Regarding 'Debunking the North of the Citgo Theory'

[The Big Dog]

"This would be impossible, since we don't know the pertinent values."

Your complete failure to supply the math is again (and again and again and again) noted. Impossible? Impossible? You fraud, of course it is not impossible. The only thing you don't "know" is the speed. You can remedy that by solving for the G force for all speeds above stall. You refuse to do it because you know that your description of Boger's statements (banking North of Citgo followed by by an arrest of the descent and then up and over the Pentagon) is aerodynamically impossible. Fraud.


Quote:
(I also think those jackasses at the CIT also have claimed that Lagasse was a plant who the govmint intended that the crack researchers of the CIT would discover at the CITGO, but they did not realize the NOC flight path would be THE smoking gun to ace MC, Waldo, and his sidekick, Peter Pan, a/k/a Lyte).

"More braying from 16.5. Evidence?"

Braying?? O'Rly? Tell you what, I'll get your evidence if you agree that when I do, you will admit that Lyte and Waldo are pathetic lying frauds. Deal?

 

[bje]

Produce the quote or admit you're lying.

So, your above statement is a lie then?

Nope. The fire chief wasn't an eyewitness to the wreckage. Duh.

None of these quotes support the assertion that CIT "wasn't going to interview ANY eyewitnesses to the wreckage". The above evidence indicates just the opposite- so, BJE, are you going to produce the quote or admit you're lying?

On the contrary. It shows CIT had no intention of getting near the issue of the wreckage. CIT claims, like you, that the wreckage was "planted." But they know the issue debunks CIT. Just ask Craig and Aldo. They know they are on record. They haven't produced any of the statements from the 1,000+ people who saw or handled or sorted through the wreckage.

Let's see those statements. Let's see you produce them. You can't because Ranke and Marquis never interviewed them.

Tell us, TLB, why do you buy the lies of Ranke and Marquis so readily? Why do you persist in protecting them?

 

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Then how did they receive this letter of appreciation?
[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_26184488ab74261a2b.jpg[/qimg]

How? Someone hand-wrote it an probably mailed it. It's hardly an official letter of appreciation. It would have been typed.

And what is the NCOIC Recovery Team, anyway?

 

[bje]

TheLoneBedouin is caught between a rock and hard place.

TLB is really stuck now knowing that both Craig Ranke and Aldo Marquis categorically refused to conduct any interviews or get any statements from those people 1,000+ people who had direct contact with the wreckage.

Now that TLB has posted comments from Ranke demonstrating Ranke lying to TLB about the matter, TLB is caught in a trap.

TLB, what are you going to do about Ranke lying to you?

 

[Mr. Skinny]

How? Someone hand-wrote it an probably mailed it. It's hardly an official letter of appreciation. It would have been typed.

And what is the NCOIC Recovery Team, anyway?

Well, in the Air Force, NCOIC stands for Non-Commissioned Officer In Charge. Not sure how that would work in combination with "Recovery Team"?

 

[TheLoneBedouin]

I agree he says commercial aircraft, and silver, which does not sound like a C-130. Please cite where you got the "east of" claim. Most specific thing I've seen is "over the lane one area." Which seems to be this, according to official pentagon parking charts:

The new interview indicates that the plane is banking over the Southeast side of the Pentagon. Roosevelt's position is more to the East than in your diagram. All this will be in the new CIT release.

No. He said "flying around the south parking lot." Why did you just lie about that?

Yes, the southeast side of the Pentagon.

 

[jhunter1163]

Quote:
The Statements of Sgt. William Lagasse

Subject: 9-11
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 13:11:40 -0400
From: "Lagasse, William, , PFPA"
To: "'[email protected] '"


Dear Sir rest assured it was a Boeing 757 that flew into the building that
day, I was on duty as a pentagon police sgt. I was refueling my vehicle at
the barraks k gas station that day adjacent to the aircrafts flight path.
It was close enough that i could see the windows had the shades pulled down,
it struck several light poles next to rt 27 and struck a trailer used to
store construction equipment for the renovation of the pentagon that was to
the right of the fueselage impact point. The fact that you are insinuating
that this was staged and a fraud is unbelievable. You ask were the debris
is...well it was in the building..I saw it everywhere. I swear to god you
people piss me off to no end. I invite you and you come down and I will walk
you through it step by step. I have more than a few hours in general
aviation aircraft and can identify commercial airliners. Have you ever seen
photos of other aircraft accident photos...there usually isnt huge amounts
of debris left...how much did you see from the WTC?...are those fake
aircraft flying into the building. I know that this will make no diffrence
to you because to even have a websight like this you are obviously a
diffrent sort of thinker.

