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Scroll up or scroll down?

If someone says "Scroll down", which way do you swipe?

  • Total voters
    10
It may depend on whether you're on a Windows or Apple device. The scroll wheels on mice go in the opposite directions, by default.
 
On the one hand, I think it's like walking. Usually best to just do it rather than think about how it's done.

On the other hand, I think it just goes to show that computer interfaces aren't nearly as natural and intuitive as we like to think. We probably shouldn't be too hard on people who struggle to wrap their heads around the idioms of human-computer interfaces.
 
theprestige said:
On the one hand, I think it's like walking. Usually best to just do it rather than think about how it's done.

On the other hand, I think it just goes to show that computer interfaces aren't nearly as natural and intuitive as we like to think. We probably shouldn't be too hard on people who struggle to wrap their heads around the idioms of human-computer interfaces.
Click to expand...

On the car forum, where I lurk, a small number of people are complaining that one pushes the 'gear selector' forward to select reverse, and pull it backwards to select forward.

(Usual terms are a bit wonky because the car doesn't have a 'gearbox' as such, just electric motors.)

I'm scratching my head, because every car I've ever driven has had 'reverse gear' selected by pushing the gear stick forward, typically after negotiating a complex gate. (e.g. push the knob down, then left, then forward on my last car. Pull up a ring, then left, then forward on another. Weird complex wiggly path on a Volkswagen Passat.)

This has caused me to reflect on all the various interfaces on all the cars that I've driven over my life, and surprised me that there was so little standardisation across various cars.

Examples include:

Starter motor button on the floor (Minis);
Foot pedal emergency brake released by pulling a knob on the dashboard (Toronas);
Left/Right swap for indicators and windscreen wipers either side of the steering column (European vs Australian cars);
Indicators on a rocker switch in the centre of the dashboard (Citroen);
High beam switch as a foot switch on the floor (Old Holdens);
'Gear change' push buttons on the dashboard (Old Valiant);
Left Hand/Right Hand emergency brakes (various); and,
Location and functionality of the 'choke' (old cars).

I understand that square steering 'wheels' are now a thing, and wonder how long it will be, before we're controlling cars via a fly-by-wire, joystick rather than a steering wheel...
 
Wudang said:
Are you guys all assuming Euclidean geometries?
Click to expand...
Our patterns indicate two-dimensional thinking.

theprestige said:
On the one hand, I think it's like walking. Usually best to just do it rather than think about how it's done.

On the other hand, I think it just goes to show that computer interfaces aren't nearly as natural and intuitive as we like to think. We probably shouldn't be too hard on people who struggle to wrap their heads around the idioms of human-computer interfaces.
Click to expand...
Yeah, just try getting a USB drive in the right way the first time. Even if they're marked, they may be marked wrong (I know from personal experience.) Or take the simple mistake in The Big Bang Theory when they got the Time Machine. Leonard pulled the lever back, and they all sped up. But, in the movie (and logically), you push forward to move forward in time, pull back to go backward. (Those nerds should have known that!)
 
theprestige said:
On the one hand, I think it's like walking. Usually best to just do it rather than think about how it's done.

On the other hand, I think it just goes to show that computer interfaces aren't nearly as natural and intuitive as we like to think. We probably shouldn't be too hard on people who struggle to wrap their heads around the idioms of human-computer interfaces.
Click to expand...
Very much so. When I'm helping someone non-technical with computer problems I try to find out what their metaphor? mental model? of how computers work is like and try to fit my explanation in with that.
 
zooterkin said:
It may depend on whether you're on a Windows or Apple device. The scroll wheels on mice go in the opposite directions, by default.
Click to expand...
This is what drives me crazy. On any given day I use Windows, Mac, and Linux desktops. On machines I "own" I set them all up so that motion moves the window frame over the content. That is, swiping (or rolling the wheel) upward makes the content move downward. But from day-to-day I'm using shared machines that belong to a station, not to a person. We tend to leave the customizations settings alone on those, so I have to use whatever is there.

What surprises me is that on touch-screen devices I have no problem with the notion that touching the content and moving it around properly makes the content move the same direction as the swipe. This is the opposite of what I prefer on desktops where a separate pointing device (touchpad, mouse wheel, etc.) is in charge of scrolling.
 
I guess my mental model flips between two modes.

1. Scrolling makes the content move up or down.
2. Scrolling makes my viewing window move up or down the content.

You're not really having troubles with the human/machine interface until you pull a really bone-headed move, like pulling back on the steering wheel to 'go around', because you see that traffic has stopped in front of you.

:shocked:
 
novaphile said:
I guess my mental model flips between two modes.

1. Scrolling makes the content move up or down.
2. Scrolling makes my viewing window move up or down the content.

You're not really having troubles with the human/machine interface until you pull a really bone-headed move, like pulling back on the steering wheel to 'go around', because you see that traffic has stopped in front of you.

:shocked:
Click to expand...
Don't get me started on video game flight controls...
 
zooterkin said:
It may depend on whether you're on a Windows or Apple device. The scroll wheels on mice go in the opposite directions, by default.
Click to expand...
You're kidding, right?!!!

Apple mice have scroll wheels? Next you will be telling me that they have more than one button.
 
Last edited:
Wudang said:
Are you guys all assuming Euclidean geometries?
Click to expand...
I couldn't afford the Möbius option on my display, but I'm saving up for the Klein bottle. (I understand they're having a hard time with manufacturing costs as well as the user interface.)

novaphile said:
I'm scratching my head, because every car I've ever driven has had 'reverse gear' selected by pushing the gear stick forward, typically after negotiating a complex gate. (e.g. push the knob down, then left, then forward on my last car. Pull up a ring, then left, then forward on another. Weird complex wiggly path on a Volkswagen Passat.)
Click to expand...
With my Getrag 6-speed manual transmission, you get to reverse by starting in neutral, shoving the stick hard right (past the track that contains forward gears 5 and 6), and then pulling it back.
 
W.D.Clinger said:
I couldn't afford the Möbius option on my display, but I'm saving up for the Klein bottle. (I understand they're having a hard time with manufacturing costs as well as the user interface.)


With my Getrag 6-speed manual transmission, you get to reverse by starting in neutral, shoving the stick hard right (past the track that contains forward gears 5 and 6), and then pulling it back.
Click to expand...
This guy will sell you one.
I need to re-read The Cuckoo's Egg!
 
Wudang said:
Very much so. When I'm helping someone non-technical with computer problems I try to find out what their metaphor? mental model? of how computers work is like and try to fit my explanation in with that.
Click to expand...
As long as it's not putting your disc icon into the waste paper basket to eject your disc... That I never agreed with!
 
Darat said:
As long as it's not putting your disc icon into the waste paper basket to eject your disc... That I never agreed with!
Click to expand...
That's probably why MacOS switches the trashcan icon to the eject icon when you start dragging a mounted volume. There are endless jokes for Windows about dragging My Computer to the trashcan and the whole computer vanishes from your desk.
 
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