Horatius
NWO Kitty Wrangler
- Joined
- May 9, 2006
- Messages
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Well, now I want to see video of one of these guys demanding to be known as "Brother Type Name Here", but using some weird pronunciations.
Sovereign Citizens Hijinks
- Thread starter BStrong
- Start date
Well, now I want to see video of one of these guys demanding to be known as "Brother Type Name Here", but using some weird pronunciations.
HarryHenderson
Graduate Poster
In 1981, just a year before actually turning 21 smart guy me got a fake ID (at a genuine fake ID shop) that had more cred. And mine never worked once. That hat is a nice choice though. It's that wisdom insinuating tassel I think. When you use the words Temple, Brother and Prophet on your picture "ID" card you gotta have a hat with a tassel that denotes the seriousness of the anarchy you represent. 
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
Another poster gave a great answer detailing the common assertions SC/FOTL demand letters earlier in the thread.
I'll address the bolded.
The problem in answering these claims in any official capacity is twofold.
In one sense, answering gives their claims credence. It's hard enough to deal with in an official venue (court, depositions, settlement agreements) where by asserting their claims it essentially stops the proceedings - it's a real issue.
The second problem is that their have been documented cases where written responses denying claims were magically transformed by persons unknown into acknowledgement of a claim or claims.
Like I posted earlier, they're good at turning paper into handcuffs.
To date the best official review of this problem in North America is The Organized Pseudolegal Commercial Argument (OPCA) Litigant Case:
https://ablawg.ca/2012/10/30/the-organized-pseudolegal-commercial-argument-opca-litigant-case/
I highly recommend this as a guide for interested parties.
William Parcher
Show me the monkey!
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- Jul 26, 2005
- Messages
- 27,471
Sovereign Citizen Faces Unlawful Practice of Law Charge in Florida
https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch...en-faces-unlawful-practice-law-charge-florida
SPLC said:
https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch...en-faces-unlawful-practice-law-charge-florida
A cult-like fake law firm? What a bizarre notion. Is this actually unique? Disturbing and a bit sad that he was actually able to find clients. Do any of these SovCits ever try to illegally do anything productive? Things like unlicensed manufacturing or agriculture or something of the sort? Seems like the ones I hear of are always just trying to beat criminal charges, dodge debts and like that.
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
The first one I met was selling sound suppressor "kits" through the U.S. mail and at gunshows.
He was relying on a CYA sheet he'd include with the kit "This is for educational purposes only and manufacturing a firearm suppressor w/o a license is a crime" or some similar line of ********. Since he was selling what amounted to an unregistered suppressor the feds took note and acted accordingly.
He ended up on America's Most Wanted.
I hadn't thought about this guy until I started this thread, so I whipped out the Google Fu:
http://tucsoncitizen.com/morgue2/1997/02/04/125099-preacher-convicted-of-weapons-charges-is-freed/
by Norman Peckham on Feb 04, 1997, under Tucson and Arizona
Preacher convicted of weapons charges is freed.
A Baptist pastor who fled Tucson in 1985 after being convicted of weapons charges said he will continue with his preaching after being sentenced yesterday to time already served in prison.
”For someone to get convicted at trial, then abscond and for them to come back 10 years later, it’s a dissatisfying situation. But nonetheless that’s what happened,” Siemel said.
Unlike past court appearances, Waddell declined to address Bilby before he was sentenced on one count of illegally possessing a machine gun and another count of giving a false statement.
Before he was convicted in 1985 in Bilby’s courtroom, Waddell was jailed three times – including once for trying to walk out of the courtroom. He was pinned to the floor by a U.S. marshal and held in contempt of court.
Waddell, who said he fled to Canada because he feared for his life, decided not to address Bilby yesterday because ”it was the judge’s day to do what he wanted” and because, he said, he had already addressed the court through documents and ”said everything there is to say.”
After being convicted of six charges in Bilby’s courtroom in 1985, Waddell fled to Canada, where he had been born. The charges he was convicted of included: the machine gun and false statement counts, and four counts related to manufacturing firearm silencers and possessing unregistered silencers.
Waddell could be sentenced only on the machine gun and false statement charges because those were the two counts he was extradited to Tucson on, Ralls said.
Last edited:
HarryHenderson
Graduate Poster
<reminding self it's not The Onion, it's not The Onion, it's not The Onion>
One's surely got to applaud
Thanks for the example. It's a start, anyway. I really want to find one of these guys making bootleg car parts or air conditioners or something.
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
That niche has been cornered by Chinese manufacturers:
http://www.gibson.com/news-lifestyle/features/en-us/CounterfeitGibsons.aspx
http://www.rodauthority.com/tech-stories/other-tech/counterfeit-automotive-parts-knock-it-off/
http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...need-to-know-about-counterfeit-brembo-brakes/
The SC/FOTL types are more concerned with using their magic words to avoid compliance with any laws they believe don't apply to them.
The goofball w/ the unregistered suppressors - He lived in Arizona which is a very NFA friendly state, he could have received a fed. SOT manufacturing license easily had he applied for one and he'd have never had a problem if he complied w/ fed. and state law.
His SC ******** (his racist stuff didn't do him any favors either) led him to believe that he didn't need to comply with the law. He was wrong and eventually he paid the price.
