Prostitution with 16

[ponderingturtle]

I dunno. If legitimized, then I don't see a problem with it assuming they Are afforded the same rights and protections as any other employee in any other business. Of course self-employment is fine, but if you look at it as a legitimate business then you're essentially denying anyone in that field the advantages that come with working as part of an organization: things like group insurance, access to better quality materials, larger advertising budget, and similar things.

Well they could form a union for that.

 

[ponderingturtle]

You are right of course, and perhaps I went overboard with "really like" Japanese approach. It looks at the problem -- women abused by pimps, -- and takes a sledgehammer to it instead of a scalpel. A more nuanced approach such as one you describe would benefit women more if done right -- but is also vulnerable to corruption. Organized crime and human trafficking are much more likely to latch onto legal (and theoretically regulated) prostitution than onto self-employment only.

Why? They can get involved in either side. The advantage of brothels is that it centralizes them for inspection. Institute random weekly inspections really keep them on their toes.

 

[AvalonXQ]

Well they could form a union for that.

I'm not sure that would work. Assuming any union representative ever actually does anything on behalf of one of its members, that would run afoul of the law, would it not?
I don't see how you can have a union without having third party interference in some aspect of the business.

 

[Mirrorglass]

I really like Japanese approach:

<snip stuff irrelevant to the point>

I'm sure you do.

 

[Beerina]

Since stealing a TV is illegal, it should also be illegal to buy one?

Yes. See, the shady underworld of fencing stolen goods is a horrible life for those involved. Therefore Best Buy and ABC Warehouse and others should not be allowed to get involved in selling TVs.

 

[Mark6]

Why? They can get involved in either side.

When regulations are involved, Guido the Don can (at least in theory) bribe the regulator into signing that Mr. Guido meets every regulation imaginable and is a model businessman. When there is no regulator to bribe and nothing to sign -- he has no legitimate business to be anywhere near the woman, -- it is much harder for Guido the Don to maintain control. Not impossible, but harded.

The advantage of brothels is that it centralizes them for inspection. Institute random weekly inspections really keep them on their toes.

Which falls under my definition of "done well". As I said, Japan took a sledgehammer to pimp problem. It's not the best solution, but it sure works for its intended purpose.

 

[GreyArea]

what do you think? is 16 ok or should it be 18 or 21?

In the U.S., the age of majority is 18 for most things.

So, should the johns be carded? That seems like a detail few would think of, but an 18-year-old minimum limit for them seems noncontroversial.

But just thinking about this a little more, so many other questions arise.

Would age limits be the same for young male customers as it would be for the small number of young women who want these services?

Would all forms of prostitution be allowed, or only the more easily regulated venues such as brothels? Would regulations distinguish between call girls, escorts, and street prostitutes? How about regulations for where these businesses can be located? Not within 100 meters of a church or school, for example?

Should prostitutes be licensed? Would they have to document their citizenship status? Would there be the same laws for male prostitutes as for female prostitutes? If they are freelancers, how do we know that the income they report on their tax returns is accurate?

Do you keep out pimps and madams? How? What kinds of labor protections would be guaranteed? Can these workers be organized? Could there be chains of franchises across the country, or would this violate the Mann Act? Do the workers get pensions or are they supposed to make their own retirement arrangements? Can these businesses advertise? Where and where not (such as public airwaves)?

Would states have to prepare for such decriminalization by increasing the staff and budgets for their health departments? How much would decriminalization or legalization save on police budgets?

What would be the unintended consequences for other, currently legal businesses in the sex industry? For example, would strip clubs move toward more debauchery in order to compete?

Would married johns be liable for adultery? How would this affect divorce proceedings?

See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COYOTE

 

[Cainkane1]

No,it shouldn't be legal at all,what he nass is wrong with you people?

I thought we were supposed to be better than animals.

Should rape be legal? Why not? Gotta copulate right? We're just animals anyways.

Prostitution should be legal and rape should remain a illegal felony. I don't understand where your comming from??? If a woman wants to exchange sex for money what business is it of yours?

 

[Hellbound]

When regulations are involved, Guido the Don can (at least in theory) bribe the regulator into signing that Mr. Guido meets every regulation imaginable and is a model businessman. When there is no regulator to bribe and nothing to sign -- he has no legitimate business to be anywhere near the woman, -- it is much harder for Guido the Don to maintain control. Not impossible, but harded.

