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Survey about creationism

-=Vagrant=-

Thinker
-=Vagrant=-
Joined
Mar 20, 2002
Messages
214
I'm doing a small survey about creationists. If you believe that God created stuff, please give a short answer to the following questions.

1. How old is the Universe?

2. How old is the Earth?

3. How old is life?

4. Was there a Flood? If there was, when?

5. Was there one Ice Age or more? When?

Thank you for your cooperation.
 
I believe your post has overgeneralized. I guess one could say that I believe "God created" stuff, but I don't think I could be called a "Creationist". I think your mistake comes from assuming that everyone who believes in God, or even every Christian, must adhere to the Young-Earth "Creationism" theory.


-=Vagrant=- said:


1. How old is the Universe?
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Somewhere between 11 and 15 billion years old - I think

-=Vagrant=- said:
2. How old is the Earth?
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Around 4.5 billion years old, I believe.

-=Vagrant=- said:
3. How old is life?
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Just under 4 billion years old. But remember, these numbers are always changing as we learn more.

-=Vagrant=- said:
4. Was there a Flood? If there was, when?
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I don't know if there was a Flood, but there have been lots of floods throughout the earth's history.

-=Vagrant=- said:
5. Was there one Ice Age or more? When?
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There were more - four, to be precise. They are:
  • Proterozoic - 800 to 600 million years ago
  • Ordovician/Silurian - 460 to 430 million years ago
  • Pennsylvanian/Permian - 350 to 250 million years ago
  • Neogene/Quaternary - within the last 3 to 4 million years or so (we're living in the tail end of it).

There was glacial advancing and retreating many times throughout these periods.

-=Vagrant=- said:
Thank you for your cooperation.
Click to expand...

Not at all. :D
 
Surprising take from a christian Joshua (assuming you are)
I´m not trying to lead this thread off the tracks but would you also accept evolutionary theory as certain liberal christians?
Just curious.
 
I´m not trying to lead this thread off the tracks but would you also accept evolutionary theory as certain liberal christians?

I don't think Josh is a Christian. He's specifically mentioned in other threads he is not. I however am a liberal Christian. I think there is a host of evidence to support evolution--particularly within species. Trans-species evolution however lacks a significant fossil record, as well other key indicators to substantiate it fully. That doesn't mean it's not the case, only that it lacks enough weighted evidence to tip the scales in its favor.

Practically speaking, evolution offers science, particularly medicine a great deal. I hardly think the theory should be abandoned due to a lack of evidence, nor to I particularly feel threatened by the theory as a Christian.

Flick
 
Trans-species evolution however lacks a significant fossil record, as well other key indicators to substantiate it fully. That doesn't mean it's not the case, only that it lacks enough weighted evidence to tip the scales in its favor.
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Uhh, I'd say the number of species, extinct and extant, is extremely solid evidence of trans-species evolution. Or how else would you explain that new species have been appearing for as long as life has existed on Earth? Is God still going around: "Mmmm, this place could need some camels --- Zap!"?

Hans
 
I'm an ecologist, and my work frequently deals with issues concerning evolution. Therefore, I would consider my understanding of the subject to be relatively comprehensive. I'd be happy to furnish details if it's really necessary, but rest assured that there is an overwhelming and absolutely airtight argument in favor of evolution- micro and macro. The scientific community generally regards it as a fact, and in fact all of modern biological science is based around it. The post above provides excellent proof in favor of it. Among those whose opinions on the issue are informed and valid, it's not even an issue. There's always a Jack Chick out there trying to convince people that it's somehow debatable, but they're in the minority and totally misinformed.
 
"Stamen is correct, I am not Christian."
I see.
Sorry.

"Trans-species evolution however lacks a significant fossil record, as well other key indicators to substantiate it fully. That doesn't mean it's not the case, only that it lacks enough weighted evidence to tip the scales in its favor."
Those exact mechanisms is what we need to know more about but it seems to me that transitional events are not as much of a problem as in the old days,the sore point where naysayers would like to stab at.
Would probably be interesting to find out more about the character of transition.

"Practically speaking, evolution offers science, particularly medicine a great deal. I hardly think the theory should be abandoned due to a lack of evidence, nor to I particularly feel threatened by the theory as a Christian."
It is nice to notice that it indeed is possible to honestly discuss evolution with christian ppl.
I do not think you should feel "threatened",the case of God is a different matter in my opinion and should be kept separate.
 
