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Cont: Qanon Conspiracy Theories Part Three

Hans said:
The world never gets taken over by the Illuminati, the UN the New World Order, its always 'gonna happen soon'. I remember the near constant stream of fear over the communists who were going to take over in the 50-80's. Obviously that didn't come about
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I can't help but laugh. I mean, these people should spend some time around the UN. They're not taking over anything. It is an organization paralyzed by its democracy.
 
I’m a Parkland Shooting Survivor. QAnon Convinced My Dad It Was All a Hoax.
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A young student who survived the shooting at Parkland described how their Q poisoned father has become so nuts with the CT, that he has started openly doubting that the shooting was real and claiming that the bodies were fake and that the shooter was in on the hoax.

https://www.vice.com/en/article/epnq84/im-a-parkland-shooting-survivor-qanon-convinced-my-dad-it-was-all-a-hoax?utm_source=vicenewstwitter
 
Once dismissed as just another set of wacky conspiracy theories from the internet, the phenomenon known as QAnon has grown into a malignant force, infecting minds with dangerous fictions and amassing real power. What is this movement trying to achieve, and what happens next?

Thursday, August 5 at 7pm ET, on the next Skeptical Inquirer Presents live online event, journalist Mike Rothschild will untangle the many threads of myth and misinformation that make up QAnon ideology and why its outrageous beliefs are no laughing matter.
Mike Rothschild: How QAnon Became a Movement, Cult, and Conspiracy Theory of Everything (Skeptical Inquirer)
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His name alone will get the QAnon crazies going.
 
dirtywick said:
Does he think he is in on it?
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My reading is that he thinks the shooting was a hoax, but a convincing hoax that the son was a bystander to. Fake bodies, fake shooter, blank gunshots, an elaborate false flag performance that would bamboozle both bystanders, like the son, and the greater public.

Sounds more like the father thinks the son is being duped, not that he is complicit.

ETA: At least, that's my hunch. My limited experience with these CT's is that most think the shootings did actually happen, but that they were orchestrated false flag operations using varying amounts of theatrics, crisis actors, and props. Some may claim the actual shooting and deaths were real but were planned by (((nefarious actors))), others might claim more elaborate hoaxes involving fake bodies and fictional actors.

Those that believe more elaborate hoaxes tend to be the most toxic, because that often means that they believe real victims are actually in on the hoax. Harassment of surviving families is common as these cranks try to out the "truth". IIRC, one parent of a Sandy Hook victim had to keep the location of his slain child's grave a secret, as he fears that truthers might try to exhume the body.
 
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The quote was:
VICE said:
Bill also had to deal with his father’s daily accusations that the shooting was a hoax and that the shooter, Bill, and all his classmates were paid pawns in a grand conspiracy orchestrated by some shadowy force
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which makes your reading seem generous to the father.
 
Gord_in_Toronto said:
I suppose we should not be too surprised that it has come to thi:



California dad killed his kids over QAnon and 'serpent DNA' conspiracy theories, feds say



https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...ds-over-qanon-serpent-dna-conspiracy-n1276611
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Dunno, that strikes me as the kind of guy who probably would have done something horrific regardless of the excuse. But I've maintained for decades now that conspiracy theories aren't benign. Truth and facts matter.
 
JayUtah said:
Dunno, that strikes me as the kind of guy who probably would have done something horrific regardless of the excuse. But I've maintained for decades now that conspiracy theories aren't benign. Truth and facts matter.
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Conspiracism is a form of mental illness, and once one removes the ordinary guardrails from one's perceptions of reality, anything can be justified. That's why it's important to notice these people, investigate, and if it seems justified, intervene.
 
Gord_in_Toronto said:
I suppose we should not be too surprised that it has come to thi:

California dad killed his kids over QAnon and 'serpent DNA' conspiracy theories, feds say

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...ds-over-qanon-serpent-dna-conspiracy-n1276611
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JayUtah said:
Dunno, that strikes me as the kind of guy who probably would have done something horrific regardless of the excuse. But I've maintained for decades now that conspiracy theories aren't benign. Truth and facts matter.
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Yes, and to every one who has ever pushed this grotesque, poisonous fantasy, I say: Go **** yourself.
 
eerok said:
Conspiracism is a form of mental illness, and once one removes the ordinary guardrails from one's perceptions of reality, anything can be justified. That's why it's important to notice these people, investigate, and if it seems justified, intervene.
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I think belief in a conspiracy theory might qualify in some cases as an expression or symptom of paranoia, which obviously could rise to clinical significance. But I don't think everyone who believes or promotes conspiracy theories is mentally ill. For people who are already mentally ill in some ways, I think conspiracy theories act as an aggravating factor.

By the same token I don't believe everyone who promotes a conspiracy theory necessarily believes it. That's where the real danger lies. You have people recklessly promoting falsehoods for their own purposes, seemingly indifferent to the real-world effects that will have on people. The original QAnon seems to have done it just for a lark, or as a prank. And when pranks go wrong, the prankster is rightly held accountable for it, because recklessness is not excusable even if you think the benign result you intended is hilarious. There's a reason why yelling "Fire!" in a crowded theater is not protected speech.

I'm a firm believer in punishing people only for what they do, not what they think. But when what they do evinces either a complete disregard for others or an entirely uncritical approach to the facts, it seems appropriate for there to be some accountability. As a society we do hold people accountable for what they know, or what they should have known, as it directs their actions. The QAnon claims are so patently absurd on their face that at some point we have to demand some accountability from those who claim to believe them.
 
JayUtah said:
Dunno, that strikes me as the kind of guy who probably would have done something horrific regardless of the excuse. But I've maintained for decades now that conspiracy theories aren't benign. Truth and facts matter.
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It's weird. My eldest is 19 and youngest not far behind. Functionally both adults now. But I have always encouraged questioning everything. On those occasions over the years when I have been stumped, my response has always been the same. "I don't know. Let's go find out." It has been a fun trip.

But this is different. The kids were a 2 yo and 8 months infant.

When my two were that age my priority was nappies and the changing and disposal of same. The kids had no opinion of anything beyond my nappy is full, change me.
 
Gord_in_Toronto said:
I suppose we should not be too surprised that it has come to thi:

California dad killed his kids over QAnon and 'serpent DNA' conspiracy theories, feds say

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...ds-over-qanon-serpent-dna-conspiracy-n1276611
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Both the linked article and the CNN article have him saying that he knew killing his children was wrong.

Coleman said of the killings that “he knew it was wrong, but it was the only course of action that would save the world,” according to the affidavit.
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I may be misremembering, but doesn't a statement like that impact a potential insanity defense? One of the factors is not realizing at the time of the crime that your actions are wrong?
I remember reading an article on the application of the legal system in a superhero setting.
Vigilante tries to kill several Senators due to the delusional belief that they're plotting to overthrow the government - Not a valid defense, since it wouldn't be justified to kill them, even if it were true.
Villain believes the world is a fictional construct and he isn't actually hurting anyone because they aren't real - Valid defense.
 
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