TLB:

I'd really like to hear your take on the bolded parts of this message from Officer Lagasse.

 

[TheLoneBedouin]

Tripe Lip and the gang don't talk much about this. Maybe TLB can explain why Lagasse feels this way about the CIT.

There is nothing in that letter about CIT- in fact, it was written before CIT ever interviewed Lagasse.

Any thoughts on this, TLB, particularly the bolded parts?

it struck several light poles next to rt 27

Note that he doesn't say that he saw the light poles get hit.

Like I said, you can't really see the light poles from here- so I didn't see it hit 'em

Craig:We've got you on the Citgo security video on this side, so we know you were on this side.
Lagasse:So it would be impossible for me to have seen through the building over the roof to see the plane [fly south of the citgo].
Craig:So from your vantage point its 100% certain that-
Lagasse:Its 100% certain that the plane was were I said it was.

Any thoughts on this, Jhunter?

the aircraft passed
almost directly over the naval annex splitting the distance between the ANC
and Columbia pike

His letter confirms the NOC approach.

 

[jhunter1163]

The fact that you are insinuating that this was staged and a fraud is unbelievable. You ask were the debris is...well it was in the building..I saw it everywhere. I swear to god you people piss me off to no end.

Nothing to say about this little tidbit, TLB?

 

[TheLoneBedouin]

Nope. The fire chief wasn't an eyewitness to the wreckage. Duh.

But the author of the letter of appreciation was an eyewitness to the wreckage- so will you admit you lied?

On the contrary. It shows CIT had no intention of getting near the issue of the wreckage.

No, none of those quotes say anything about CIT's intention of interviewing witnesses. Are you saying that because CIT says there was little wreckage, therefore they refuse to interview first responders. I don't follow your "logic".

Why do you persist in protecting them?

Because, all of your attacks are based on lies. Reheat lies about were Morin saw the plane, and you seem to be lying about CIT "refusing to interview first responders". Again, produce the quote or admit you're lying.

 

[TheLoneBedouin]

Nothing to say about this little tidbit, TLB?

No, its irrelevant to Lagasse's testimony.

 

[stateofgrace]

Because, all of your attacks are based on lies.

Really?

so your answer to this "liar"..............

Quote:
The Statements of Sgt. William Lagasse

Subject: 9-11
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 13:11:40 -0400
From: "Lagasse, William, , PFPA"
To: "'[email protected] '"


Dear Sir rest assured it was a Boeing 757 that flew into the building that
day, I was on duty as a pentagon police sgt. I was refueling my vehicle at
the barraks k gas station that day adjacent to the aircrafts flight path.
It was close enough that i could see the windows had the shades pulled down,
it struck several light poles next to rt 27 and struck a trailer used to
store construction equipment for the renovation of the pentagon that was to
the right of the fueselage impact point. The fact that you are insinuating
that this was staged and a fraud is unbelievable. You ask were the debris
is...well it was in the building..I saw it everywhere. I swear to god you
people piss me off to no end. I invite you and you come down and I will walk
you through it step by step. I have more than a few hours in general
aviation aircraft and can identify commercial airliners. Have you ever seen
photos of other aircraft accident photos...there usually isnt huge amounts
of debris left...how much did you see from the WTC?...are those fake
aircraft flying into the building. I know that this will make no diffrence
to you because to even have a websight like this you are obviously a
diffrent sort of thinker.

is, what,exactly?

 

[TheLoneBedouin]

Really?

so your answer to this liar..............

