Roman Dodecahedron

EHocking said:
As probably already suggested, it may well have begun as a task/test set for metalworking apprentices, and then became a collectible gew-gaw.

Much like the endless number of glass torsos created by students or apprentices in Murano.
Unsurprisingly, I can’t find an example of the particular type of piece I’m remembering for sale in every shop window in Venice, I can only find examples for sale that have been advertised as being created by masters.

Which is why I thought that the dodecahedrons may well be apprentice/student piecework required to be created to pass a practical exam, and then just kept or sold as knick knacks.
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Doesn't make sense there was no central organisation or set curriculum among Celtic tribes across Europe 2000 years ago.
Each craftsman would teach the skills he had individually
 
Andy_Ross said:
Doesn't make sense there was no central organisation or set curriculum among Celtic tribes across Europe 2000 years ago.
Each craftsman would teach the skills he had individually
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Fair enough, but there would have been trade, there might have then been competition between tribes along the lines of “yeah, our guys can do that too”. I emphasise might.
 
The fact is we'll never know what they are until we gather them all in once place and let them assemble themselves into their intended configuration. I've seen a lot of horror and science fiction and this scenario always works out well for everybody present for it.
 
TragicMonkey said:
The fact is we'll never know what they are until we gather them all in once place and let them assemble themselves into their intended configuration. I've seen a lot of horror and science fiction and this scenario always works out well for everybody present for it.
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ooh, ooh, I know - send them all to the White House as a gift!!!
 
EHocking said:
As probably already suggested, it may well have begun as a task/test set for metalworking apprentices, and then became a collectible gew-gaw. Much like the endless number of glass torsos created by students or apprentices in Murano. Unsurprisingly, I can’t find an example of the particular type of piece I’m remembering for sale in every shop window in Venice, I can only find examples for sale that have been advertised as being created by masters. Which is why I thought that the dodecahedrons may well be apprentice/student piecework required to be created to pass a practical exam, and then just kept or sold as knick knacks.
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Yes that has been mentioned but I don't buy it. The object itself resembles a doodle in the margins, something from a creative mind on autopilot. The rationality of the 'exercise' answer is pleasing to the sort of person attracted to solving puzzles, which makes me sceptical of it. Rationality is optional when solving human behaviour, and if you put it aside for a moment, the 'exercise' doesn't make sense from an artistic point of view.

The shape is fun, whimsical, pleasing but apparently useless. Craft is rarely taught with such abstract whimsy and art is rarely taught with such conformity. Meanwhile artists can become irrationally hung up on a subject for a whole lifetime, and people can irrationally imitate things they like. Already one poster has made one for themselves without having any purpose for it. I think that proves the thing has an inherent mimetic appeal which might be enough to explain why they exist.
 
Remember that Swiss Army knife-looking thing that was conjectured about here a few years ago? It had what looked like a compass point on one side and a cross-blade on the other. That was made in contemporary times and no one (here, anyway) ever figured it out.
 
Shrinker said:
Yes that has been mentioned but I don't buy it. The object itself resembles a doodle in the margins, something from a creative mind on autopilot. The rationality of the 'exercise' answer is pleasing to the sort of person attracted to solving puzzles, which makes me sceptical of it. Rationality is optional when solving human behaviour, and if you put it aside for a moment, the 'exercise' doesn't make sense from an artistic point of view.

The shape is fun, whimsical, pleasing but apparently useless. Craft is rarely taught with such abstract whimsy and art is rarely taught with such conformity. Meanwhile artists can become irrationally hung up on a subject for a whole lifetime, and people can irrationally imitate things they like. Already one poster has made one for themselves without having any purpose for it. I think that proves the thing has an inherent mimetic appeal which might be enough to explain why they exist.
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Yes, I think one has to consider the possibility that the reason for this whole thing, and perhaps the reason why a purpose is so hard to pin down, is that this was something purely aesthetic or symbolic. We could easily have lost forever the rationale behind an object with political, social or religious meaning, especially if that meaning was intentionally obscure. Of course one can imagine all sorts of possibilities, crazy or not. Our current culture is documented in so many ways that it's likely some future archaeologist will be able to figure out the relics of passing fads or things that don't make a lot of sense - pet rocks, garden gnomes, religious artifacts, symbols of solidarity, and whatnot. In a culture where less is written down, such things can easily be lost.
 
This thread (and the original photos) finally inspired me to make a 3D print version. In progress, about 75% done. I'll post a picture when complete. It would work as a great tutorial for newbies to try all the designing features!
 
bruto said:
This thread reminds me of David Macaulay's Motel of the Mysteries. For those not familiar with this, it's a satirical take on archeological reconstruction - in this case the discovery of a 20th century motel two thousand years later. They get everything wrong, of course.
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I remember that from a Scientific American or Popular Mechanics way back when. The thing that stuck in my mind was that they decided a toilet seat was some kind of ceremonial necklace.
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So I designed and made one with my 3D printer (about 7cm across). I was surprised that even with a dodecahedron solid template to begin with, it took a lot of work to make. I imagine it would make a great tutorial for anyone getting into 3D print design.
Getting the nodules to print was tricky, as the connections were too thin and tended to split, even with support. I had to glue a couple on the bottom back on.
If I made a larger one, perhaps the size of a softball, I might take a different approach. But I'm also inspired to make Cavor's ship from the First Men in the Moon movie.
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alfaniner said:
So I designed and made one with my 3D printer (about 7cm across). I was surprised that even with a dodecahedron solid template to begin with, it took a lot of work to make. I imagine it would make a great tutorial for anyone getting into 3D print design.
Getting the nodules to print was tricky, as the connections were too thin and tended to split, even with support. I had to glue a couple on the bottom back on.
If I made a larger one, perhaps the size of a softball, I might take a different approach. But I'm also inspired to make Cavor's ship from the First Men in the Moon movie.
View attachment 68354
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Where are you going to get the Cavorite?
 
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