• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Simple question for Bigfoot enthusiasts: Why no unambiguous photos/videos?

But, if we presume that BF exist, and that at least some of the reported sightings are genuine, then BF aren't avoiding humans. They're simply, somehow, avoiding being photographed clearly-which, unless they are just naturally blurry, would be impossible on their part.

Which takes us back to the original question: if BF does exist, why isn't there, at least, one example of a clear photograph or film footage?

And it is absurd to suggest that it is because many Americans can't program the clocks on their VCR's. My dad never figured out how to program the clock on his VCR, and he still managed to get pictures of deer and bear in Yosemite and Denali. He also stuck a double piece of masking tape over that darn VCR clock so he wouldn't have to see it flashing. Humans may have blind spots, but they can also think outside the box. If BF did exist, a determined human surely should have been able to get a clear picture by now.

Think outside the box? Aren't avoiding humans? What does that remind me of?

Oh yes! The MABRC trip out the sasquatches and get ambushed by four of them video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktXRRkawM9s

YIKES! :yikes:

Darkwing takes flight and No Mercy finds mercy.:D
 
Actually, I think GT is almost certainly referring to the Myakka skunk ape photo. It was featured prominently in the MQ skunk ape episode. Some think it is a fake while others are sure it is an orangutan.

ERR. Wrong, obviously referring to the Creekfreak photo of the blobstump, the uncropped photo of which, included a forest service helicopter. Even a little blackmail on the part of creek to reveal the photo to the press didn't land him a job with Florida Wildlife.

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w178/Ty426/Big-foot-001.jpg
 
Wasn't there a really clear photo of a huge bigfoot in Florida?

If I remember correctly a forest fire forced it out of the woods and it was seen by some helicopter pilots who were afraid of losing their jobs so the didn't report it. Luckily, a local resident, who was taking a photo of the helicopter found it in the photo.
I
know the photo is around here somewhere.

Wow, I messed up. Sorry, guys. Late night sleepy eyes. Totally missed the middle. Nevermind me.
 
ERR. Wrong, obviously referring to the Creekfreak photo of the blobstump, the uncropped photo of which, included a forest service helicopter. Even a little blackmail on the part of creek to reveal the photo to the press didn't land him a job with Florida Wildlife.

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w178/Ty426/Big-foot-001.jpg

Quite right. My bad. I don't know how I missed that middle part. I don't drink coffee but maybe I should.:o
 
I am glad I made that mistake in a way because I think you actually might get the odd Bigfoot enthusiast that would point to the Myakka skunk ape photo and claim it to be a good, clear image of Bigfoot.
 
Just a reminder- Makaya, I mean Myakka, is at the right upper corner of my collage; its the orang-utangish thing with the white "beard".
 
I am glad I made that mistake in a way because I think you actually might get the odd Bigfoot enthusiast that would point to the Myakka skunk ape photo and claim it to be a good, clear image of Bigfoot.

I'm glad you posted the skunk ape Youtube link.
Led me to another cool video. I enjoyed it for some reason. :)

At 2:22
Bigfoot Rocks Knocks to Bach
 
Correa, what is the one under the Minnesota Ice Man and also the one second from the left on the bottom? Don't think I recognize those.
 
What experiences has bigfoot had with mankind that caused it to be cautious of us? Is it equally cautious of all other animals?

This is starting to sound like the bigfoot legend of it being a protector of the woodlands and having a supernatural origin and purpose. How could a reclusive and rare animal that lives in the most remote sections of the world have all learned to be cautious of humans?

Notably, the animals that co-evolved with us in Africa that /are/ intrinsically cautious about humans can still be caught on camera. After all, there's actually nothing intrinsically risky for the animal's health about being caught on camera. A chimpanzee doesn't care that you've got a telephoto lens trained on it.
 
The reddish stuff under the Minesota Icedummy was initially presented as an alien (captured by gametrail, but I may be mistaken); some people who think outside of the boxe proposed it could be a bigfoot. As for the other one, the green bigfoot, is said to be from Skamania... Just another hoax. There are some three or two threads about it at BFF.
 
Sorry, not enough of a reason. I suggest you -again- to use the advanced search function. Try fossils+bigfoot, or something like that, looking for my posts.

The "acid soil & mountain forest" excuses are nothing but footer misinformation.

I don't pretend to be an expert in this area. I derived my information on montane forest fossil decomposition from the NASI report, which of course has been shown to be incorrect in other areas and which is not immune to criticism. Nonetheless, in the report, author Glickman quotes British paleontologist Richard Fortey, a non-bigfooter who has written nothing about bigfoot, regarding rapid biological decomposition in montane forest (italicized section, below; the rest is Glickman).

