...Richard Gage destroyed by Kim Hill

[bardamu]

Is that so ? Now that IS interesting.

At 2:15pm Nik Gowing says Jane Standley is on the corner of 6th Avenue and Grand.

At 3:38pm George Stephanopoulos says he's at Canal Street and the Avenue of the Americas.

The window is slightly different, but the view is similar. It's 20 blocks away from the WTC and Peter Jenkins says "it's as close as they'll let you broadcast at this point".

 

[triforcharity]

Bard, what is your point?

 

[BigAl]

At 2:15pm Nik Gowing says Jane Standley is on the corner of 6th Avenue and Grand.

At 3:38pm George Stephanopoulos says he's at Canal Street and the Avenue of the Americas.

The window is slightly different, but the view is similar. It's 20 blocks away from the WTC and Peter Jenkins says "it's as close as they'll let you broadcast at this point".

It would be nice if you'd link to the messages you are quoting.

 

[carlitos]

At 2:15pm Nik Gowing says Jane Standley is on the corner of 6th Avenue and Grand.

At 3:38pm George Stephanopoulos says he's at Canal Street and the Avenue of the Americas.

The window is slightly different, but the view is similar. It's 20 blocks away from the WTC and Peter Jenkins says "it's as close as they'll let you broadcast at this point".

In Manhattan, there are 20 north-south blocks per mile, more or less. The 2 locations noted are 1/2 mile and 3/4 mile away, respectively.

As for that "similar view," I doubt it. (Click to embiggen thumbnail image)

(image deleted by me)

Who is Peter Jenkins? Is he a relative of Leroy Jenkins?

ETA - Every time I read that post, I saw "Grand and Canal" which is a subway stop. My bad. But it's still not 20 blocks away.

 

[BigAl]

In Manhattan, there are 20 north-south blocks per mile, more or less. The 2 locations noted are 1/2 mile and 3/4 mile away, respectively.

As for that "similar view," I doubt it. (Click to embiggen thumbnail image)

[qimg]http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/1313/mapbib.th.jpg[/qimg]

Who is Peter Jenkins? Is he a relative of Leroy Jenkins?

Avenue of the Americas and 6Th Avenue are the same street. It's the widest in Manhattan (I think) and above the Wall ST area, it's all low-rise buildings. It was a great place to watch what happened at WTC. The WTC7 collapse Camera shot we all see was taken from somewhere near Canal St and 6th Ave.

Grand St is only a couple blocks north of Canal St and crosses 6Th Ave.

No eyewitnesses think man-made demolition caused any WTC tower to collapse. Depending on the explosives, people at Canal & 6Th coupd have heard it explode.

I was on a bus on what could be called "lower 6th Ave" between WTC and Canal street when the first plane hit. It was heading North. If I heard an explosion, I probably thought we hit one of the many potholes.

 

[bardamu]

Bard, what is your point?

This is interesting information about Jane Standley's reporting for the BBC on 9/11, a subject that was discussed by Richard Gage and Kim Hill.

It would be nice if you'd link to the messages you are quoting.

Try clicking on one of your own links:

The archives of almost all the TV broadcasts from NYC are archived here. Have a ball. There are countless man-on-the-street interviews here.

http://www.archive.org/details/sept_11_tv_archive

Who is Peter Jenkins? Is he a relative of Leroy Jenkins?

Peter Jenkins Jennings.

Fixed.

 

[triforcharity]

Ok, I was a little vague, let see here champ.

What are you so worried about moving people away from the area, so we could do our jobs?? Why does that seem so suspicious??

 

[fourtoe]

I forgot to mention that I was glad to hear that Gage does accept the theory of evolution. You think there might be a chance that he is just horribly wrong in his views on 911?

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

I can't help but laugh a little! I like people who are bald & have a sense of humor about it, but damn, Gage doesn't have ay sense of humor the way he's always uptight about everything.

It's because he drove his wife away. She got sick of him being nothing but a 3rd rate scam artist preying upon the memory of the dead so she left him.

Gage threw away his family for a couple TV interviews (where he gets made a fool of) a couple personal appearance fees (to crowds of less than 100) and a trashy website that got tagged as a pro-terrorist website by the Simon Weisenthal Foundation.

Would you laugh in his shoes?

 

[9/11 Chewy Defense]

It's because he drove his wife away. She got sick of him being nothing but a 3rd rate scam artist preying upon the memory of the dead so she left him.

