Riots, looting, vandalism, etc.

SuburbanTurkey said:
I have no idea.

I see defenders of the dead man claim this is evidence that the shooter was seeking out Trump people. I can't tell from this video what's being said, or by who.

What do you think it shows?
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I am not sure. That is why I am asking.

If people think that the 'shot' guy was the aggressor, then surely they have some other evidence I can see or hear that will show that to be the case.

??

On the streets of Portland, I would not rule out 'shooter is 80yo grandma from the balcony' at this point.


eta: the audio language is pretty clear to me. Not every word though.
Do you want a transcript?
(I realize not all ISF member have English as their primary language so yelling might be hard to follow.)
 
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Sherkeu said:
I am not sure. That is why I am asking.

If people think that the 'shot' guy was the aggressor, then surely they have some other evidence I can see or hear that will show that to be the case.

??

On the streets of Portland, I would not rule out 'shooter is 80yo grandma from the balcony' at this point.
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I mean, it's obvious that he fired pepper spray then there were two shots. The timing is clear. Unless you think someone else shot the pepper spray.
 
SuburbanTurkey said:
I mean, it's obvious that he fired pepper spray then there were two shots. The timing is clear. Unless you think someone else shot the pepper spray.
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Maybe you have a better video to share?

If he heard what they said and saw some coming for him, then spraying pepper spray is understandable.

I am a woman... so if someone comes at me to attack or carjack and I spray them, I really expect a better chance to be able to get away - and not be shot. (not uniquely a 'woman' thing...so please do not quibble on it)

I have never had to do it, but this gives me pause for sure.
Pepper spray might just be an invitation to shoot me.


eta: removed wrong interpretation on who pointed a pistol. It wasnt the dead guy, as I has assumed was the claim from Bogative.
 
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Sherkeu said:
Where is the video of the "pointed pistol" right before the shooting?
I can not find one that show this.
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A pistol cannot be seen in the video I watched, I based my assessment that he was already pointing it at the patriot prayer guy by how quickly gunshots can be heard after seeing whatever was sprayed at the shooter.

The audio you provided makes me question who the aggressor was.
 
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Nazis gathered up, decided to go downtown to terrorize protesters with bear mace, pepper spray, guns and vehicles. One of them got shot. They didn't expect a fight, they just wanted to hurt and bully people.
 
Sherkeu said:
Maybe you have a better video to share?

If he heard what they said and saw some coming for him, then spraying pepper spray is understandable.

I am a woman... so if someone comes at me to attack or carjack and I spray them, I really expect a better chance to be able to get away - and not be shot. (not uniquely a 'woman' thing...so please do not quibble on it)

I have never had to do it, but this gives me pause for sure.
Pepper spray might just be an invitation to shoot me.


eta: removed wrong interpretation on who pointed a pistol. It wasnt the dead guy, as I has assumed was the claim from Bogative.
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I think this is quite the reach. You claim the dialogue is clear. I still can't parse more than a few words, and I definitely can't tell who's saying what.

Pepper spray is a weapon. Shooting it at someone is assault unless there's sufficient grounds for self defense. Jumping to conclusions and pepper spraying someone is a great way to land in legal trouble and/or get lawfully injured in response.

What is abundantly clear from the video is that the shots occur after the pepper spray is used. This is after a long day of convoys of trucks shooting pepper spray and paintballs while driving by, occasionally stopping so people could jump out for beatings.

Our shooter has plenty reason to fear getting pepper sprayed and mob beaten while incapacitated.
 
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Here I am waiting for the cops to criticize these violent outside agitators. They literally mustered outside the city and drove in armed to the teeth for a brawl.
 
Ziggurat said:
Apparently Oregon does not have a duty to retreat in its laws, so it is effectively a stand your ground state. This may protect the BLM shooter.
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I don't know whether I hope it does or I hope it doesn't. I don't like the idea of non-lethal force being met with lethal force. On the other hand, I don't like the idea of morons going in with bear spray and paint pellets looking for trouble.

If they figure out who the shooter was, I suppose that's why we have juries. Let him convince them that he didn't have any choice except plugging the guy.
 
Mumbles said:
Tactical gear, and supposedly a Patriot Prayer logo - that same group Andy Ngo was recorded with, laughing as they planned a violent attack. Aww, was it one of his white nationalist pal that keep him around as their widdle pet?

But yeah, I have no sympathy for some wannabe militia boy driving in from wherever and getting himself shot on his little vigilante ****** hunt. He wanted a war, and he got one.
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Mumbles said:
*shrug* Sorry, but I don't take responsibility. I'm in Maryland, I'm not out fighting in the streets or even marching, that's not my way. And I have never actually recommended violence to anyone - although I certainly understand defending yourself or others from a violent mob like the so-called "blue Lives Matter" folk often form. v For that matter, I have no problem with a small business owner defending their livelihood against a looter. nd that's exactly why I have no issue with this white nationalist goon getting shot while playin g racial wargames.