No one's claiming Lagasse was a liar, except you. Everything he says corroborates his later testimony.

 

[stateofgrace]

Or this "liar"?

Mr. Trip,

You seem surprised that we veterans of that day do not like to talk to you. And you seem to think there is some sinister reason for that reluctance. Well, there is a reason, to be sure: it is you and your colleagues sinister behavior. When some weeks ago I challenged you and others to call me a liar to my face, for my statement about having held aircraft wreckage in my hands on that horrible day, I was ignored and mocked, of course.

But, folks from your little 'movement' seem to have decided that since I disagreed with them, and since I appear to have served honorably for 25 years in the US military, I was some how a threat to their house of cards. Reality is not a big part of your lives, it seems. So, fairly quickly after that, your ilk decided to 'investigate' me (if googling is investigating), and to post my 'suspicious' background in hopes of 'proving' I am some sort of government shill. So, this page appeared: http://z9.invisionfree.com/Pilots_Fo...?showtopic=186

There is no honorable reason for the tone of that page. In addition, you didn't do a very good job, as you missed much, and misunderstood much more.

I again say that you and those who cluster with you, dancing on the graves of those who died that day, and denying the stories of those of us that did not, that you have no honor. If you have *any* understanding of the military, you will understand the depth of that comment, but I doubt you will.

I remain deeply grateful to Gravy and his friends, as I do not have the stomach to talk to you and yours. You seem to think this is because we are somehow afraid of you. Hardly.

I note on that attack page, the comment is made that this person is 'still waiting' for my message to them. Know this: I shall not talk to those who seek to validate their own sad lives by attempting to invent history. While I remain deeply opposed to the current president, and feel he was far from forthcoming about the reasons for the war in Iraq, I don't for a moment believe he stood by while an airplane hit my building. I pity you and your friends, for having the narrowness of vision to likely believe, at least on some level, the lunacy you propound. It is just a shame that you can not see beyond your own egos to the pain you uselessly inflict. You think you are seeking the truth, when in fact, you support lies and dishonor. Had you the ability to feel it, I would simply say "shame."

I now assume you will again either attempt to bad mouth or trivialize me. Sadly for you, you lack the ability to do that later, so will likely simply rely on the former, as you again wake up each day determined to see that which isn't there. How sad it must be to value one's life by being such a small fish, in an increasingly small puddle. You may now continue, of course, with your nonsense, your cruelty, and your sad and contemptible efforts at self aggrandizement draped in a chimera of self importance.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2547358&postcount=35

Well?

 

[stateofgrace]

No one's claiming Lagasse was a liar, except you.

Really?

Where did I do that ?

not lying are you ?

 

[uruk]

No, Terry Morin places the plane over the Navy annex.

CIT says the witnesses testimony places the plane over the Navy Annex. Reheat used that particular point in his calculations.

Its not- I brought up alternative technology to point out the absurdity of Reheat's "aircraft independent" claim.

Do you even know if a variable geometry aircraft can make that manouver? And What if a variable geometry aircraft cannot make that manouver either?

se, speculation is useless- but it is possible that the conspirators needed complete assurance that whatever they wanted destroyed was destroyed (possibly the ONI command center).

Crashing a airliner into the building would do the job nicely don't you think?

they needed the damage to be precise.

GPS makes hitting targets a no brainer. We have cruise missles that can hit a target to within the inch. modern aircraft can take off from a run way, fly to thier destination and safey land all on auto-pilot.

Precision and accuracy is not an issue.

I don't follow- no one needs to embellish their stories.

But you claimed Morin embellished his.

Nothing- but there is nothing to indicate they have embellished their stories. Just the opposite, in fact, since the salient points are all corroborated.

You said Morin embellished his. LeGasse admitted to embellishing his story.

You do know that a salient corroberated point was that the plane hit the building.
Would you say that that is an embellishment?

 

[stateofgrace]

Because, all of your attacks are based on lies. .