Please point out the errors in Fortey's description and/or in Glickman's observations about them.

From http://www.rfthomas.clara.net/papers/nasi3.html:

Some species leave behind records in the form of fossils, although few individual animals are converted to fossils. There are several possible reasons why fossils of Bigfoot have not been found:

* Non-existence. The phenomenon does not originate from an uncataloged animal.
* Environment. Certain environments are more likely to support fossil formation than others.
* Misclassification. Existing fossils attributed to an inappropriate genus or species.
* Undiscovered. Fossils exist but have not been unearthed.

The process of fossilization does not convert all deceased animals to fossils — most decompose before they can be fossilized because specific environmental conditions are required to create a fossil. Fortey explains fossil formation:

All fossils are found in rocks that were originally unconsolidated sediments... Certain environments which today support a rich and varied plant and animal life have no sediments forming in them, and the organisms living there have virtually no chance of being preserved in the fossil record. Mountainous regions, for example, are dominated by the erosion of the rock forming the ranges, and therefore no permanent sediment is formed there. Torrential rain and rapid weathering, aided in some climates by the action of frost, rapidly destroys much of the organic material: the chances of any preservable remains reaching a lowland river where permanent sediment is accumulating are remote. The faunas and floras of mountainous regions of the past are most unlikely to be represented in the fossil record. The fossilization potential of a mountainous environment is low. [Fortey 1991]

Thus, where the deposition of undisturbed sediment dominates, fossils may form. Where erosion dominates, such as the montane, fossils rarely form. Suspending disbelief momentarily, of the sightings deemed credible by TBRP, most are in the montane environment. Asian reports, such as the so-called Yeti of the Himalayas, are from a similar environment. If these are sightings of an uncataloged animal, then such an environment would rarely produce a fossil.

When the environment of an animal is restricted to a sufficiently small region, and if this region does not support fossil formation, a gap in the fossil record of an animal may form.

The fossil record of ape evolution is confined almost entirely to the Miocene epoch, from 23 million to 5 million years ago... Ape lineages did persist into the Plio-Pleistocene, although some subsequently became extinct. All these surviving lineages were probably more widespread than they were today. However, their record after about 8 million years ago includes only scanty remains of a recently extinct giant ape (Gigantopithecus) and Pliocene fossils of uncertain affinity, all from southeastern Asia. There is no fossil record of chimpanzees or gorillas at all. [Jones 1992]

Science accepts the existence of the gorilla and chimpanzee through the observation of type specimens even though there is no fossil record. As a single dimension, the lack of fossil evidence does not constitute conclusive proof of an animal's non-existence.
 
I like how you can read BF's mind and know aspects of their culture. Did you gain this knowledge by living among them or did some Indian tracker tell you?

How does the "enemy" call differ from the "friend" call? If we knew this we could go in the forest and call them in.

What...? I routinely use the words "might" and "may" and "guess" and "conjecture" to avoid exactly this kind of overreaching criticism. I conjectured that if such creatures exist, one possible explanation for their avoidance of human beings might be calls or "warning" behavior similar to known and documented primate calls and behaviors, which alert other members of its social group to an enemy presence or approach.

I don't "know" anything about them, and I've never met an Indian tracker. Does that answer your question?
 
If I remember correctly a forest fire forced it out of the woods and it was seen by some helicopter pilots who were afraid of losing their jobs so the didn't report it.
But if they didn't report it due to fear how would we possibly know...

Oh it's all so pointless to pretend there is any logic to any of it.
 
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Vort, don't worry, I will not use an argument on authority. But before writing anything, I must ask-

Have you checked my posts on this issue as I suggested?

You should know that many of the questions you presented are answered there.
 
Think outside the box? Aren't avoiding humans? What does that remind me of?

Oh yes! The MABRC trip out the sasquatches and get ambushed by four of them video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktXRRkawM9s

YIKES! :yikes:

Darkwing takes flight and No Mercy finds mercy.:D

ROFL! I've never seen that video before. I'm guessing the BF's mistook the plastic toy sound as a plaintive moan calling them to an orgy? :D
 
A population of 200 individuals would be a genetic bottleneck, be teetering on extinction, and could not account for the sightings as reported. Look at this BFRO Texas report map:

http://bfro.net/GDB/state_listing.asp?state=tx#map

A giant beast living in vialble breeding numbers so close to Dallas is not going to escape being filmed. People live and work in those areas. The TBRC has had cameras in those areas like Big Thicket for years and no Bigfoot.