Which falls under my definition of "done well". As I said, Japan took a sledgehammer to pimp problem. It's not the best solution, but it sure works for its intended purpose.

I dunno, your objections to a regulatory model seem just as applicable to the Japanese model. What's to prevetn Guido (or, in this case, just the mean-crazy guy whose pimping you) from insuring (through threats or blackmail) that the woman is very insistent that it was her own idea, for herself? And with a company type eneterprise, beyond just regulatory inspections and such, there are the required business and employee records, and all the other things that make a legitimate business hard to fake.

In all seriousness, can you think of that many legal businesses that have anything remotely like that? Where employees are held against their will? With the exception of some contracted jobs I can't think of one off-hand (and even contractual things are usually breakable, just with a penalty fo some sort).

 

[GrandMasterFox]

DC does not live in US. He may have been talking about his country (Switzerland?).

Also, IIRC the guy you are talking about was allowed to work, but quit because he was getting maybe one client a week.

I admit I haven't followed the case or anything, you might be right on that one.

 

[Mark6]

I In all seriousness, can you think of that many legal businesses that have anything remotely like that? Where employees are held against their will? With the exception of some contracted jobs I can't think of one off-hand (and even contractual things are usually breakable, just with a penalty fo some sort).

Anything that employs illegal immigrants.

Which by definition is not "legal business", just pretends to be one.

I dunno, your objections to a regulatory model seem just as applicable to the Japanese model. What's to prevetn Guido (or, in this case, just the mean-crazy guy whose pimping you) from insuring (through threats or blackmail) that the woman is very insistent that it was her own idea, for herself? .

Um, the woman calls police?

If she is an illegal immigrant, or mean-crazy guy has some other blackmail goods on her, she may be reluctant to call police (I did say it's not impossible to be a pimp), but at least he does not have a bought "inspection passed and signed".

But we are getting into too many hypotheticals. I already admitted that properly regulated business with honest regulators is a better deal -- and that Japan's law may well be intended to subtly discourage women from long-term prostitution.

 

[Skeptic]

I just wanted to say the hopes I had from reading the thread title before clicking on it were dashed.

 

[manxman]

Prostitution should be legal and rape should remain a illegal felony. I don't understand where your comming from??? If a woman wants to exchange sex for money what business is it of yours?

THE DIFFENCE IS.

A woman can do what she chooses, a child however needs to be protected from itself.

 

[DC]

DC does not live in US. He may have been talking about his country (Switzerland?).

Also, IIRC the guy you are talking about was allowed to work, but quit because he was getting maybe one client a week.

indeed i was talking about Swistzerland. because posters and i talked as if there are only woman in that bussines well thats the impression i had.

 

[IMST]

My personal political take on it is, legalize, use local age of consent, and regulate the everloving **** out of it. ID checks for everyone, brothel or similar venue mandatory for everyone's safety, condom use and medical checks mandatory. That kind of thing.

 

[DC]

My personal political take on it is, legalize, use local age of consent, and regulate the everloving **** out of it. ID checks for everyone, brothel or similar venue mandatory for everyone's safety, condom use and medical checks mandatory. That kind of thing.

Clients or Prostitutes?

 

[IMST]

Both.

 

[ponderingturtle]

I'm not sure that would work. Assuming any union representative ever actually does anything on behalf of one of its members, that would run afoul of the law, would it not?
I don't see how you can have a union without having third party interference in some aspect of the business.

Look into the freelancers union.

 

[DC]

Both.

Discretion is a big marketing point for a brothels.
Its not usual to even mention your last name (or real first name), nor does anyone ask the client, also the Prostitutes dont use their real name, only their boss knows that.

 

[ponderingturtle]

When regulations are involved, Guido the Don can (at least in theory) bribe the regulator into signing that Mr. Guido meets every regulation imaginable and is a model businessman. When there is no regulator to bribe and nothing to sign -- he has no legitimate business to be anywhere near the woman, -- it is much harder for Guido the Don to maintain control. Not impossible, but harded.

And why does having legitimate business make it easier to do illegitimate business?