Gage threw away his family for a couple TV interviews (where he gets made a fool of) a couple personal appearance fees (to crowds of less than 100) and a trashy website that got tagged as a pro-terrorist website by the Simon Weisenthal Foundation.

Would you laugh in his shoes?

If I were in his shoes I would've never taken that kind of path because I'd know it would cost me dearly.

 

[Cl1mh4224rd]

It's because he drove his wife away. She got sick of him being nothing but a 3rd rate scam artist preying upon the memory of the dead so she left him.

See... I don't know his views on love and marriage, or his feelings toward his now ex-wife, but a divorce is a pretty serious thing, in my opinion. It tells me that he honestly believes--and very deeply---in the nonsense he spouts.

 

[Dave Rogers]

There is no need to pretend Dave. We HAVE won. We just need to get the word out and we will- you can rely on that.

That's the spirit, bill. Why bother with reality, when it's so inhospitable to your point of view? Live on in your fantasy world, where you're right about everything and ultimate victory is always just around the corner. Sanity is over-rated.

Dave

 

[ElMondoHummus]

Billy should also consider this fact:

Free Fall From Space - Captain Joe Kittinger

30 km drop. Sign me up scotty!!!

That was awesome.

Pshaw! James T. Kirk hit North America from jumping out from over the Arabian penninsula, and was about to do a 3 orbit jump! If only it weren't for that stupid space string storm lightning thing that killed him!

 

[Brainache]

Two engineers, and architect, a world tour, and plenty of cash. It'll end in bloodshed or alcoholism. Or possibly both..............

You say that like it's a bad thing.

I just thought: Why should the conmen get all of the gullible people's money? Surely marketing actual truth as "Truth" would not be unethical and it could have the potential to be highly educational.

The more I think about this, the more I like it. Then again, I'm a bit thick sometimes.

 

[ElMondoHummus]

Two engineers, and architect, a world tour, and plenty of cash. It'll end in bloodshed or alcoholism. Or possibly both..............

Personal experience informing this post any?

 

[Furcifer]

120MPH is NOT a set terminal velocity for all objects.

Terminal velocity depends on many factors, air density(thus Kittinger's ability to gain so much speed in thin air), the area of the object exposed to the air, the shpae of the object, and the mass of the object.

If two objects of the same size and shape but of differing masses fall through the same density air then the more massiver object will have a higher terminal velocity.

Example, if a solid steel, human shaped object were to fall from a plane at the same time that a human skydiver does, the skydiver will soon see the steel-man outpacing him.

The other point to take into account is that if the object is tumbling, terminal velocity will also be affected.

A rough calculation using Greening's 30 000 tonnes gives an estimated 800 Km/h or 500 mph terminal velocity.

If we reduce the mass by a factor of 10, it still gives you about 175 mph.

What the actual terminal velocity would be is unknown. It's most likely higher than 125 mph.

Anyone using this 125 mph terminal velocity is completely clueless. The upper block was not a 180 lb thrill seeker.

 

[BigAl]

A rough calculation using Greening's 30 000 tonnes gives an estimated 800 Km/h or 500 mph terminal velocity.

If we reduce the mass by a factor of 10, it still gives you about 175 mph.

What the actual terminal velocity would be is unknown. It's most likely higher than 125 mph.

Anyone using this 125 mph terminal velocity is completely clueless. The upper block was not a 180 lb thrill seeker.

Terminal velocity is irrelevant if the object hits the ground before reaching that speed. Parts falling 1,000 ft (The WTC towers) or 600 Ft (WTC7) hit the ground way before they reached TV. Given the mass of the debris pieces and the low speed, I doubt that aerodynamic drag had any effect, and TV is a fuction of aerodynamic drag.

 

[Furcifer]

Parts falling 1,000 ft (The WTC towers) or 600 Ft (WTC7) hit the ground way before they reached TV. Given the mass of the debris pieces and the low speed, I doubt that aerodynamic drag had any effect, and TV is a fuction of aerodynamic drag.

That's not entirely true. Much of the debris reached terminal velocity before impact. Most noticeably siding and dust.

I'm sure you're referring however to the "bulk" of the debris. Large exterior colums and the upper block itself. They never reached terminal velocity, even the ones falling outside the footprint not impeded by the lower intact structure.

It's just the wrong term to be trying to apply to the collapse of a building.