I'll repeat my earlier observation that not all reported sightings need to be true in order for some to be possibly true, or to inspire investigation into the origins of the phenomenon. I have serious doubts about the Lake Worth creature and indeed, all other sightings in Texas. The gray-haired anthropologist lady with glasses (whose name I've forgotten) who did the "Ask Science" presentation threw out the "200" number when I've routinely heard 2000 from other sources.


kitakaze said:
If Patty was a Bigfoot, she wasn't a Gigantopithecus. Her jaw is no match for Giganto. We have Giganto jaws to look at and they're huge. Patty doesn't compare in that regard. Also Giganto most likely ate largely bamboo with some fruits like jackfruit and durian. This is going to greatly affect their behaviour.

The last known Giganto. fossil dates from about 300,000 ya. Natural selection would of course have continued during that time, perhaps producing a "Patty"-like animal with morphology adapted to bipedal locomotion and a smaller jaw than that formerly necessary for a foliovorous diet. I'm not suggesting that "Patty" is definitely one such animal (you know my reservations about "her"), simply that such an animal as I've described might conjecturally exist.


kitakaze said:
Remember, gorillas need around 9000 calories a day. Where is a viable breeding population of sasquatches getting the well over 9000 calories it needs in a day in Big Thicket, Texas, while never appearing on one of the many game trails in the area?

That's a damn good question. The question in my mind isn't the "9000 calorie" question -- bears and wolves used to live in this exact same location, somehow finding enough nutrition to sustain their populations -- but rather how a conjectured large primate would go about (mostly) avoiding detection after decades of human activity in their conjectured habitat. It's a damn good question.


kitakaze said:
But if they're like orangutans like you mention, they're going to be found. From orangs to the newly described Bili apes, apes are inquisitive animals. Orangs will often approach humans. Young orang males are notorious for their bad behaviour and the way in which they will harrass female orangs. If they're living in numbers enough to be making danger calls to one another when humans approach, it wouldn't matter if they learned to mimic "I've got a gun and I'll shoot!" They're still going to be found.

They might be related to orangs, but that does not perforce mean that all of their behaviors are going to be exactly like orangs. Humans and chimps have very different sets of behaviors, despite our close kinship. I propose the danger call as one possible means of human avoidance; perhaps it's used among the single-female-with-young groups, of whom there are fewer reported sightings, while the solitary males have no such warning system, leading to their more frequent reported sightings. This is all conjecture on my part, a kind of educated guessing game.


kitakaze said:
No, this part doesn't work. I mentioned this in another thread. That's not the way Bigfoot is reported. 2/3 outside the PNW and plenty of archaeology in the PNW with fossil finds. We have bones for everything else currently maintaining breeding populations there, why not one of the biggest. You should definitely read Correa's posts on this.

Will do. I don't understand how British paleontologist Richard Fortey could be so ignorant and mistaken in his own field, but apparently the question merits closer examination on my part.

kitakaze said:
Did Bigfoot learn with the assistance of the Shaman of the Whills the Jedi art of becoming force ghosts upon death? That would make more sense almost!;)

"Abuse the Farce, Fluke!" If there are Jedi bigfoot, I wonder if there are Sith bigfoot as well? This could be the next area ripe for study! Darth Sasquatch: Misunderstood Misanthrope, or Tragic Hero of the Bigfoot Wars? YOU be the judge.
 
Vort, don't worry, I will not use an argument on authority. But before writing anything, I must ask-

Have you checked my posts on this issue as I suggested?

You should know that many of the questions you presented are answered there.

I'll look into your posts on the subject today. Thank you for the suggestion!
 
I think I'm starting to see the obsession/addiction to Bigfoot threads.

It's like being a moth and encountering a fearsomely bright light of stupidity.
You know it will burn, but how can you stay away?
 
That's a damn good question. The question in my mind isn't the "9000 calorie" question -- bears and wolves used to live in this exact same location, somehow finding enough nutrition to sustain their populations -- but rather how a conjectured large primate would go about (mostly) avoiding detection after decades of human activity in their conjectured habitat. It's a damn good question.

You are so close!!! Bears, wolves, and bigfoot all need to eat a lot of food everyday in order to survive. Bears and wolves are seen, photographed, captured, studied, tracked, have their carcasses found, and hunted on a regular basis. Why isn't bigfoot even photographed once?

Bigfoot does not exist
 

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