These types are not the "doers" of any legit. endeavor as far as I've been able to determine, but they're great at getting halfwits to buy into their magical thinking universe.
Me too, I just love the "yer laws don't apply to me for (phoney)legal reasons" argument.
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
Here's a link to a report on real estate fraud - some conducted by SC's - in Stanislaus county California
http://www.stancounty.com/bos/agenda/2016/20160816/B10.pdf
Real estate fraud is an ongoing problem throughout California and particularly in Stanislaus County. Some of the current fraudulent schemes consist of embezzlement, Iender fraud, short sale fraud, toreelosure rescue fraud, and bankruptcy fraud. The majority of residential mortgage loans are owned by the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation (Freddie Mac), the Federal National Mortgage Association (Fannie Mae) and the Federal Housing Administration (FHA). Therefore, most losses are sustained by the taxpayers.
A common misconception is that the banks owned the loans and suffered losses for their actions during the sub-prime, stated-income loan frenzy in the mid 2000's. ln reality, the banks sold the loans, and now service them for Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae and FHA. The Real Estate Fraud Unit works closely with the Federa1 Housing Finance Agency Office of lnspector General (FHFA OIG) to investigate fraud on Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae owned loans that were purchased from the banks. lf loan fraud is substantiated, the Federal Housing Finance Agency requires the banks to repurchase the loans.
ln August of 2012, the Real Estate Fraud Unit received complaints of two defendants filing false documents at the Stanislaus County Recorder's Office to stall foreclosure. That investigation led to their local convictions in 2013. During the course of that investigation, additional fraud schemes were discovered in other counties in Northern and Southern California and in July 2016 six defendants Ieeated in San Diego were indicted.
http://www.stancounty.com/bos/agenda/2016/20160816/B10.pdf
Real estate fraud is an ongoing problem throughout California and particularly in Stanislaus County. Some of the current fraudulent schemes consist of embezzlement, Iender fraud, short sale fraud, toreelosure rescue fraud, and bankruptcy fraud. The majority of residential mortgage loans are owned by the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation (Freddie Mac), the Federal National Mortgage Association (Fannie Mae) and the Federal Housing Administration (FHA). Therefore, most losses are sustained by the taxpayers.
A common misconception is that the banks owned the loans and suffered losses for their actions during the sub-prime, stated-income loan frenzy in the mid 2000's. ln reality, the banks sold the loans, and now service them for Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae and FHA. The Real Estate Fraud Unit works closely with the Federa1 Housing Finance Agency Office of lnspector General (FHFA OIG) to investigate fraud on Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae owned loans that were purchased from the banks. lf loan fraud is substantiated, the Federal Housing Finance Agency requires the banks to repurchase the loans.
ln August of 2012, the Real Estate Fraud Unit received complaints of two defendants filing false documents at the Stanislaus County Recorder's Office to stall foreclosure. That investigation led to their local convictions in 2013. During the course of that investigation, additional fraud schemes were discovered in other counties in Northern and Southern California and in July 2016 six defendants Ieeated in San Diego were indicted.
Delphic Oracle
Philosopher
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2016
- Messages
- 6,416
The most hardcore orthodoxy on this basically says specifically not to go the lawful route. To do so would be 'tacit acknowledgement' of the government's authority in that area and potentially further imply that they are a citizen or resident under or within the jurisdiction of the federal government.
So there's a level of this worldview where lawful conduct in commerce is entirely precluded from the outset.
It's useful as a tiny insight into what a truly 'free market' or pure anarchist society would look like. With zero recourse and 'caveat emptor' as the standard, the world would be awash in scams, fraud, and abuse up to and including potentially deadly consequences.
Sent from my SM-J327P using Tapatalk
CORed
Penultimate Amazing
I think they copied them from the Shriners.
That's kind of what I was wondering about. I figure that if these guys were true believers rather than scammers with an odd hustle we'd be seeing a lot more them engaging in illegal provision of otherwise legal goods and services. Kind of like the angelic ladies that sell bacon-wrapped hot dogs illegally in lots of parts of Los Angeles. Scofflaws, but not con artists.
Carnivore
Salad Dodger
Wait, sidebar needed. Bacon wrapped hotdogs are a thing? Why did no one ever tell me? Also they're illegal!?!? And there is an underground rebel movement to supply them to the public in defiance of The Man? This sounds like an amazing story. Can I ask for deets without derailing the thread?
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
The wrapped dogs are legal, the un-licensed street vendors, not so much.
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
Correct.
In the example I cite, this guy could have done done what he did legally but deliberately chose not to.
My pov is (having listened to his line of ****) that he simply believed he was entitled to do as he wished, federal and state law be damned.
Carnivore
Salad Dodger
Ah! Gotcha. Thanks.
They are exactly as delicious as they sound. Despite being legal and very popular locally, the number of legal eateries selling them is surprisingly low. As a result, a number of illegal street vendors have popped up to meet the demand. Their wares are sometimes informally called "Danger Dogs" because these vendors are presumed to be unsanitary.
Many of the vendors I've seen wear gloves when handling the food and make at least some effort to be safe and clean. Police sometimes tolerate them and sometimes ticket them.
But they think the Shriners are copying them. Very strange group.