Rush Limbaugh & Pat Robertson Re: Haiti Quake

[Ziggurat]

Yeah, right...

This is lefty we're talking about, he's got rather different standards than most of us for evaluating the actions of leftists.

 

[leftysergeant]

This is lefty we're talking about, he's got rather different standards than most of us for evaluating the actions of leftists.

Yeah, whether they act with malice or compassion and have thought out what they are doing.

When Republicans do stupid crap I just assume it is from dim-witedness until I see signs of malice, but I usually need not look far to find at least avarice.

 

[Walter Ego]

I know this is tangential, but liberal journalists are also in it for the money, as best as I can tell. Olbermann and Maddow aren't donating their time to MSNBC in pursuit of the truth, are they? Nena Totenberg? Paul Krugman?

But Olbermann put his money where his mouth is...

Olbermann Donates $50K to Free Health Clinics.

 

[Plagiarius]

There isn't exactly anything unusual about the US stepping in to provide aid to that country, not really an issue of who's in the oval office.

Haha yes, we all know about the 'aid' US policies have been directing towards Haiti, with the World Bank and WTO as mediator. It might've been better equipped to deal with a quake if it had more surplus if it's agricultural base wasn't utterly screwed, along with servicing loan repayments and other issues associated with the extensiving liberalising of it's economy, transforming it into how it's now known as the 'Taiwan' of the Caribbean. A large amount of rural Haitians were forced into slum areas in order to find manufacturing jobs after being squeezed out of the agricultural business by subsidised American imports. This is why you hear about houses practically 'being built on top of eachother.'

Strangely, a staggering amount of troops (10,000) have been sent, considering the amount relative to the troops just sent to Afghanistan, a much larger country and a theater of operations. Why so many American troops, and not UN peacekeeoer forces?

 

[leftysergeant]

Strangely, a staggering amount of troops (10,000) have been sent, considering the amount relative to the troops just sent to Afghanistan, a much larger country and a theater of operations. Why so many American troops, and not UN peacekeeoer forces?

The UN does not have an aircraft carrier and 10000 troops just make a dent in the efforts to find and bury the dead. And how many of those people are on the USS Carl Vinson and the USS Comfort?

 

[Ziggurat]

Lefty's right on this one: relief efforts are VERY labor-intensive, and the magnitude required here is simply enormous. Haiti could probably use a lot more than 10,000 troops right now, but there's a limit to how many people we can field on such short notice into an area with so little infrastructure of its own. And the UN cannot field significant numbers of troops on short notice (they already had peacekeepers in Haiti when the quake hit, but IIRC their own buildings collapsed). Hell, nobody BUT us really has the logistical capability to do that.

 

[Flo]

Lefty's right on this one: relief efforts are VERY labor-intensive, and the magnitude required here is simply enormous. Haiti could probably use a lot more than 10,000 troops right now, but there's a limit to how many people we can field on such short notice into an area with so little infrastructure of its own. And the UN cannot field significant numbers of troops on short notice (they already had peacekeepers in Haiti when the quake hit, but IIRC their own buildings collapsed). Hell, nobody BUT us really has the logistical capability to do that.

France, maybe, and they have bases in the Carribean (Martinique, Guadeloupe, and French Guyana).

 

[leftysergeant]

France, maybe, and they have bases in the Carribean (Martinique, Guadeloupe, and French Guyana).

They're kind of short on heavy comabt engineers and earth-moving equipment. We have it on hand and the ability to get it there faster than it can be brought in from France.

 

[Lurker]

As I suspected, Robertson is sending his charitable foundation to help out in Haiti.

So as hateful as Robertson's comments are, he's infinitely better than Rush and his exhortation to abandon Haiti in its time of need.

If it was God's will that Haiti be subjected to the Devil's due then isn't Robertson going against God by sending aid to Haiti? Or is he just helping clean up God's messes? Odd.

 

[daredelvis]

Glover is an idiot. That response is magnitudes more response than his influence on society warrants. Of course the right will take every opportunity to bring it up in an attempt to mitigate the vile comments and beliefs held by Rush and Pat.