Pre-tertiary Ice Ages?

Josh

I was curious about your reply to ice ages. As an amateur fan of historical geology and paleontology, I was surprised that you listed several ice ages that pre-dated the Cenozoic Era. I had assumed that we date ice ages as a result of surficial evidences (terminal morains and valleys). I would think - perhaps incorrectly - that we have almost no surficial features that pre-date 50 MYA, so it would be difficult to date an ice age to 250 MYA.

[Looking for the lazy way out] - Is there a reference for your response?
 
-=Vagrant=- said:
I'm doing a small survey about creationists. If you believe that God created stuff, please give a short answer to the following questions.

...

Thank you for your cooperation.
Click to expand...

-=Vagrant=- I cannot answer your questions because I do not think that God created stuff.

However, given your target auidence, why do you post those questions here at JREF? Would it not be more efficient to post them on a Christian BBS of some sort?

Thanks in advance for the clarification!
 
-=Vagrant=- said:
I'm doing a small survey about creationists. If you believe that God created stuff, please give a short answer to the following questions.
Click to expand...


1. How old is the Universe?

I think this seems plausible
infin.jpg
:p

2. How old is the Earth?

between 5000 and ten million yrs

3. How old is life?

Around 3000-5000 yrs

4. Was there a Flood? If there was, when?

Yes. Unsure of time.

5. Was there one Ice Age or more? When?

Not sure about that. Need to look into it.
 
1. How old is the Universe?
Click to expand...
4 hours, 29 minutes. The world was created by God just under 4.5 hours ago - complete with the appearence of past history. Not only were light waves created as if they had been in transit for billions of years, but dinosaur fossils and even your memories were all created ipso nihilo just four and a half hours ago.

2. How old is the Earth?
Click to expand...
See #1.

3. How old is life?
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See #1.

4. Was there a Flood? If there was, when?
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No, but the historical traces of the Flood were created - but deliberatly vague, so as to test our faith.

5. Was there one Ice Age or more? When?
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There are the traces of several, but there weren't actually any - although the physical record is indistinguishable from what it would be if there were.

I defy you to prove that the universe was not created 4.5 hours ago. All the evidence of history you can cite is simply proof that the creation came complete with apparent history. The fact that it's air-tight proves God did a perfect job. And the fact that everyone was just now created eliminates the problem of Theodicy. After all, there never was a Holocaust, or billions of unsaved condemned to Hell - since those people only exist as created memories. There is no problem reconciling God and Evil when you realize that Evil never actually existed - we only have memories of it to make the world look real and to underscore certain moral lessons.

So there. Go on, prove me wrong. You can't? Then I must be right. I'll spare you the details and skip right to the final conclusion: stand up straight, stop smoking, and send me $200 in small bills immediately.

:D
 
Re: Re: Survey about creationism

Ruby said:


2. How old is the Earth?

between 5000 and ten million yrs
Click to expand...


So the rocks containing elements whose half-lives show that the rocks are many millions of years old are fakes? And Fossils older than ten million years are also fake?


3. How old is life?

Around 3000-5000 yrs
Click to expand...


Those damn fake fossils again.



4. Was there a Flood? If there was, when?

Yes. Unsure of time.
Click to expand...


Your proof of this flood?
 
There have been tons of floods in this world...
Flood rebuttal is not of high value.
:cool:
 
Re: Re: Re: Survey about creationism

Dub said:
[/b]

So the rocks containing elements whose half-lives show that the rocks are many millions of years old are fakes? And Fossils older than ten million years are also fake?

[/b]

Those damn fake fossils again.

[/b]

Your proof of this flood? [/B]
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Well Dub, you obviously need a lesson in logic.

God made the world 3,000 years ago. So if anything appears to be more then 3,000 years old then obviously we are mistaken. Whether we are just idiots or maybe the black, blue, and green devils are deliberately trying to trick us (making us sorta-idiots for falling for it) doesn't matter. We know that the world is only 3,000 years old because GOD SAID SO.
 
He must be joking.
Not even young earth dudes talk about 3000?
And old earthies would tell young earthies to reconsider their take on 6000.
:)
 
The flood theory does not explain the geological layers where only certain kinds of fossils show up. There was a large human presence that got wiped out by the flood in the story, yet there are no fossils of human skeletons turning up at the same depth as the dinosaurs. Human bones don't float, do they?
 
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