You must have me confused with Louis Farrakhan or something. Sorry, I'm not.
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You don't think that quote above is Trumpian? Of course you don't.
 
SuburbanTurkey said:
I think this is quite the reach. You claim the dialogue is clear. I still can't parse more than a few words, and I definitely can't tell who's saying what.

Pepper spray is a weapon. Shooting it at someone is assault unless there's sufficient grounds for self defense. Jumping to conclusions and pepper spraying someone is a great way to land in legal trouble and/or get lawfully injured in response.

What is abundantly clear from the video is that the shots occur after the pepper spray is used. This is after a long day of convoys of trucks shooting pepper spray and paintballs while driving by, occasionally stopping so people could jump out for beatings.

Our shooter has plenty reason to fear getting pepper sprayed and mob beaten while incapacitated.
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I did not claim the dialogue 'was clear' in who was saying it. I asked the question of you specifically to see if you knew somehow. You seemed to have definite conclusions about what happened there.
Some sentences are VERY clear but the speaker is not shown. You have really seen it right?


If a person points a gun at me, I suppose pepper spray is stupid at that point. I'm pretty much dead if you want to kill me and pissing you off may do no favors. Death sentence then? Maybe. Crap happens.

However, the video I have seen does not show anyone near enough to even be sprayed. Is there different video showing a close attacker?

AGAIN:
Perhaps someone has some better video???
Perhaps someone skeptical, that can parse events from actual video/audio wants to take a stab at it - this single event with just a few people? without dragging thousands of others in a movement into it?

"They thought" "They think" "They want" "They were trying" are asinine statements I see all too often. Just the facts please.
 
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thaiboxerken said:
Nazis gathered up, decided to go downtown to terrorize protesters with bear mace, pepper spray, guns and vehicles. One of them got shot. They didn't expect a fight, they just wanted to hurt and bully people.
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There are a couple videos embedded in this article showing these right wing groups doing exactly that, with apparent impunity from law enforcement.
 
Bogative said:
Shots fired at Trump car caravan Woodland Hills, California. SWAT has suspect barricaded.


https://twitter.com/ElijahSchaffer/status/1300197958634352640?s=20
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Wow! Scott Adams is going off.

If fake news did not exist, there would be no protests.


What this country needs is a common enemy to pull us together. We need someone who is just as hated by Antifa, BLM protesters, and Michael Moore as they are hated by Trump supporters.

That person is Mayor Ted Wheeler.
 
Sherkeu said:
I did not claim the dialogue 'was clear' in who was saying it. I asked the question of you specifically to see if you knew somehow. You seemed to have definite conclusions about what happened there.
Some sentences are VERY clear but the speaker is not shown. You have really seen it right?


If a person points a gun at me, I suppose pepper spray is stupid at that point. I'm pretty much dead if you want to kill me and pissing you off may do no favors. Death sentence then? Maybe. Crap happens.

However, the video I have seen does not show anyone near enough to even be sprayed. Is there different video showing a close attacker?

AGAIN:
Perhaps someone has some better video???
Perhaps someone skeptical, that can parse events from actual video/audio wants to take a stab at it - this single event with just a few people? without dragging thousands of others in a movement into it?

"They thought" "They think" "They want" "They were trying" are asinine statements I see all too often. Just the facts please.
Click to expand...

There's a lot unknown. But it's plainly on video that pepper spray was sprayed prior to the shots. The camera person that was even further back was complaining of the spray's effect, I think it's preposterous to say that no one was near enough to matter.

Legality will hinge on details yet unknown. Morally, Patriot Prayer brownshirts catching a bullet after a day of deliberate street violence is a good thing.
 
Deleted, unclear if ID is correct.

Protest medic was first on the scene trying to provide aid to our slain fash. Video shows the cops preventing her from helping, and a Twitter account claiming to be her points out that he received no medical aid for several minutes until EMS showed up. Cops hit a street medic with batons, she claims he was still alive when she was removed from the scene.



https://www.oregonlive.com/resizer/...m/advancelocal/4PSLYHJYYBFCDGJ7J4B2ZZLFGU.jpg

https://mobile.twitter.com/BoyneSierra/status/1300130924147781633?s=20
 
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Meadmaker said:
I don't know whether I hope it does or I hope it doesn't. I don't like the idea of non-lethal force being met with lethal force.
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The relevant legal question here is deadly vs. nondeadly, and you cannot meet nondeadly force with deadly force, with or without stand your ground laws. I don't know enough about the specifics of the encounter to conclude whether the guy who got shot was threatening deadly force. I just think it's ironic that there's a situation here where the left might end up glad of stand your ground protections.
 
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