"SEND HER BACK!" Will they defend this?

Red Baron Farms said:
If there is anyone in denial, it is you denying this very fact that the Republican party was hijacked in the first place. I am guessing your history is so weak that you forgot President Richard Nixon proposed the establishment of EPA on July 9, 1970 and it began operation on December 2, 1970, after Nixon signed an executive order. Yes that's the very same EPA Trump is bent on dismantling. Probably even so weak you forgot that the greatest environmentalist president of all time from any party was Teddy Roosevelt... a Republican!:covereyes
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Actually, I'm quite aware of that. I'm also aware that Nixon signed the End Stage Renal Disease Program, which extended Medicare coverage to kidney disease patients.....about 10 years after Saint Reagan released an LP claiming that socialized medicine was a stepping stone to Communism. What I object to is your use of the word "hijack"; it looks to me like it's a willfully ignorant denial of elements of the GOP that were always there. Sure, there's been a shift....due to the Southern Strategy that began about Nixon's time; the political world isn't static, you know. But it looks to me like you're simply unwilling to put the blame where the blame belongs: On Republicans and Republican strategists. They are the ones that fomented the current GOP constituency.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
and yet only one side wants to limit that



all the more reason to support efforts to limit the damage they can cause, even if it's not as much or as far reaching as we want to.

My point is: your policies are supported by Democrats, not Republicans.
So why not support them?
At least until the GOP rediscovers its original values?
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If there were particulars I might be willing to discuss them, But I am a conservative Republican through and through. I don't even much like most Democrats at all. I know a few old school ultra conservative southern Baptist Democrats from my Mother's side of the family that I get along with just fine. But that's about it. I am much better off fighting this battle from within the Party than from outside.
 
Red Baron Farms said:
If there were particulars I might be willing to discuss them, But I am a conservative Republican through and through. I don't even much like most Democrats at all. I know a few old school ultra conservative southern Baptist Democrats from my Mother's side of the family that I get along with just fine. But that's about it. I am much better off fighting this battle from within the Party than from outside.
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Well, I hate to break it to you, but: You're losing the fight. Bigly.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
That sounds an awful lot like putting party loyalty over substance and issues.
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If it does, then that means either you haven't been listening, or you are still stuck in the false dichotomy.

It would be far easier to demonstrate if there were more than two main parties. Then you could have a Conservative Republican party a Liberal Democrat party and a Neoliberal plutocrat party. Then you would be able to see very clearly how different all three are policy wise.

But at least for now, in local politics all over this country, there are still plenty of conservative Republicans. Not much I can do about National politics until I have someone to vote for whom I respect. (I already promised I will be voting for Bill Weld) So I write and give talks instead.
 
smartcooky said:
Perhaps we can get Miller's own uncle to speak

https://www.facebook.com/TribuneDemocrat/posts/1271660039530911

Mr. Trump is trying to sell you something too. He sells fear of immigrants, contempt of our daughters, sisters, and wives, and sows discord and anger. He knows the dictator’s disgraceful sales tricks of challenging the integrity of democratic elections, he finds an unpopular outside group to blame our troubles on, cooks up false electoral fraud theories if he doesn’t get his way, threatens and bullies his opponents, and tells us that he is the only one that can lead the nation ahead. He’s trying to sell you something, and it’s not a good product. For the first time in my memory a major American political party’s Presidential candidate has proposed that laws and regulations be established solely on the basis of a person’s religion and ethnic background. The legitimization of this as a basis of serious political discussion is a terrible step into darkness. Remember, what goes around comes around. If today it’s “them”, then tomorrow it may be you.

Finally, my nephew and I must both reflect long and hard on one awful truth. If in the early 20th century the USA had built a wall against poor desperate ignorant immigrants of a different religion, like the Glossers, all of us would have gone up the crematoria chimneys with the other six million kinsmen whom we can never know.

- David Glosser
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Well, Rachel Maddow interviewed him on her show tonight

Video 5:30 long

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/...k-against-trump-policy-of-cruelty-64332357999
 
Cabbage said:
Well, I hate to break it to you, but: You're losing the fight. Bigly.
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You might be surprised Cabbage. Far more people than you know considering I am just one old man on the internet. Several thousand at least have made indications they have stopped denying AGW and a few are even actively campaigning like me for a change in the Republican platform.

Most Liberals just want to incessantly argue ... just like you in fact.....and not willing to form alliances. But when conservative Republicans find out I am "one of them" and I explain AGW in language they understand, most get it.
 
Red Baron Farms said:
Apparently the part you missed is the fact that Neoliberals are not liberals or even leftists? They sit squarely in the center of Wall Street and know no other ideology other than using the power of their money to increase their power and money. Their primary strategy is obfuscate deny confuse and mislead publicly while privately making backroom deals to insert the right people for regulatory capture, thus protecting their ill gotten gains with the full weight and measure of the US government and military.
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That's a seriously poor word choice. It's not like anyone is likely to know what the hell you mean.

If you insist on using it I can only conclude your intent is malicious. It's not like
the word is commonly used, it's not like there are no other options.

If you want to diss laissez-faire extremists, calling them a confusing term is not going to do it.


BTW, using dishonest marketing is not laissez-faire.
 
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Red Baron Farms said:
Most of the consumer protections the Democrats propose are indeed sneaky attempts by industry to use regulatory capture. There are easily as many Neoliberal back room deals going on in Democrat halls as the Republican side.

These guys are pure plutocrats, they donate to both parties, they have no allegiance to either liberal or conservative ideology. They are willing to use both to suit their purposes and actually prefer to be on both sides of any deal made so as to be capable of rigging the system so they can't lose no matter which side wins.

I gave a perfect example of that very thing on the rural thread a few days back
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This is bordering on fantasy even using your inappropriate term.

Yes, many Democrats are disappointingly in the pocket of big business. Needs to be called out.

That doesn't make the rest of us supporting said positions.

You know why what you are describing is not laissez-faire? A true free market has to not be distorted. Merchants of Doubt is the quintessential market distortion.
 
Red Baron Farms said:
You might be surprised Cabbage. Far more people than you know considering I am just one old man on the internet. Several thousand at least have made indications they have stopped denying AGW and a few are even actively campaigning like me for a change in the Republican platform.

Most Liberals just want to incessantly argue ... just like you in fact.....and not willing to form alliances. But when conservative Republicans find out I am "one of them" and I explain AGW in language they understand, most get it.
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And this distinguishes them from Republicans/Neoliberals/People in general..how, exactly? Most Republicans just like to demonize liberals and Democrats...just like you in fact.
 
Cabbage said:
And this distinguishes them from Republicans/Neoliberals/People in general..how, exactly? Most Republicans just like to demonize liberals and Democrats...just like you in fact.
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It really is beyond your capacity to understand I dislike Democrat platforms just as much as I dislike Trumps?
 
Red Baron Farms said:
It really is beyond your capacity to understand I dislike Democrat platforms just as much as I dislike Trumps?
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?????

Of course I understand....indeed, that's why you evidently feel a need to demonize them.

Honestly, I can't even imagine how you thought this post followed from mine; it's a complete non sequitur.
 
"Somebody reboot Mike Pence, he's buffering." Stephen Colbert re Pence stumbling over explaining Trump's latest racist statements.
:dl:
 
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