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Daredelvis

 

[marksman]

If it was God's will that Haiti be subjected to the Devil's due then isn't Robertson going against God by sending aid to Haiti? Or is he just helping clean up God's messes? Odd.

Technically, Robertson didn't attribute the earthquake to God. In other comments, he makes it pretty clear that he thinks this is the Satanic consequence of making a deal with Satan.

So in Robertson's twisted mindview, the Haitian slaves made a deal with Satan in which Satan would help them overthrow their French slavemasters, but that Satan would then afflict Haiti with disasters and poverty for some indeterminate time thereafter. (Presumably, Robertson believes that if enough Haitians were to abandon voudoun, and join a "real religion" like fundamentalist Christianity, everything would change for the better.)

 

[Lurker]

Technically, Robertson didn't attribute the earthquake to God. In other comments, he makes it pretty clear that he thinks this is the Satanic consequence of making a deal with Satan.

So in Robertson's twisted mindview, the Haitian slaves made a deal with Satan in which Satan would help them overthrow their French slavemasters, but that Satan would then afflict Haiti with disasters and poverty for some indeterminate time thereafter. (Presumably, Robertson believes that if enough Haitians were to abandon voudoun, and join a "real religion" like fundamentalist Christianity, everything would change for the better.)

So Satan is in charge of natural disasters and God is impotent? Robertson is a twisted SOB. Why is teh Islam off the hook?

 

[DavidJames]

So the only question now is who on the Right will have the courage common decency to denounce these clowns.

GWB said the right thing about Rush's comments yesterday. Haven't seen any others yet.

 

[marksman]

So Satan is in charge of natural disasters and God is impotent? Robertson is a twisted SOB. Why is teh Islam off the hook?

I'm pretty sure Robertson doesn't think they are. I wouldn't be surprised if he blamed the Tsunami in Indonesia on their Muslim alliance with Satan.

And on the impotence argument, I doubt Robertson thinks God is impotent, but I'm sure he believes that if you enter into a pact with Satan of your own free will, God own't interfer with that free will by mitigating the effects of the pact. Robertson apparently believes all of Haiti has reaffirmed their descendants' compact with Satan through Voudou (despite the fact that very few Haitians actually practice voudou).

I'm not saying Robertson is not hateful He is. I'm just saying he doesn't think God sent the earthquake.

 

[johnny karate]

I'm pretty certain to people who listen to the exchange of remarks in context it indicates he formed an opinion and was laughably wrong. Laughably wrong because he was too paranoid about having to end up on a whitehouse email list or soaking himself in propaganda to bother looking.

I don't think putting words in his mouth is really needed to show how dumb his basis for those remarks were, but he hasn't sunk as low as most of his biggest critics probably wish he did.

Dude, I directly quoted the man.

I realize now he is back-pedaling, claiming he was purposely misinterpreted but he said what he said.

 

[Cain]

The Orange County Register had an article today blaring "OC Pastor agrees: Haiti made deal with Satan."

“They said, ‘If you’ll help us, we’ll dedicated ourselves and our government to Satan,’” said Drake, who made headlines last year when he asked his “prayer warriors” to pray for President Barack Obama’s death. He’s also party in a lawsuit seeking to remove Obama from office on the grounds that he’s not a natural born citizen..

He's since changed his views on praying for Obama's death, so these guys are not beyond reason:

“I don’t want Obama to die,” he said. “I want him to live so he can go to jail as an usurper.”

Also, these guys are raising money despite the pact the unchosens have made with the devil:

Both Robertson and the Southern Baptists are raising money for earthquake relief in Haiti.

“All the children and so forth weren’t necessarily in deals with the devil - and even those who were, we’re still going to minister to their suffering,” Drake said.

 

[Grizzly Bear]

Dude, I directly quoted the man.

