on this issue. What is the harm in letting Terry live a bit longer, other than her hubby won't get his check as soon?

Personally, I would. Gore and Lieberman were jerks for condoning censorship and Jeb is abusing his power here to gather support from right-wing christians.

 

[Tmy]

Why is the husband being so vilified. Its it cause he has a girlfriend. SO what, his wife has be all but dead for years. I also dont see how he can make money out of her death. Hes being portrayed like hes Scott Peterson. maybe he does care enough about her to put her misery and the parents are being selfish by wanting to keep her alive.

 

[Flame]

...but if I were in that condition like Terri Schiavo, I'd be extremely grateful if my husband had the strength to say, "No more" on my behalf.
That's the whole issue here I think. That is how you would feel, but we don't know how Terri feels.

Remember that it is not a unanimous decision that she is in a PVS.
****

"I hope, I really do hope we've done the right thing," said Senate President Jim King, a Republican. "I keep on thinking 'What if Terri didn't really want this done at all?' May God have mercy on all of us."



Whatever about the god bit, I do agree that if the husband isn't lying about what Terri would have wanted in this situation it's terrible.

As a previous poster said, this is a tragedy no matter what the real feelings of Terri are.

 

[tamiO]

The whole thing is crazy. So much was not done for this woman from the beginning.

A new born child cannot feed itself or really interact with the environment. Supposedly gas makes a new born smile. It grasps a finger as a reflex.

There is ample evidence that people can be unresponsive, but alive and well inside . It is inhumane to cause pain to another being.


Without any evidence of a living will, she should be kept alive and comfortable.

 

[Tmy]

Without any evidence of a living will, she should be kept alive and comfortable.

I would guess that most people would not want to live in such a state. So shoudlnt the default be to kill her unless there was evidence that shed want to live as a veg. What good does it do to have her linger on like this. What amount of $$ and resources are being wasted. We treat the family pets with more compassion when they are terminal and such.

 

[shemp]

ABCNews Quote of the Day:

"We are just ecstatic … It's restored my belief in God."

— Terri Schiavo’s father, Bob Schindler, speaking after Florida Gov. Jeb Bush told him he would issue an order to restore Schindler's brain-damaged daughter's feeding tube.

Well, I'm so glad that "God" has decided to restore her feeding tube, thereby prolonging her agony and delaying her entrance into heaven. You'd think the least He could do is heal her completely!

 

[TillEulenspiegel]

I know people who are terminal ( ain't we all?) all have a living will, that is the problem in this case, Terri had none. The first set of paperwork you must slog through in Florida during admissions at hospitals is a living will or an acknowledgement of the lack of one. Unfortunately that is not the case here.

The thing that pisses me off about this whole circus is that the right to life and the death with dignity folks all have glommed onto Terri as a cause celebrity' and the whole human tragedy gets shoved by the wayside.
I heard a woman , who did not know either party, who came to Florida from California and descried Mr. Shivo's lack of humanity. "he's just tired of caring for her and thats no excuse to murder her". How dare she. How dare the legislature try to usurp the individuals rights. That we have a right to life is a given both by constitutional edict and by precedent, that we (or the government )have the power to ordain the moment of a free persons death is absurd and counter to one of the most personal of all liberties.

 

[Jocko]

I don't know if this bill will be ruled constitutional, but it certainly buys some time. She can swallow, but it's not known if she can swallow food. The vote wasn't even close.

I'm no doctor, but fer chrissakes if the woman can swallow, how vegetative can she be? I don't think Christopher Reeve can swallow and no one's trying to pull his plug, are they?

 

[Jocko]

A recent version of the story includes some disturbing religious remarks.

It strikes me as a bit callous to cast religiously-themed comments by family members as "disturbing." Who wouldn't get a tad spiritual if a loved one was in that situation?

It's said that there are no athiests in the foxholes, and these poor folks are in one nasty emotional foxhole right now.

 

[Clancie]

Felos said that on Tuesday, Terri was showing signs of massive organ failure and that the reinsertion of the tube is just prolonging her death. He said he did not know her condition Wednesday.

"She was literally absconded from her death bed in the middle of her dying process," he told ABC's "Good Morning America."

That is brutal.

 

[tamiO]

I would guess that most people would not want to live in such a state.

Do you think she is in pain?

I think she might be now. I have seen what a few days of dehydration and food deprivation can do. It's not pretty. She might come back from it though.

In a semi conscious state, the touch of people who love you can really go a long ways towards comfort and bringing you around. It's almost a dream state. Better to have good dreams than bad ones.

There is enough doubt surrounding the husband's motives that his motives should be removed. There should be no monetary rewards or punishments that result from her death.

Since her food tube has been reinserted to grant her life, than half an effort will not do.

Now she should receive the best care possible from the best doctors who are positive of her ability to respond to physical and emotional therapy.

I bet there are third parties who would happily agree to donate all the services necesary to keep her alive, comfortable and in intensive therapy.

At least work on a method of communication with her so she can say yes or no. Is there a doctor who believes this is possible?

What do people who have been in a semi-conscious state say about the frustratiuons of wanting to live but people around them wanting them to die.

I only have anectdotes.

It seems logical to choose life for her.

If she is truly in a PVS and she is not interacting consciously with anyone but merely reacting like a newborn baby would, then I would expect that she would have reactions to being in pain.

So I am back to my original question.

Is she feeling any pain?

Are there ways of confirming whether someone is in pain or not through some sort of test?

 

[SRW]

Do you think she is in pain?


Is she feeling any pain?

Are there ways of confirming whether someone is in pain or not through some sort of test?

Well she is most likely in pain now, from what I understand when they removed the feeding tube she was given Morphine;

Now that the feeding tube is back I would guess they have stoped the drug treatment.

There is no test to gage pain, doctors have to ask. If you get sudden pain they can monitor reactions but they would have no baseline to judge continuous or chronic pain.

 

[Denise]

http://www.cumberlink.com/articles/2003/10/22/ap/Headlines/d7ubepr01.txt

CLEARWATER, Fla. - The family of a disabled woman now under treatment by orders of Gov. Jeb Bush is barred from seeing her because her husband won't allow it, the family's attorney said Tuesday.

I read at the end of the article on CNN this morning that the hospice is not charging for the care of Terri. It was just a blurb at the end of the story so I don't know if it was a mistake and they meant the hospital instead of the hospice.

Terri's condition requires a feeding tube and obviously, helping with such things as diapers. Terri could be provided for at home, she does not have to be in a hospice. I'm talking about before this current medical crisis of course.