Mr. Trip,

You seem surprised that we veterans of that day do not like to talk to you. And you seem to think there is some sinister reason for that reluctance. Well, there is a reason, to be sure: it is you and your colleagues sinister behavior. When some weeks ago I challenged you and others to call me a liar to my face, for my statement about having held aircraft wreckage in my hands on that horrible day, I was ignored and mocked, of course.

But, folks from your little 'movement' seem to have decided that since I disagreed with them, and since I appear to have served honorably for 25 years in the US military, I was some how a threat to their house of cards. Reality is not a big part of your lives, it seems. So, fairly quickly after that, your ilk decided to 'investigate' me (if googling is investigating), and to post my 'suspicious' background in hopes of 'proving' I am some sort of government shill. So, this page appeared: http://z9.invisionfree.com/Pilots_Fo...?showtopic=186

There is no honorable reason for the tone of that page. In addition, you didn't do a very good job, as you missed much, and misunderstood much more.

I again say that you and those who cluster with you, dancing on the graves of those who died that day, and denying the stories of those of us that did not, that you have no honor. If you have *any* understanding of the military, you will understand the depth of that comment, but I doubt you will.

I remain deeply grateful to Gravy and his friends, as I do not have the stomach to talk to you and yours. You seem to think this is because we are somehow afraid of you. Hardly.

I note on that attack page, the comment is made that this person is 'still waiting' for my message to them. Know this: I shall not talk to those who seek to validate their own sad lives by attempting to invent history. While I remain deeply opposed to the current president, and feel he was far from forthcoming about the reasons for the war in Iraq, I don't for a moment believe he stood by while an airplane hit my building. I pity you and your friends, for having the narrowness of vision to likely believe, at least on some level, the lunacy you propound. It is just a shame that you can not see beyond your own egos to the pain you uselessly inflict. You think you are seeking the truth, when in fact, you support lies and dishonor. Had you the ability to feel it, I would simply say "shame."

I now assume you will again either attempt to bad mouth or trivialize me. Sadly for you, you lack the ability to do that later, so will likely simply rely on the former, as you again wake up each day determined to see that which isn't there. How sad it must be to value one's life by being such a small fish, in an increasingly small puddle. You may now continue, of course, with your nonsense, your cruelty, and your sad and contemptible efforts at self aggrandizement draped in a chimera of self importance.

The Statements of Sgt. William Lagasse

Subject: 9-11
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 13:11:40 -0400
From: "Lagasse, William, , PFPA"
To: "'[email protected] '"


Dear Sir rest assured it was a Boeing 757 that flew into the building that
day, I was on duty as a pentagon police sgt. I was refueling my vehicle at
the barraks k gas station that day adjacent to the aircrafts flight path.
It was close enough that i could see the windows had the shades pulled down,
it struck several light poles next to rt 27 and struck a trailer used to
store construction equipment for the renovation of the pentagon that was to
the right of the fueselage impact point. The fact that you are insinuating
that this was staged and a fraud is unbelievable. You ask were the debris
is...well it was in the building..I saw it everywhere. I swear to god you
people piss me off to no end. I invite you and you come down and I will walk
you through it step by step. I have more than a few hours in general
aviation aircraft and can identify commercial airliners. Have you ever seen
photos of other aircraft accident photos...there usually isnt huge amounts
of debris left...how much did you see from the WTC?...are those fake
aircraft flying into the building. I know that this will make no diffrence
to you because to even have a websight like this you are obviously a
diffrent sort of thinker.

Do you stand by this statement or what?

 

[pomeroo]

Detectives?

Insert laughing dog here.

A thousand laughing dogs wouldn't do justice to that fabulous assertion.

 

[pomeroo]

Really?

so your answer to this "liar"..............



is, what,exactly?

I should mention that I have posted this quote in the past and the dimwits of the CIT really, really, really don't like it.

 

[pomeroo]

The new interview indicates that the plane is banking over the Southeast side of the Pentagon. Roosevelt's position is more to the East than in your diagram. All this will be in the new CIT release.

Yes, the southeast side of the Pentagon.

When will you frauds get around to asking your cherry-picked witnesses which of the two mutually-exclusive claims they are prepared to abandon?

You won't ever ask them? Why not?