Then allow me to rephrase; I agree. I agree it can be interpreted just as you wrote it. My pet peeve is with people interpreting it as more than a personal opinion referring to himself, going as far to say he was expressing an explicit command to listeners NOT to donate, hence putting words in mouth. I don't see it that way and you already know my opinion of his justification isn't changing regardless. But people want to add imaginary material to that, and that's as bad on credibility as his inability to factcheck.

I realize now he is back-pedaling, claiming he was purposely misinterpreted but he said what he said.

Not sure I care if he was misrepresented or not anymore. The more I discuss it, the more I'm finding it to be a semantics issue. I already condemn him for politicizing the Haiti issue from the get go and to top it off he'd still be wrong about his reasons. There are some parts as I said earlier about how the money's been wasted in the past that I agree with but that's a separate issue.

I'm outie from this thread...

 

[Travis]

Haha yes, we all know about the 'aid' US policies have been directing towards Haiti, with the World Bank and WTO as mediator.

Angry Communism failed?

I won't say all their policies worked but I do believe they were done with good intentions.

It might've been better equipped to deal with a quake if it had more surplus if it's agricultural base wasn't utterly screwed, along with servicing loan repayments and other issues associated with the extensiving liberalising of it's economy, transforming it into how it's now known as the 'Taiwan' of the Caribbean. A large amount of rural Haitians were forced into slum areas in order to find manufacturing jobs after being squeezed out of the agricultural business by subsidised American imports. This is why you hear about houses practically 'being built on top of eachother.'

Why should the US have preferentially imported Haitian sugar and why couldn't some other country have done so? Perhaps differentiating the economy to be something other than a mono-resource based one was the reason for the WTO conditions. Clearly that didn't work but that was the goal.

Strangely, a staggering amount of troops (10,000) have been sent, considering the amount relative to the troops just sent to Afghanistan, a much larger country and a theater of operations. Why so many American troops, and not UN peacekeeoer forces?

Well, first off there will be many times more US troops in Afghanistan. Secondly, the UN has no troops of it's own. Thirdly the US has enormous capability to send troops fast for disaster relief. Lastly, since the UN has little resources to respond and the US has so many who do you think the UN would ultimately ask to deploy there in the end?

 

[Darth Rotor]

I find Glover's actions more laudable because he is more human than the pig man or the Servant of the Harlot.
.

Let me get this right: are you cool with Danny Glover asserting that the mistakes of the Copenhagen conference are what led to a seismic event?

Come on, lefty, he's being an oaf here.

Glover only does dumb stuff on the spur of the moment. He doesn't make a career of it.

He does not have his own talk show, and as far as I know isn't paid to go out of his way to start controversy. Rush is. Robertson ... IMO, senile is too kind of a word.

I suspect Danny Glover is, as so often happens with Hollywood loons, letting mouth overtemp his lightweight brain, but what he said was silly and nearly woo like. I empathize with his emotional reaction, but would rather he did a little reasoning, a little critical thinking, before opening his pie hole in a rush to be heard. I have no animus against Danny Glover, he's been a favorite screen presence of mine for years. But he's making a complete ass of himself, and apologists for irrational ranting -- sound familiar? -- by not going through one more iteration of "think" before the first iteration of "speak" in this case.

@ Redtail: it is possible, even likely, that your reading of the comments is where he intended to go.

DR

 

[dudalb]

Angry Communism failed?

I won't say all their policies worked but I do believe they were done with good intentions.



Why should the US have preferentially imported Haitian sugar and why couldn't some other country have done so? Perhaps differentiating the economy to be something other than a mono-resource based one was the reason for the WTO conditions. Clearly that didn't work but that was the goal.



Well, first off there will be many times more US troops in Afghanistan. Secondly, the UN has no troops of it's own. Thirdly the US has enormous capability to send troops fast for disaster relief. Lastly, since the UN has little resources to respond and the US has so many who do you think the UN would ultimately ask to deploy there in the end?

And also the US is a LOT closer to Haiti then any other nation that could deploy that amount of troops.
I love the way some lefties can find evil intent in ANY American Action.